I’ve seen a lot of pasture analysis. But surprised to see no one had considered the wood savings that pasture provides. Not only pasture has slightly better food to wood ratio, but also provides a tent for herders to drop off. The wood savings is also very significant to account imo. So here I have plotted Food Collection Rate vs Food to Wood ratio for pasture and then compared with some other civs that has bonus for either of the two.
My best conclusion is that Pasture is a better version of Khmer farms - both in Collection Rate and Food to Wood ratio.
EDIT :
2 Likes
This makes it the only civ to improve both collection speed and convertion rate.
When considering the working time required to get the wood so the overall productivity of villagers, how does it end up ?
What would be actually more telling if we tested or calculated how much food you can produce with a feudal eco at each timestamp. Khitans have way better food availability thx to both pastures being cheaper than 2 farms (less vills on wood needed to sustain placing pastures) and directly by less carry capacity.
Especially in the early stages of the Pasture transition there will be a huge advantage as it first needs to overcome the food supply needed to produce vills. The advantage most people show here isn’t even close to the real advantage of Khitans, cause this “food availability” factor is practically actually more impactful than the sheer income. That’s also what makes Khmer Farms so powerful mostly.
I’m pretty sure that in this Khitans are by far the best. Teutons can place farms earlier, but the availabilty is normal and Poles need to place the first farms more away and have to place extra folwarks later, so they will also struggle to keep up with Khitans who wil just be able to have more vills on food at any time (given also that poles need to get horsecollar first).
Pastures just have no downside and that’s what I don’t like. There is a reason why the OG devs with most stuff they did almost always gave a civ specific bonus/unit a compensational downside that could be tried to exploit by the opponent.
1 Like
- The second one is Khmer.
Need to do the math. Great idea btw. Will be a bit time consuming but I will start as soon as I get free time.
Count the villager-time to gather the wood price of a farm or pasture. Add to the time to fully build then empty the farm/pasture. Divide the food yield by the sum of the time, and done.
Also, is it really fair that Slavs and Khmers have fully upgraded Hussars on top of their farming bonus?
In the original game, only the Teutons had a farming bonus and it wasn’t even about collection speed and they were restricted to Scout Cavalry. The Japanese had a fishing bonus but were restricted with a bad Scout line.
1 Like
I would expect Khitans will have one of the top food eco even after pasture nerf.
1 Like
That will be covered by food to wood ratio.
Absolutely agree. I have no idea why balance team came up with this idea. Well, there is a bot downside when you are floating 60 to 99 wood, and when you don’t have a 4x4 space but have 3x3 space.
That’s what it makes time consuming. Now I need to consider all the lumbercamp techs as well.
- Maybe Khmer can lose Husbandry with Elephant speed being compensated.
They are. In fact, they are even better than Khmer.
Or we can still keep the ratio but double the initial wood invested and final food collected.
Slavs have a fairly poor archery range. Missing thumb ring, hand cannons, and bracers means if they want a good backline, they either need an ally or need to go siege (which has pretty poor mobility). Slavs may have great hussar spam, but their backline options are lacking. So Slavs don’t have great units to pair with their hussars.
Khmers arguably are more problematic with their FU hussar spam, as they have good backline options to pair with it.
Pastures are the Khitan’s eco bonus (their only eco bonus now), though they do seem to have a downside in being more snipable. I’ve seen archer masses kill pastures reasonably quickly, and killing pastures would hurt more than killing farms. Every pasture destroyed is effectively 2 farms lost, and the only help you get to prevent that is 20% more hp compared to farms. But as a civ eco bonus, pastures don’t need to be equal to farms.
I just realized using Food to wood ratio is not a real indicator as pasture workers are also work faster. So I calculated wood consumption per minute instead.
1 Like
