Compliation of the changes in the newest pup

Age of Empires II: DE II - Discussion
1

Options

Game

Idle Pointers and Small Trees can be activated within the game settings

Civilization Balance

General

  • Gambesons: Technology avaiable in the barracks in castle age, militia line receives + 1 pierce armor, requires supplies
  • Pikeman upgrade: 215 food / 90 gold → 160 food / 90 gold
  • Eagle line: 20 food / 50 gold → 25 food / 50 gold
  • Elite steppe lancer: PA 1 → 2
  • Sappers: Villagers cause +15 damage when attacking buildings, Villagers gain +3 attack versus Rams
  • Elite Elephant Archer Upgrade: 1000 food / 800 gold → 800 wood / 500 gold
  • Heavy Scorpion Upgrade: 1000 food / 1100 wood → 800 food / 900 wood
  • Siege elephant upgrade: 650 food → 850 food

Bengalis

  • Cavalry + 2 attack vs skirmishers

  • Villagers and Monks take 10% less population space

  • Receive access to supplies

Berbers

  • Villagers move 5% faster in dark age, 10% faster in feudal age and onwards (was 10% from dark age)

Bohemians

  • Hussite reforms 800 food 450 gold → 500 food 450 gold

Britons

  • Team bonus: Archery Ranges 20% → 10% faster

Burgundians

  • Flemish revolution now has a base cost of 200 food 150 gold and + 10f and 5g for each villager, Flemish militia can be trained from the barracks instead of the Town Center after researching it

  • Flemish Militia: 60 food / 25 gold → 50 food / 15 gold; HP 75 → 60, Attack 12 → 11, PA 1 → 0

Burmese

  • Elite Arambai upgrade cost: 1100 food / 675 gold → 1000 food / 750 gold

Byzantines

  • Greek Fire: Fire Ships + 1 range, Bombard Towers + 5 blast damage

Celts

  • Strongholds: Castles heal Infantry Units in a radius of 7 tiles, castles and towers fire 25% → 33% faster

Chinese

*Start the game with 3-> 2 extra villagers and -200 food → -150 food

Dravidians

  • Siege weapons cost -33% wood

Ethiopians

  • Royal Heirs: Shotel Warriors and Camel Units receive -3 damaged from mounted units

  • Shotel Warrior training time reduced from 8 seconds to 4 seconds

  • Team Bonus: Outposts + 3 line of sight and cost no stone (towers no longer affected)

Goths

  • Villagers +5 attack vs. wild boar, hunters carry +15 meat, Hunt lasts 20% longer

Gurjaras

  • Shrivamsha Rider 70 food / 20 gold → 70 food / 30 gold

  • Kshatriyas 200 ood / 400 gold → 500 food / 450 gold

Huns

  • Atheism 500 food / 500 gold → 500 food / 300 wood

Incas

  • Military units: cost -15%, -20%, -25%, -30% food in dark/feudal/castle/imperial age. Therefore: lose access to supplies, Kamayuks: 60f → 65f, Slingers: 30f → 40f

  • Andean Sling (Skirmishers and Slingers no minimum range), Andean Sling: slingers + 1 attack

  • Civ bonus: “Start with a free lama” → team bonus

Japanese

  • Kataparuto: 750 wood / 400 gold → 550 wood / 300 gold

Lithuanians

  • Each Town Center provides 100 food

Malay

  • Infantry armor upgrades free

Malians

  • Villagers drop off 15% more gold

Poles

  • Villagers now longer regenerate 5HP in dark age (other values stay the same)

Portugese

  • (Elite) Organ Gun damage 16 → 7 (20 → 9)

  • Secondary damage: 2 → same as main projectile

  • (Elite) Organ Gun total projectiles 5 (5) → 6 (7)

  • (Elite) Organ Gun accuracy 50% → 0%

  • (Elite) Organ Gun attack dispersion 0.75 → 0.25

  • (Elite) Organ Gun Bonus vs Infantry 0 → 1

  • (Elite) Organ Gun Bonus vs Buildings 0 → 1

  • Elite Caravel upgrade cost: 750 food / 475 gold → 700 food / 525 gold

Saracens:

  • Zealotry: 500 food / 450 gold → 400 food / 400 gold

Sicilians

  • Castles built 100 → 50% faster

  • First Crusade: each TC (maximum 5) creates 7 → 5 serjeants, Cost: 1100 food / 600 gold → 400 food / 300 gold

  • Hoardings affects donjons; donjons can create spearman

  • Elite Serjeant upgrade: 1100 food / 800 gold → 800 food / 675 gold

Slavs

  • Gambesons free

  • Boyar 50 food / 80 gold → 60 food / 70 gold

  • Druzhina 1200 food / 500 gold → 900 food / 500 gold

Spanish

  • Receive 20g for each researched technology

  • Inquisition: Monks convert faster, Missionary + 1 range

  • Conquistador 2PA → 1PA

  • On Nomad-style maps, the first Town Center to be built no longer benefits from the Spanish construction speed bonus

Turks:

  • Artillery 450 wood / 500 good → 600 food / 650 gold

Vietnamese

  • Paper Money: 600 wood / 350 gold → 550 food / 200 wood

Vikings

  • Chieftains: Infantry deal bonus damage to cavalry, Infantry units generate 5 gold for killing villagers, 20 gold for killing monks and trade units

  • Bogsveigar: Archer-line and Longboats + 1 attack

  • Vikings: Elite Longboats Bonus vs Ships 11 → 10, vs buildings 8 → 7

  • Vikings: (Elite) Berserk healing 20 HP per minute → 40 HP per minute

26 Likes
2

Organ Guns got a massive nerf, base attack reduced by a lot.
Conqs got nerfed with -1 PA

3 Likes
3

So far I have:

  • Generic:

Gambeson tech (Castle Age): +1 pierce armour for militia-line infantry

Sappers: added effect: Villagers gain +3 attack versus Rams

Elite elephant archer cost changed to 800w, 500g

Elite Steppe Lancer: +1 PA (Love it!)

Heavy Scorpion: cost changed to 800 food, 900 wood.

Siege Elephant upgrade: 850f

  • Civilisations:

  • Bengalis:
    Mahayana also affects monks.

  • Ethiopians:
    Royal heirs: replaced by: “Shotels warriors and camels receive -3 damage from mounted units.”
    Ethiopian team bonus: outpoists +3 LOS, and don’t cost stone (I was advocating for that, I love it!).

  • Goths:
    Hunt lasts 20% longer.
    Interesting to notice they don’t get Gambesons.

  • Incas:
    Slingers cost +10f (40f, 40g). Kamayuk +5f (to 60f, 30g). This is partially adjusting the new food cost reduction bonus.

  • Koreans:
    Elite Turtle Ship +1 range (at 7)

  • Malians:
    Instead of having “Gold mines last 30% longer”, they received “Villagers drop off 15% more gold”. This actually means “Carry 15% more gold, and gold mines last that much longer”.

  • Portuguese:
    Organ guns attack nerfed to 7/9, but with a lot more spread damage (which seems to be quite accurate) of (5)/(6). I also suspect it does bonus damage, as it does more damage to knights and skirmishers for instance, but little damage to buildings and villagers.

  • Sicilians:
    Hoardings now also affects Donjons.
    Elite Serjent upgrade now is 800 food, 675 gold.

  • Vikings:
    Chieftains: cost reduced to 600 food, 450 gold. On top of the additional damage to cavalry, adds gold generation by killing enemy non-military units with infantry. The effect seems to be 5/killed villager.
    New Imperial Age UT: Bogsveigar (650 food, 500 gold): archers and longboats +1 attack.
    The effect of Beserkergang is included in the Elite Beserk upgrade. [I love it!]

[Trying not to repeat the above posts.]

5 Likes
6

Whoa, what?

Wait, they’re continuing to nerf Sicilians? I mean, I guess the Donjon is sort of a change, but this still overall feels like a nerf.

BIG changes overall though, I’d even say bigger than some DLC drops if we’re not counting the new civs.

For the most part, I’m tentatively positive about the changes, if nothing else they’re just new and interesting for most civs, revamping them quite a bit.

1 Like
7

I am not sure about this change. There are like few infantries with +2 but result is still same. M@A can’t win vs Archer and this’ll not improve the situation any better. Slightly better but still same. What they need is more survivality against Cavs. +2 or +3 cavalry armor so that they can survive a hit earlier and actually being cost effective vs Hussar.

2 Likes
8

Why?

Don’t think that will acheive what Devs might have in mind with it.
Can only lead to various abnoxious situations where certain civs without HC will feel kinda helpless against a champ spam in the lategame. And potentially make the line too strong on low elo settings, they might just become infantry spams then actually.

Don’t like that too much. “civ is bad vs skirms? oh then just give bonus damage!” And they still lack mobility.

Ok it’s then cheaper now for below 100 vills and a bit more expensive for more vills. Don’t think this changes much.

What?

Ok, interesting. DK if this changes much but let’s see.

I think it’s the right way. But I would even go further and enable them to have zero idle time even for players around 1k elo.

Ok wow, that’s a big one. I can see dravidians having a good mango push in the midgame now.

Not like super exciting bonus, but it’s interesting this is now viable.

I’m not sure if I like that tbh. Goths already have super strong early agression potential… but this means basically that they can’t give gambesons to goths… idk. Was there no other way?
I think longer lasting Hunt could have been a bonus for a new “agressive” civ.

Back and forth 11

Even it it’s “only” food, that’s a really big one. holy moly. Incas could be top tier with that now.

Like that

Wow, indeed. That’s now one of the best if not the best TB in the game 11

which menas they still get 100 in the start no? Otherwise they would completely lose their identity. I think lith can lose some favorization with that tbh. It’s not that the 100 food would make them a top tier booming civ.

hm interesting. This could indeed make militia play an option for them. But I think it will just be used for the standard archer/spear combo. Is a neat bonus though.

For all food sources? Omg that would be broken 11 Not even close, this bonus would immedriately make them the strongest civ in the game and by far. Just think about it, it’s basically franks, britons half of mongols and mayans food bonus combined. That’s… i don’t have words 1111

But then they fire more projectiles, no?

idk seems like overall another nerf for them. Don’t care anymore.

Oh wow, that’s a big one.

Oh nice, finally a raiding specific bonus. love it.

This paired with the still super strong Viking eco? Welcome back ages of FImp Vikings Arbs!

1 Like
9

RIP Berserkergang. Wished it applied for all units and Berserks getting stacked on previous regen value

11

also they got terrible eco. Mahayana should be Dark Age bonus. Replace Mahayana with something new.

12

Hm I tried it, and found no such thing?

14

From the worst to the best, no middle ground in sight. 11

6 Likes
15

I imagine the organ gun’s secondary bullets are going to do more then one dmg now.

Kinda wish gambesons was +5 hp or something that isnt just another blacksmith upgrade.

With the ut and civ changes it seems they are HARD pulling the ripcord on the ‘JUST BUILD INFANTRY’ button

i wonder what infantry uu will get changed, considering gambesons only effecting militia-line makes them comparably worse value. this was a (general) complaint the last pro-infantry buff pass

1 Like
16

Not that I would be against that. Imo Incas should have a big TB as outside of Kamayuk (and SO) they can’t provide that much in TGs.
I am only surprised devs had the **** to give such a strong TB.

17

Sadly they don’t even get SO.

And yeah, I’ve been asking for a meaningful TB for Incas as well. Personally, I was in favour of a trade bonus, but this probably is better overall. Kamayuks seem to be buffed in general, as even with the increased food cost the discount more than makes up for it, and Slingers retain the same cost in Castle Age, I think?

(Also, don’t let HealFortress hear about the new Celts UT…)

1 Like
18

It is in the german version of the game but not in the english version.

19

Oh yeah, Aztecs had the SO. Incas have SIege Ram.

IDK if Kamayuks really like “needed” a buff, but I like the unit, so let’s see if this makes it more viable to go for it. Imo it was mostly more a question if you can actually get to them than their efficiency what hold them back (even with the incan stone bonus).

Don’t think he cares. He loves his TK square monk combo that has so much healing power it doesn’t need any aura buffs 11

That’s actually also a big one we haven’t discussed so far… I’m not sure i like that tbh. Imo eagles were overall fine, just too “jack of all traits” which doesn’t change with a cost change at all.
I don’t understand that change tbh.
It also basically compensates the incan discount entirely 11
So the only units really benefitting for incas are spear, skirm and kamayuk… Not bad but at first glance the food discount bonus looked stronger 11. And ofc drush and maa rush, but’s only like 18-27 F.

20

I had the same problem in the French version for something else, so I switched to English.
Jopefully the final update will also correct language issues present in the Tech tree for a long time :wink:

21

Turks got a nerf

Artillery cost is now #### 650g.

Slavs got even more than ever, Druzhina is now cheaper at 900f 500g, and Boyar now cost 60f 70g.

23

Honestly terrible patch for the meso civs, eagles are already too expensive (gold) for what they last or even compared to the other regional units like the steppe lancer, they buffed incas somehow by giving them the gurjara tech for free, but aztecs and mayans eagles are being punished with nothing in compensation, you will see win rates decreasing immediately and tournament usage.

Dravidians will be #1 hoang civ from now on. (like if that push wasn’t annoying enough)

I like what they did to vikings, those champions with chieftains were smashing battle eles lol

But in general changing lots of techs cost for wood isn’t healthy or original.

Organ guns are finally being nerfed after the insane buff when they increased the bullet speed, but i am not sure about it, the devs love that civ so they might increase their DPS somehow, so they will still be ridiculous strong on walled maps.

Oh and look hindustanis getting back their eco bonus…

1 Like
24

For civs that were overly wayy too dominating on most open maps for like 23 years, this was such a needed change.

4 Likes
26

Ah.
That’s nice. I think that can work out then.
Still not a fan of the tech, but I think it’s way better handleable with the lower stats.

Also nice. I like that. It’s removing that gold cost which you might not have at the stage you want to do it.