Chinese language

His descendants didn’t divide it.
Look go and read reliable history books.
Maybe today the Inner Mongolian’s are called ethnic minorities, but it has not been like that. Why would they build the Great Wall of China? To separate the Chinese from the Steppe people, usually the Hunnic Confederation people such as Tatars, the Mongols, Naiman’s, etc so on. I know what you learned is a modern thing, but you clearly missing a lot of knowledge. on this matter.

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yes, similar to cantonese
lets think about Tang Poems 300

but some 「cantonese haters 」they dont accept this answer

anyways , i dont care, just a RTS game

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To be honest, it is unrealistic to make the unit voices “historical accurate” in such a game.
The Chinese in AOE 4 represents China from Tang to Ming dynasty, that’s hundreds of years! Official Chinese changes a lot in such a long period, the official Chinese language in Tang is classified as Middle Chinese while the Ming’s is Modern Chinese.
At this moment, we can only guess how Chinese language sound like at that time based on limited materials, it’s too hard to make convincing unit voices with Chinese language at those times.

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Yuan Dynasty definitely used Old Mandarin as its administrative language among the Han (you can infer this from the fact that all rhyme tables and phangs-pa inscriptions made in this period describe what we call Old Mandarin today), though whether they extended this to the Nam (the term for former Song folks) I do not know. The upper eschelons of the Yuan administration were definitely learning Old Mandarin as the language of choice when it came to talking with the locals.

In turn it would probably look like Tang (Early Middle Chinese - recontructed) → Song (Late Middle Chinese - reconstructed) → Yuan (Old Mandarin - reconstructed) → Ming (Mandarin with the later sound changes like ki/ci → ji or the -m/-n merger reversed). If you wanted to pick a modern language which preserved the most of Tang dynasty language, you would pick Vietnamese, not Cantonese. As the former preserved the Middle Chinese vocabulary better.

Given a word like 石, it would then go something like: Tang (jiayk /d͡ʑiajk̚/, no tone, abruptly stopped) and Song (jhiak /ɖʐʰiak̚/, no tone, abruptly stopped), compared to Cantonese (sehk /sɛːk̚/, low level tone), Standard Chinese (shh /ʂʐ̩/, rising tone) and Vietnamese (thayk /tʰajk̟̚/, falling tone). You can see that Cantonese has the ending -k but is otherwise completely different, Standard Chinese preserves the palatalised start sh- but is otherwise again different while Vietnamese swaps s/j for t (which is a well-known sound change, Sino-Vietnamese 3 is “tam”, while everyone else would call it sam/san/…) but is otherwise remarkably close. Anyway, that’s just an abbendum for the folks who beat drums about how Tang should speak Cantonese or Mandarin or Korean… all of these languages changed a fair lot since then and none is really true to the reconstructions.
Mandarin has the j/zh (two different kinds of ch) distinction that Tang/Song had but doesn’t exist in Cantonese. Cantonese or Hakka keep the endings but change almost everything else. Shanghainese retains voiced sounds (notice how both Tang and Song start with a J, which does not exist in any other Chinese language as all the rest lost J for Ch sounds), but it also doesn’t have the endings.
And you could make a case like this for basically any of them. :wink:

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I will be appreciated if devs use reconstructed Middle Chinese or Old Mandarin. But I think it is impossible to find any voice actor capable of this.

In this case, I prefer having modern Mandarin for unit voices, I understand what they are saying at least.

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Sorry to say. The Sui and Tang is Chinese bloodline (han people’s bloodline), though with partly xianbei blood. And yes, Qing is non-Chinese bloodline(Manchu).

Yuan Dynasty used Qudum Mongγol bičig and Khevtee Dörvöljin Üseg scripts. Qudum Mongγol bičig was based on Old Uygur script and was a specific script for mongolian language. In contrast, Khevtee Dörvöljin Üseg was a universal script for Empire communication and that script was used to communicate with chinese and korean vassals of the Mongol Empire.

Are you joking? Talking about Chinese history but don’t read Chinese Record?

Well, Read whose history?

Why do you think that your historical understanding is more credible than the historical recorded by Chinese?

China’s history is recorded in detail, and some civs, such as India, It was only unified in modern times because they were colonized by Britain? they have only some scattered poems, which makes Indians feel very confident that they have built spaceships.

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Ancient China has always had officials responsible for recording history. There are more history books in China than the sheep raised by the Mongols. In the middle ages, Mongolia had poor land, food shortage and could not eat enough for three meals, let alone record history. Now, the outer Mongols are pointing fingers at Chinese history. Are they talking about history from the nonsense handed down orally by their ancestors?

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Ancient Chinese could not simply in represented in only Cantonese, it’s represented in every dialect of Chinese around all the China areas even the near countries. so your “Tang or Song official language is just Cantonese” I don’t agree with that. BTW Cantonese nowadays I think is not the same as it in ancient as well.
For example, “去” in “我去了” is pronounced as ke4 in the game and heoi2 in Cantonese which is different, and in dialect in Hunan province, it’s pronounced as ke4 which is the same in the game.

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From my observation, there are no people in this thread who said Mongol Empire is the Chinese Empire.

Chinese do not refer to Chingis Khan as Han people. Chinese do not refer to Yuan as the leader of the Mongol Empire. It does not change that the Yuan dynasty is a dynasty of China, a dynasty being a Khanate of the Mongol Empire, which although discriminated against the Han race Chinese, but ruled in the Han people’s way of traditional Chinese empires.

Thus, the major part of the bureaucrat system & common people in China, despite being ruled by Mongols, spoke the older version of Mandarin. Kublai did not aim to convert China into a new Mongol.

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This topic went from upgrading the chinese dialect of the units in this game to who had the most accurate history between mongols and chinese

Mods really need to close this thread…

Cannot agree more. xDDD