Anti-ram bonus damage

Rams usually act as damage sponges to all of ranged attacks with some exceptions such as Ranged melee, Siege, and Chu Ku Nu (and Kipchaks to a lesser extent)
Chu Ku Nu deal 4 damage to rams per arrows turning Rams from a unit that protect against archers (either by garrisoning or abusing their targeting) Into a units that gets hard countered Chu Ku Nu and it doesn’t even makes what about the being fired from a chu-ku-nu would allow a arrow to pierce a ram? Get rid of the 0 melee attack it makes no sense and is unnecessary Chu Ko Nu still hold up very well against high pierce armor targets and hold up against Ram/Skirm better than any other Archer. I purpose giving bonus damage to Handcannons and Scorpions as it make sense from both a realism and balance perspective Handcannons are anti infantry that struggle to out compete Arbs in it own niche not one of their advantages is that they fair better against high pierce armor (anti-archer) due to their 16 attacks dealing extra damage. Scorpions are Self explanatory, It shoots a giant ■■■■■■ arrow of course a few planks are not going to stop it

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Actually, I like the idea of HC have 0 melee attack
It could open some possibilities against the Arbalester meta

Just a side note, even units with proper ram bonus damage, if they have less than 3 they do nothing against capped rams, and less than 4 nothing against siege ram.
Capped ram has +1 ram armour and siege ram +2.
So basically the only ranged (non siege/boat) unit in the game with decent bonus damage against rams is the Elite Conquistador (6 bonus damage), and the Conquistador (4 bonus damage).
Slingers and E.Janissary have 3 but they can do more than 1 damage only against battering/capped rams, against siege they only do 1 dmg.

On the other hand we have Mangudai, Chu-ko-Nu and Kipchak which do a lot of damage, whether by bonus against Siege and not rams, or because of melee arrows as OP pointed out.

So stones or gunpowder do almost nothing, but magic arrows destroy them.
Super sad (or funny) imho.


Trebuchets have the ram armour class but no negative melee armour, so it means that units with anti-ram bonuses do better against those than kipchaks chu ko nu. Also UUs belong to only one civ while hand cannons are given to 20 of them so you can’t really start making them anti-ram and expect it to remain balanced for everyone.

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Yeah this whole ranged units destroying ram thing needs to go.
It’s basically only useful for griefing.


Intentionally draggin out already lost games just to annoy the opponent.

But neither Vikings nor Berbers have that

Whar are you talking about? ^^ Just radomly place civ names here?

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Yes but only when unpacked for some reason.

Its makes sense that things like for Rams to be good against arrows but be susceptible to armor piercing attacks or heavy siege

It’s ok if it is units like scorps that are slow-moving and heavily countered by other siege units.
As these aren’t as useful against a lot of other lategame tools like the mentioned other siee units and hussars.
But I would be careful with units like mangonels, bbc and to some extend even hc. HC aren’t a problem yet as they still kinda suck, but once HC have a competitive state in the game they shouldn’t be able to counter rams over walls. That would just lead to the same prob as we currently have with kipchak and cho-ko-nu.
I would prefer to make HC more generally competitive than adding this weird bonus to rams.

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Besides, I think it makes sense for a Hand Cannon to do no damage to Rams in this era. Similarly why (TIL, from above posts) it makes sense that Slingers stop doing bonus damage to Siege Rams. At some point the Rams are just too fortified for stones or whatever HCs shoot to actually do anything meaningful to them.

It would be Okay for heavy scorpion which is expensive and weak to other seige have bonus vs Ram.

But HC bonus vs Ram is heavy nerf to Ram that HC have access to more than half of civ and it don’t need huge investment. And Halb+Ram push is only way to beat Turks/Bohemians or Spanish by infantry +seige civ like Celts or Slavs in closed map. Civ matchup like Turks vs Celts/Slavs become even more one-sided if HC can beat Ram.

Yes, everyone is already raving about how OP HandCanons are. Just imagine the horror that could be unleashed if HC were better against Siege Rams than Arbalesters are, in addition to all the other units that are already countered better by HC than by Arbs :upside_down_face: :upside_down_face: :upside_down_face:

On a serious note, I can’t think of any specific balance problems that would arise if HC had 6 anti-ram damage.

Personally I suspect that the dev who assigned the magnitudes of anti-ram bonus damage was unaware of the work of the dev who gave Siege Rams 3 ram armour.

Just look at andre2i or Rubenstock’s stream and you will get it

I don’t play this type of game. If you have to say something meaningful just say it.

And before you do that you should consider this:

I only stated that it is imo too easy to grief with these unit because of that mechanic. I never said that it would be the only way to grief.

So I was saying that because rn those two streamers managed two perfectly stall each other. So their game has been drawing out for hours. Ngl I’m surprised you didn’t hear about it by now

Link please? fffiiiillleerr