Well let me make this simple. Since you’re concerned about late game balance,
An imperial voltigeur/needle gunner with counter infantry rifling will do 99 damage to heavy infantry for every 3 seconds (without any cards).
An imperial longbowman with the current 1.25x vs HI does 84 damage for every 3 seconds. With +0.25, They do 102 damage for every 3 secs. It seems decent since they can’t kite.
With a 2.3x multiplier however, +0.35 in each age as you say, They do about 156 damage. Well, I guess you don’t want that.
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I was trying out LB firing animation and it seems the first shot is still 1.5 but yes it hard to kite with them, they just feel clunky to use but, the stats seems fine on paper.
French and Dutch skirms have base 36 full upgrades so 108 vs Hv INF to LBs 85.
Another factor no one is mentioning is the damage longbows do vs skirms (68) and goons (136) per 3 seconds (before resistances) compared to other skirms (36 and 72 respectively) and even vs cav and artillery is also higher cause you get 2 shots instead of 1.
And having 26 range is pretty good.
Also wood isn’t a problem for british treaty with south sea bubble and factories.
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Yes, Thanks for mentioning it. But the discussion was about how well longbows perform against HI in particular and not skirms and goons. Giving them a small multiplier vs HI doesn’t seem that bad.
And what I’m saying is that the LB power is spread out in other areas making it a unique unit. Not saying that it is balanced well vs the META but it add divesity to the game.
Personally I’d prefer if Yeoman made the bonus at least 1.5x vs HvInf or something similar as to not conflict with supremacy.
There are multiple counters to HvInf not just LB; cannons and even grenadiers to some extent.
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Damn. 156 is too high. You’re right: I don’t want that. How much damage does the Skirmisher do with cards? Germans have a team cavalry attack card that also buffs light infantry and French have a card for buffing team ranged infantry attack. I forgot the value for Cassadors… their main strength is their ranged resistance, right?
Are you sure about this one?
True, that. It’s as much as a falconet or horse artillery.
South Sea bubble is good on treaty. However, factories aren’t that good if that’s your only source of wood… and they can be destroyed. Distributivism if sent early helps. For a 40 minute treaty, that’s 3000 wood. If the game lasts another 20 minutes, that’s 4500 wood… and can’t be destroyed.
Grenadiers have been a crappy unit for the most part. The DE changes are yet to determine whether this has made them competitive. For a 2 pop unit, they are not good enough. They would be good if they were a 1 pop unit.
Picture this: If your enemy got Musketeers and Culverins, the Musketeers will kill your Cavalry, the Culverins will destroy your Artillery. As the British, your only competitive counter to this army composition would be 13 Cherokee riflemen or Jaegers when ageing up through the Mercenary Contractor… OR you can outspam them with Musketeers thanks to a superior economy.
I just tested it out in game. Turns out I was wrong about skirms doing 99 damage to HI without cards, bad at math lol.
French Voltigeurs do 108 damage with the only Team ranged attack card, without it’s 99.
Don’t complicate the unit tags. Light Infantry aka Shock Infantry are units like coyote runners, ERK, chimu runners and rattan shields. Skirmishers are simply “Infantry”. So the german team cav attack card does not have any effect on skirms. So, German Needle Gunners only do 99 damage.
True, They have a high ranged resistance of 45%. Apparently for some reason, the Imperial upgrade for cassadors seems to be bugged. That upgrade scales with their veteran status and the cassadors end up having 39 damage instead of 36 (with all the cards sent). So total damage they do to HI is 117 atm. But they should do 108 without the bug.
And finally the Dutch skirmishers do 108 damage to HI with all the infantry cards sent.
Yes, That’s actually true. They’re good against skirms and goons than they’re against Heavy Infantry. The rate of fire is a factor to it.
Generally if your factories get destroyed in treaty you were already losing (cheese not included) and the british get cows which have 4 cards early so an extra card used early is tough to do
if you lost the artillery fight with any civ Skirms won’t help either
Are you forgetting the advanced arsenal upgrades or just not including them?
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Yeah I forgot to include it. It’s included now.
I might have forgotten to include the advanced arsenal.