Byzantines is the New Mongols

There is no point in choosing the Mongols when the Byzantines can produce all Mongol unique units with full upgrades…

Now the Mongols is the most pointless civilization in the game to play
The Byzantines is the New Mongol civ that can do much better than the Mongols…
How could the developers be so horrible at decision-making?
You guys could have made new units that represent Cumans for the Byzantines…
Instead of going lazy and making all existing civs pointless by giving their unique units to the Byzantines…
This is madness!!!


The number of mercenaries you can build are pretty limited.
The Byzantine army will always mostly be Byzantine units.


Your point is somewhat limited.
The Mongol Keshik is already a situational unit.
It is the worst Lancer in the game.
And giving it in the Feudal age of the Byzantines is just pure madness.
There is no point playing the Mongols when Byzantines have aqueducts, unique units more mechanics etc.
And the Mangudai is already a useless unit.
But still, Byzantines get it. The same goes for other civs…
About Hui Hui Pao, the Mongols get it later and rarely.
But the Byzantines can get it like nothing lol

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It’s impressive how they maximize the use of history especially having the Byzantines utilize mercenaries. And I don’t even play AoE4 tho.


I w/ill say again devs make the Byzantines more care , Otttomans and HRE are sucks.

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Yep, they are also horrible civs.
Very few unique units.

I disagree about keshik it’s a very good unit especially in number which is easy to reach thanks to the stone double production. Being worse than knight don’t make them bad or maybe you consider malian sofas to be garbage. With the DLC the french knight will end up to the 3rd strongest kinght 1V1 as cataphract and gilded knight are straight up better one on one and yet you will still see french get their knights out vs these civs and almost everyone else.

Also note that so far people have spammed mercenary longbows and strelsy.
However I agree about the huihui pao the khaganate palace is a joke you should be able to chose what you want in exchange of stone for exemple.
The foreign engineering compagny seems to be a bit too good you get nest of bees and the huihui pao but also the royal canon not the normal one, the version from the french school of artillery and you pay this with a ressource you harvest from your farms. Combined with the other mercenaries it seems that late game byzantine will give a very similar impression to english with pre-nerf enclosure as you will get access to gold units without trade or securing big golds just with your farms.


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The mongol play COMPLETELY differently from byzantines. It’s a very fallacious argument you are making. There are so many things that mongol have and byzantine don’t:

-Khan hero
-Oovoo producing stone
-Double unit production
-No need to build housing
-Nomad / Moving buildings
-Plunder gold bonus
-Good trade
-Keshik can be massed in feudal.
-Improved tech, such as the +1 range on springalds which gives them the springals with most range in the game.
-Many other unique tech such as Steppe lancers, Raid Bounty, Yam Network, Receiving Stone in Trade.
-Mongol landmarks such as Silver Tree, Kurultai and Khanagate palace.

Byzantine need to spent OIL to get mercenary, it’s not a resources that you can get in huge quantity, especially in early game since you need to build farms first to get it… You also need to choose the mercenary contract so you don’t have access to all unique units in one game. You need to select WHICH ONE you get. You only get mongol units with the Eastern contract. You will definitely not be able to mass Keshik early in feudal like the mongols can.

Mongol is a early-game agressive civ,

Byzantine is a late game boomy civ.

The only thing I agree with this thread is that they could probably add 1 extra unique unit to HRE as they did in the past (when adding kheshik, ghazi raider and gulam in a patch). Hopefully this will happen in the future (lets hope for season 7). But its not a huge issue for me I think they did an amazing job with the dlc so far.


I think mercenary should cost gold/minute and when you run out of gold they should start losing health

While I do agree that Byzantines shouldn’t be producing all Mongol unique units, it does at least still make sense to have a Mongol unit part of the roster of mercenary units of the Byzantines because the Empire of Nicaea, which was a rump state of the Byzantines, did had Mongols in the army. I was just now, reading an article about what were the ethnic composition of Byzantine mercenaries. Here’s the link:

Byzantine Army: The World’s Most Formidable Multi-Ethnic Force


Regarding the use of UU of another civs, both civs still are very different:

Mongols.- First of all, they initially “Lacked” the current effect of their Landmark “Khaganate Palace”. His new effect of “vassal units” was a novelty for season 4. Before that they were already special for several points, which they still have and which Marc4770 already revealed:

“Byzantine Mercenaries”

I like their system, in fact it seems inspired by AoE3. I also like that for balance reasons, and to preserve the uniqueness of each civ, the obtaining of mercenaries is limited and randomly per map, and the mercenaries that are civ officers are limited to 3 options out of 3. In fact , is a system very similar to or inspired by the mercenaries in the AoE3 cantina:

  • Specific mercenary units: based on mercenaries that the historical civ had (Port Cards).
  • Mercenaries from the area; units that vary based on the map, and others that are completely random (Cantinas).

I also like how they use the Gaia trading post as a town on the map to recruit mercenaries from. I remember that a Venice Concept also suggested something similar, now it is very possible that this mechanic could be canon.

Future Civ and Mechanics:

Well, the Byzantine mercenary system will have many possibilities in the future: some civs also employ mercenaries… well, mainly Italian:

  • Genoese
  • Venice
  • Tuscany
  • Milan
  • Hungary

Of course these would have their own unique mercenary units, such as “Condotta MenatArm”, “Broken Lance”. It would be interesting if, like AoE3, they start creating “specifically mercenary” units to be used as just that, as mercenaries. At least the best known in Europe was the Swiss ############### (p1keman censored?)
On the other hand, in the future, if they release more civilizations for the base game, it would be appealing if they change the rooster of Byzantine mercenary base units, especially for some of the best-known ones that obtained mercenaries:

  • Longbow archer (II) → Almogavar (Aragon)
  • Landsknecht (III)—> Genoese Crossbowman (Genoese)
  • Streltzy (IV) → Venetian handcannoner (Venetian)