Coop battles and upcoming Balance changes

Too bad that Burgundians eco is more than enough to afford a crapload of siege weapons.

Well intended stuff can be bad.

That was before Burgundians had Viking eco tho. That’s yet one more problem of the tech: if the civ has a bad eco the tech is mostly crap, if the civ has a good eco it suddenly becomes god tier.

This. Especially since with the cheap paladin upgrade, you can first attack with paladins to make them go for cav counters or stronger cav, then you click the golden button and all of a sudden you get an army of what is basically a Viking champ, that will just steamroll the units that counter paladins.

Turks already have so much gunpwoder bonuses they are at no risk of being outclass in that regard by Bohemians, and I think the boyar buff happened to make them more than a glorified Teuton paladin from a castle.

We are talking of the unit that didn’t need a buff in the first place, but did anyway cuz people kept thinking they had a worse frame delay in AoC despite evidence of the contrary. Btw even after this nerf they are still buffed compared to AoC. not that only a tiny part of the player base can actually use the difference anyway

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Mixed feeling about this one.

I’m excited about coop campaing, I will probably give a try as soon as possible.

About balance changes, I find them quite disappointing.

  • CA nerf is pretty minor (there’s an error in the video, pre-buff CA had 1.3 attack animation), yet I don’t think CA needed a nerf.
  • HC buff needs testing, I am not sure it will actually help that much.
  • FR nerf looks a desperate attempt of making the tech more balanced without reworking it. Sadly, I’m quite confident to say it won’t work at all. Cost increase is not that relevant and removal of bonus damage vs building doesn’t help either since it’s meta to make few BBC or trebs alongside with FR.
  • I don’t get War elephants change either. It makes the unit probably even more unviable for 1v1 due to higher gold cost. It maybe helps in closed maps TGs with trades going on, where I don’t think war elephants need buff to be honest.
  • Elite Boyars change looks a bit of a nothing change aswell. It’s still an expensive unit for 1v1s which is hard to afford in mid-late imp (where the buff should come into play). In TG maybe can situationally help, even though in arabia Eboyars should still perform worse than paladins and in close maps I think slavs have better compositions available.
  • Turks artillery feels underpriced post-change. I’m ok with replacing the stone cost, but I think gold cost should be raised a bit. It’s a very powerful tech after all.

On the other hand, no changes or buff to the few weak of generic civs that should get one in my opinion (Burmese, Sicilians that still need an identity, Incas that should still get a compensation for the loss of their rush, maybe even Spanish need something in my opinion)

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Tbh I’m surprised by the reactions to the boyar change, I would have expected people to at least want to try it out, the thing’s stats are now absolutely insane, but people still say they won’t try it out. Ever since DE they got +2/+1 armour, how can an unit be buffed this much without getting people interested?


As Slavs you have better choices don’t you? It is like Jaguar for Aztecs or Mameluke for Saracens and Samurai for Japs.

Because it’s never been a bad unit, but being a very gold intensive unit which non-elite version is not much better than knights, it’s not a unit you can frequently justify to transition into.

It’s a situational unit and it will be a situational unit after the buff, if they want to push the viability (at least in 1v1s) I think a buff to non-elite, a slight discount or a buff to the HP would have been better.

I suggested to make its gold cost 70

Oh well now that the elite upgrade got buffed so much it will be hard to buff the normal boyar without making the whole deal broken.

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Yeah since now they are tankier than before the 80g now fit them, unlike the laughable Mameluke.

Current civ alterations that Iwish to see in these DLC updates:

Current civ alterations.


Have Vikings lose free hand cart but instead have their longboats be able to attack as well as transport units (loses transport ships) and gift them cheap trash units.

African ,Mezzo,

African and mezzo civs should only have canoe navies. Able to fire arrows ,fast ,agile and only using 0.5 pop space but they don’t have access to Gally line ,nor fire ships, nor cannon. Gallons. All canoes can carry/transport 3-5 units.


Change civ unique tech 1 to : Justinian Reforms - Sword line +1 Melee armour.
Enables the technology of Varangian Guard in Imperial age.
In Imperial age , Byzanitne army gain access to a special unit in the Barracks called the Varangian Guard. - Expensive , slow moving but difficult to convert with a limited build amount.
(Highly loyal guards of the Emperor)

Unique tech 2 remains Logistica.

Lose Hand cannoneer.
Trash becomes more expensive but Civ gets free wheel burrow and free hand cart.

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oh? and where did you make this suggestion at? this account has never suggested making the gold cost for them 70 gold.

nice job outting yourself once again equalizer.

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yeah because slow moving infantry has worked so well for the TK and the Serjeant.

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From a single player perspective , I alway use TK as well as Serjeant. So yes, it does work so well.

and that’s the problem. yes in campaigns it would work well, but in multiplayer, what the game is actually balanced around, slow moving infantry is awful.

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Exactly, if it doesn’t work in MP…then MP gamers should just not use them… just like the siege tower that I love using but has almost no validity in MP.

So with one change you destroy 2 civilitations’ identities? vikings would become useless in land and water maps (lower eco cant afford longboats) and byzantines just obtain eco power in ezchange of almost nothing. Byzantines would reach imperial age pretty fast with free wheelbarrow and handcsrt and their current bonus.

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Did they really buff boyars? xD Gonna be most op unique unit, very undeserved imo
Hand cannoneers could’ve gotten a bigger buff
I’m fine with the cavalry archer nerf but don’t nerf them more
The artillery change was very needed
War elephants change is pretty interesting

What is still missing is a steppe lancer buff and cumans buff in 1v1s
Also incas need their team bonus reworked, and byzantines need few minor buffs

This is a good question. Maybe now it is a bit less overlapped with the teuton paladin

Yeah a cuman buff, and some other small fixes like SE for Italians and, again, town patrol for Byzantines!

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To me it seems nobody uses CA or HCA at all, not even civs with specific bonuses (or with a playstyle that would suit them).
Mongols usually use Mangudai which is better, Cumans Kipchaks, Berbers Camel Archer and Turks and Magyars have better options in janissaries and paladins.
Tatars maybe use HCAs, but I don’t know how many people play with Tatars in the first place.
I all games that I played/saw, everyone preferred crossbowmen and arbalests to CAs, a nerf seems beyond useless imho.

Also the Boyar buff is nice, but imho is not going to change much.
Halbs and pikemen already did almost only bonus damage vs boyars, Boyars already won vs Paladins, buffing the armor is not going to change key win/loss. They died 1vs1 against TK and Elite battle elephants, and they still do. They died in 7 pikemen shots and 5 halb shots and they still do. The major difference is that they can win 1vs1 against malay elite battle elephants now.

they have seen a resurgence of popularity lately.

all of which require a castle.

also buildings have their armor shown now for example the stone wall has 8 / 10 armor (form what i remember from earlier troday)