Buff Walls: Masonry, Architecture Affect

At times rushes are very successful even against fortified walls - I suggest that techs such as Masonry and Architecture affect walls to increase their(walls) ability to keep the enemy at bay for a short time longer with increased HP and defense.

Fortified walls already stop castle age pushes dead in their tracks.

It’s by design that imperial age siege is a able to go through them though, the game would be super campy if that weren’t the case.


Rams/Petards do well enough against fortified walls, even thick sets of walls - yes they are defendable and walls are stackable, but it’s easy to break through the usual 1-3 layers quickly- note the imperial siege will still plow through them with these buffs, it simply saves a little time if the enemy decides that walls are better to destroy than to simply cut trees - and provides a little more stone to wall the treeline rather than focus on 10 wall layers on a single thin stretching path

What if we have 3d wall upgrade?
We have 3 upgrades for towers, why dot have thitd one for walls in Imperial?

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That would be good too

Then they will have to make another bunch of graphics for the new upgraded walls. I don’t think that’s going to happen.

My point was precisely that fortifications/siege matchups flips in imperial age by design. So no it wouldn’t make sense to have an imperial age wall upgrade.

AoE2 has extremely strong fortifications in the first 3 ages for an rts game. Wishing for them to remain proportionalitely as strong in the last age would render the game an absolute campfest.


I doubt that, even in castle going against fortified walls you can break through with ease using the right composition. It’ll be same in imperial, it’s simply that in imperial it’s more straightforward as to what people build. With an upgrade you may buy yourself a few minutes of time or no time at all depending on how the enemy decides to go through or around your walls.

Game is already boring when players are full walled at minute 5 and you wanna buff stone walls ? No thanks :joy:


I hate walling. I think camping games are boring. I like action from the start. AoE II is already a pretty slow start compared to other games. It is not needed to even prolonge the game even more. If something needs to change to walls, it is a nerf, not a buff. I think of higher cost, less HP, less armor, … Enough possibilities.

:joy: sounds like patience problems rather than a game problem

Compared to other similar games, AoE II has a pretty slow start. It takes a while for the game gets going. With even stronger walls, it will be even more slow.

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I am STRONGLY in favor of this proposal. It makes no sense that Masonry and Architecture doesn’t effect walls and gates. I am also sure that many players think it does. At least I frantically researched Masonry every time I saw the enemy coming for years, until I realized it didn’t have any effect at all.

It is especially confusing if you know that the Byzantines civ bonus, which increases HP for all buildings, DOES apply to walls.

HOWEVER, I also agree this would make walls too strong, and they are already overpowered. The game shouldn’t be made boring. So I think the solution is simple. Yes, Masonry and Architecture should affect walls, but the walls should be nerfed in the first place.

I think the most elegant solution would be like this. Now, Stone Walls melee/pierce/building armor is 8/10/16, and Fortified Walls have 12/12/24. Masonry and Architecture would add 1/1/3 to that each time. So just reduce the standard armors to 7/9/13 and 10/10/18, respectively. Fully upgraded walls would still have the same armor, but without Masonry/Architecture, their armor would be weaker than it is now. I would keep the HP as it is now though, otherwise walls would be too weak for civs that don’t have Masonry/Architecture.

In other words, walls without Masonry/Architecture would have less armor than now, walls with Masonry/Architecture would have the same armor as now. Walls without Masonry/Architecture would have the same HP as now, Walls with Masonry/Architecture would have more HP than now.

You could argue that this would make Chinese walls extremely strong if the player researches Masonry AND the Great Wall tech. That’s true, but I don’t think that would be game-braking. The 10% extra HP is an effect that’s too limited if it doesn’t come with extra armor compared to the current situation. And by the time Imperial Age arrives (Architecture), you have enough options to tear them down.

It would be a small buffs for Palisade Walls as well, which is especially relevant for the Goths, but I think by Castle Age they are so weak that the extra armor and HP doesn’t even matter anymore.

What do you think?

Yes, but also no- I wouldn’t mind a nerf so long as the end result is slightly stronger than current walls