Balance From a Treaty Player!

Theres some Huge Balance Issues with Civ’s like Japan!

For an Example they have the ability to summon 3 Diamyo each boosting the combat ability of their units in combination with one shogun who boosts the hitpoints of units. On top of this Japan is not short of Shipments that also boost unit attack abilities and additionally a Wonder that boosts their attack ability and a Shipment that Makes Enemy units near their monks slower and less effective in battle.

All of these combined with Japans lower villager count make a Massive army much larger that some under powered civ in Treaty games ( spain for example are under powered they get missonairies that help with combat ability but these units do not fight cannot spawn units and take 10 pop away from your fighting army so you only have 90 pop to make units with which seems balanced! but not agaisnt a civ like japan) with a TON of buffs and 4 mobile bases that create units in batches of TEN!!! on top of this Diamyo have a shipment that makes them extremely hard to kill so sniping them while they are surrounded by over powered units and the Monk heroes that make your dragoons weaker and slower around them is almost impossible when a really skilled player is using them.

The Fact that the shogun can spawn 10! Fire arrows or mortars extremely fast while having a ton of buffs and having high hitpoints is totally broken. Also fire arrows serve as both anti inft and anti cannons so 10 of them is just insane.

I realize treaty isnt as important for you guys, but please consider making some balance changes so us treaty players can enjoy the game as well!

We need balances for treaty but this is irrelevance. Japan in treaty rather need a buff.


i would say they need a rework, not so much a buff.

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Why do they need a buff? Please explain.

economy is pretty bad, they lag a lot of central units you want for treaty like skirms and art.

that being said tho i think they are a little too “Banzai”, hense i want a bit of a rework.

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Economy isn’t great but they aren’t as bad as Lakota. Good players get really good booms with them 1600-1800 score by 40 minutes. And their military is so cheesy and overpowered.

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1800 would be a bad score for japan.

i think the faction is cheesy and would wanna tone it down, but there are many factions that perform better.

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Totally agree, i´m a Japanese main and treaty player mostly and i´ve been asking for a buff since the release xd

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Cheesy in what way? i mean, what´s cheesy about them?

As Jonasnee8581 said, their eco is one of the worst in the game (if we don´t consider every shrine with full cows and brit team card), the reason is actually their 75 vill pop, wich is about a 80%-81% of standard good eco (russia) and they have the shrines but without cows they are just like having the 2 factories instead, only when they have cows and brit team card they can be nearly as good as russia for example. Then, after having just 80% eco, their units are not overpowered, they are strong, but in order to be strong they are quite dependent from their bonus, i think the problem most players make when comparing japan is taking their fully buffed-aura stats as their pre-aura stats, i mean, not even with their auras and buffs they are OP, but if you take that away from them they start to be quite bad and underperforming, and it´s not so hard to take away their bonuses, just chase the daimyo, snipe their wonders with a sneaky attack, separate their army and their daimyo auras cannot be everywhere, plus the bad eco, plus, you say they have 125 military pop, and as with many things that players complain about japan, they just see the positive effects, not the negative side, so if you have the 4 daimyos, it´s taking you away 16 pop so you only have 109 military pop and 80 vill pop so it´s really not good, and the bonuses that japan NEEDS in order to not be mediocre, they are destroyable, killable, eraseable, not like european that cannot be erased because of just cards and techs. Then, their 10 train units is to compensate for their slow training time, it´s one of the slowest actually, and i rather pick faster training time than more trained units any day. And there´s a lot more of thinks but i think you get the idea, i kinda exceed my original extension idea xd

They lack anti infantry (Yumi doesn’t have enough multiplier vs heavy infantry) the only good artillery they have is mortaru, flaming arrows are one of the worse artillery in treaty. Economy is not strong enough to maintain because units are expensive. Lack anti artillery. Against artillery heavy civs (most of euro civs) you have less chances.

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Japan got hit hard this patch with the cap on livestock on shrines. They do not need another nerf. Havnt played them yet but they may actually need a buff.

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Daimyos don’t stack.

Generally, Japan is pretty bad in treaty, and they can only keep up if someone feeds them cows (like British). Their larger army is also their undoing, since their economy is one of the worst in the late game, so you can easily out macro Japan players by just spamming units.

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Yeah :frowning: i always wanted that they could stack, that way it´s actually worth it to have all three, instead of +10% attack would be +33.1% attack xd (i´ve been thinking in a lot of changes to japan late game lately, maybe i do a topic on them someday)

U don’t have much idea how to play treaty , that why u calling japan eco good and army overpower. They don’t have effective heavy infantry counter and their flaming arrows straight up lose in artillery war vs culverina , and spamming their yamabuse will drain u super hard . U can’t survive as japan for long vs any good player playing euro civ .

And u already mad so many wrong claims in post . Daimyo don’t boost army separately , u have 1 daimyo or 3 , u will have same army boost , much needed one .

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Exactly, I 100% agree

Specially this xd