I feel like it doesnt work for a few reasons. To begin with, the civ feels a lot like Khmer with this set of bonuses, but most importantly I just find a Pole-style eco that doesnt scLe through the ages both less interesting and too overlap-ey
If you still think a farming bonus is ideal, I would recommend to go with “exhausted farms grant +35 food with every mill tech” and removing crop rotation
Seems like a bit too much. Specially for a civ with a farming bonus
Beyind that it seems good
A bit weird to ask
Do uou feel like my Tangut civ is a bit too “cluttered”? I guess a paladin and camel civ with no good hussars ans who cannot train spears is fairly unique, but having so many units with strong (yet simple) bonuses and the civ being yet another cav/inf/siege civ makes me unsure about the design
It may be simpler than Gurjaras or Khitans (probably the weirdest civs in the game today) but feels to me like they are in the same ballpark
so I know they don’t get Bloodlines but yes heresy on elephants more armored than Malay sounds scary scary
Also cheaper on gold than Malay
Khazars
Keep in mind that this civ will be a Cumans split. So I have kept some Cuman identity into the civ.
Cavalry Archer & Siege Civilization
Team Bonus - CA +1 attack vs infantry.
Civilization Bonus
UU
Light Cavalry that gets additional armor when gets mass (+1/+1 armor for each 8 units, max +3/+3)
Cost - 70f/15g
Training Time - 15 seconds
Attack - 8, 10
ROF - 1.90
HP - 70, 80
Armor - 1/1
Armor Class - UU, Cavalry
Speed - 1.50
LOS - 5
Unique Technologies
Missing Techs and Units
Barracks - Champion, Eagle, FL, Champi
Range - TR, Arb, EA, HC
Stable - Camel, Paladin, BE
Siege - AE line, BBC
Blacksmith - Last infantry armor
Monastery - Heresy, Sanctity, Illumination
University - Architecture, BBT, Arrowslits, Dry Dock, Incendiary, SE
Dock - FFS, Heavy Demo, CG line, Dromon, Lou Chuan
Eco - Final farm upgrade, Guilds.
From my knowledge the Siamese arose fairly late in the 13th to 14th centuries, so they largely skipped the early firelance and rocket stage and went directly to cannons and arquebus.
Completely unrelated, but your user name aged interestingly
Thai had some access to Chinese sciences and invention so access to some of those rockets and Lancers would not be too absurd even if maybe both lacked the elite upgrade
I feel like you dont get how absurd 9 range in a unit faster tham knights is
Beyond that ita odd but seemingly balanced
Anyway Chimu
A Defensive and Naval Civ
Team Bonus: Mangonel (and replacement) projectiles travel 15% faster
Regional Units: Champi, Slinger. If a dark blue unit isn’t mentioned here it is not in the tech tree!
Missing Techs
UU: Camaquen - Powerful slightly slow Maceman in bronze armor so believing in himself that he takes no form of bonus damage (no armor types) except anti-UU. strong bonuses vs buildings and shock armor. Good alrounder.
UT1: Siwas Sacred Smithing — Champi gold cost is removed.
UT2: Corded Bolas — Slinger bonus damages are 2x stronger.
So let’s get this out of the way first. No university! So all the dropsites have the different techs and I almost wanted some of them an age sooner. Note if all techs is simultaneous with this bonus then techs not avail will be here as follows:
Mill: Ballistics, Murder Holes, Siege Engineers, Heated Shot
Lumbercamp: Tower upgrades, Ship techs (except incendiaries), Treadmill Crane,
Mining Camp; Masonry Line, Wall Upgrades, Chemistry, Incendiaries
Next line of business: this civ could have a strong start. Faster moving and gathering villagers is not weak at all. I almost wanted to lower the carry capacity bonus to 15 or 18% but 20% culminated over time means in Imp age 1.2^4 means a carry bonus of 1.73x more compared to Hand Cart practically giving 7 carry. So it comes close and doesn’t add much more but the bonus is saved TC research time.
The free Champi upgrades are nice and the Gambesons is always worth getting for… all units. It affects not only your infantry and archers but siege, monks, villagers, carts, and all boats. Not buildings but like… they are buildings and pierce armor is not their top priority ever!
Early on your army will be spears and Champi and archers on land and at sea you have a Holk version of the Byzantine fireship bonus.
And in castle age Champi or crossbows assisted by horse and siege shredding slingers is not underwhelming. In fact despite how good hungry you are this might be the play. The issue? That imp transition. Yea slingers get a huge jolt from Corded Bolas, and get to kill the cavalry this civ never encountered (but they did use these to capture llamas) so it is an insane power spike. But your main army? No Elite Champi, no arbalest, no chemistry! You are just hitting off with slingers and hoping your slightly more pierce armor 60f Champi warriors can be sufficient without elite upgrade. They will lose to 2h swordsmen so that’s a painful aspect here. There is also no Halberdier! But Corded Bolas…This is the bulk of your military right here! Who needs chemistry. Bracer would be nice but balance is needed. Add some otherwise full skirms minus chemistry and Bracer… to the combo and you will be a strong perhaps too strong force vs most units while eschewing gold concerns.
So what can you do to stop them?! Walls and towers! Realize this civ has a vulnerable point before getting corded Bolas and just doesn’t have a good imp spike unit so if you can use castles and the like you should be able to cause major headaches as the game goes on! Perhaps this is too much? They get harder to avoid siege onagers so that’s is a plus to say bolas contraption!
Sounds like an argument for both units without their imp upgrade! Alongside multiple elephant types? Could be a unique lineup.
You could also see a more South East Settlement design to show how they made major migration from southern China into Thailand? But that might be a stretch!
Don’t think they should have access to either the firelancers or the rocket carts cause they aren’t part of the Sinosphere.
It’s true that they originated from South China, but when they left there for SE Asia, South China still hadn’t been sinicized.
Anyways here’s my take on the Siamese / Tais, the concept might be a bit old since it dates to 2024, but still I think most of the bonuses are still relevant
I’m concerned we won’t get a rocket cart or fire lancer civ without the elite upgrade to make it unique and more interesting as just a unit that is there instead of the centerpiece of the civ
Honestly, the infantry civs quite weak for a civ with a bunch of infantry bonuses
Also I feel like you made slingers way too OP
I would say that it would make more semse to add a foot bolas thrower if you want an anti cav ranged unit
Honestly I was trying to cram this civ into being the Bulgars and Malay of Champis lacking the final unit line upgrade and Gambesons for everything is a generic bonus
I feel like they still end up a bit too weak tbh, since the castle age champi is not that strong amd it still costs some gold
Bur my greater issue is that you made slingers have massive bonus against every type of unit except ranged
It costs no gold. It just doesn’t add all the gold to food only 60% of it.
Basically price change: -25g +15f
As for slinger I guess I could remove Bracer too if that helps keep in check or lower the UT bonus to 2x
I think you should just avoid giving slingers bonus damage vs cav in general… It basically becomes a trash geno xbow with bonus vs siege but weaker vs skirms
Ok, I thought it only replaced 60% of the gold cost.
Tbh I think at this point the unit could just cost 45 food (and imo, the Malay THS should also just be 50 food)
Gotta agree. I don’t know why the techs need to replace costs. Do it for the Persian crossbows and Slavic castles too
Changelog:
Slinger extra bonuses reduced to +3 vs Cav and siege, no longer bonus vs camels.
Corded Bolas now only boosts bonus by 2.5 possibly 2.
Loses Bracer. Possibly losing bodkin arrows!
Siwas Smithing no longer even increases food cost.
Champi upgrades no longer free.
Loses Bodkin arrow but attacking buildings +1 dmg/range per age. (+3 total and TCs don’t get any range… maybe). Possibly add this to Skirms so they can handle archers effectively or probably not??
Chemistry returned
Considering the removal of Pikeman to make sure you need to use slings
I think it made somw sense for persian crossbows and slavic castles (a bit less on slavic castles, but it made it still need some economic investment)
But in the case of the Malay or the Champi a higher cost isbunnecesary
I think losing bodkinbis way too crazy of a change, because it hurts them in castle age the most when the slingers are still weak-ish and they dont have anything that good to kill arvhers
Im just not sure the idea of making slings into anti cav is workable… its a weird unit with many bonus damage types already
Would castle age elite steppe lancers with half cost upgrade but no bloodlines be balanced? Its +2 attack and +1 pierce armor for 450 food and 275 gold