Okay, so can you give me some info on that, then? Wikipedia doesn’t have much.
Maybe I can help. Do you have a specific question or want an overview? I’ve been reading for a while about various African civs that would fit in the game and I intend to bring as much material as possible for those who want to do concepts. Due to real life stuff, I can’t always log in here, but I follow the discussions.
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I think it’s less about the values and more about the concept, why would you need more HP on buildings if you already have stone walls? In AOE II buildings are walls, and stone walls are just better walls in this regard.
Perhaps give them a regeneration bonus to walls/buildings? idk
This makes more sense.
Instead of globally less on every parameter, try to think of the purpose of the unit, is it a microable one? What’s the strategic nerative? What’s its powerspikes? Identity?
Then you basically do the same bonus just different wording, HP bonus applies to bonus damage as well. There is no room for same bonuses with different wording in AOE.
Sorry man, just take your time, I dont believe a civ has to be exclusively reasoned just by historical evidence. There is tons of room for interpretation.
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To begin with Celts and Goths shouldn’t even be in the game. Franks and Arabs were an united ethnicity.
This is a lame argument all the civis ingame are here to stay,move on.
Y’all will be very happy. I have decided to rename this civ the Shona and remove any elements that come from other Bantu peoples.
CHANGELOG
- Renamed Bantus to Shona
- Completely removed stated archer affinity
- Replaced nearly all bonuses
- Gave the Shona a Granary building, replacing the Mill
- Changed the functionalities of Nguni Shields and Great Zimbabwe
- Lowered the stats of the Assegai, and raised its cost
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say you click up to castle age with 30 vils created, that means you’ve spent:
30*50 = 1500 food on vils
500 on feudal age
800 on castle age, with some eco upgrades that sums to aroudn 3000 food, that’s 900 stone for free? add to that the starting stone and you can usually drop 2 castles without sending anyone to stone.
this gets even worse in late game where in a hussar spam situation one has up to 80 farmers. that’s more than a castle every 2 minutes if my back of the envelope calculations are correc:
gather rate of .32 food per second per farmer
.328060 = 1500 food per minute
1500/250*75 = 460 stone per minute
this is completely broken
in other words this is about 1 stone miner for every 3-4 farmers
in comparison:
Burgundian Vinyards adds the equivalent of one gold miner per 28ish farmers
Paper Money adds about one miner per 22 farmers
these are unique techs, requiring significant investment. so to make this balanced you need to reduce it by at least one order of magnitude
oh not to mention tower rushes
I had a feeling it was, but without the ability to crunch the numbers, I wasn’t sure. I’ll tweak the numbers a bit.
i think something more realistic would be 1 stone per every 100 food gathered (currently about 1 stone every 3.3 food), and i think even this might still be broken. also i don’t think it will be possible to balance this properly.
stone is deliberately only available on the map in a very limited quantity, so I’m not a fan
gold isnt as big of an issue since relics already exist
This is much better, especially since the Shona are a civ I would really like to see added to the game sometime.
I can change it to that. My whole idea with the Shona is that they can build a lot of fortifications, but they have to build up properly to do that. So even if it’s slightly broken, it can still be balanced because it’s such a small immediate effect.
Another thing to consider is that the Mill replacement costs 50 stone in addition to wood (which is intentional), so a lot of that stone income is going to go to just trying to keep the farming eco efficient. In other words, you won’t be floating as much stone as the numbers suggest.
but how do you avoid making them the ultimate tower-rush civ?
i had missed this, but i dont think this matters as I rarely build more than 1 mill before late castle/early imperial age. especially when playing an archer civ
I don’t know exactly. I’ll think of something.
I don’t know your level, but most high-level players build multiple mills, so the stone cost actually does matter in that case.
I’m usually 11-13xx, from my experience playing and watching high-level players a second mill only gets built when the space for farm around TCs and the first mill runs out. (special maps with extra shorefish/hunt/berries are different of course) i would be interested on the average number of mills built by game length, but i strongly doubt that more than 1 mill before castle age happens in more than 10% of arabia games
eg here is the first arabia game i found on youtube:
Hera reaches Imperial with 2 mills, going for Light Cav, ie a very food heavy build
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That’s an interesting one not gonna lie.
It cost like a TC and produce a resource over time, however according to AOE II “physics” it has to cost POP as well, just like Feitoria. Regardless of the stone cost.
Since Granary generate food passively - now they basically also generate stone, if you wait long enough, I’m not a fan of this one tbh. It becomes too much Portuguese.
I’m not sure this one is balancable, has to have a condition such:
Loom-free Hunters don’t need a drop off building
This is pretty much the only way you solve the laming potential that will just kill games, they can still lame nicely, but in a strategic state of high risk high reward. Same goes for going for random neutral deer across the map. I remind you that even without laming this is a huge eco bonus and scouting bonus.
That’s nice! Very useful on Arena.
Vills will do much less damage to Towers and Walls, that’s definitely a cool one to play around.
Now it makes more sense both balance wise and diversity wise.
That’s where you murdered it.
Just when I said the INDIRECT stone gain was fishy you added a gold gain. That’s too much.
I’m not a fan of a passive income to begin with, however the whole Granaries feature made sense, untill you sync it with these two other features.
Btw you have to nerf this civ’s tech tree somehow to make Granaries both more attractive and balanced. (like removing Heavy Plow, or Handcart, or any other economical aspect)
Perhaps even limiting the amount of Granaries you can build.
So it’d be sort of like a reverse Folwark. That could be interesting.
I can replace it for sure. Give me time to think it over.
What do you mean by that? The bonus goes away after Loom is researched? That’s an interesting concept, and can certainly make the game more dynamic by forcing players to delay Loom if they want max efficiency.
If I replaced the stone bonus, would this tech be all right? It is an Imperial Age tech after all.
I should definitely do that when I get a chance.
That feels more like an AoE3 thing than an AoE2 one. Not a fan.
Good suggestions overall.