How hunters are killing them with only rifles? They survive cannon fire with ease. Few direct hit like nothing. Excuse me, what kind of fantasy game is this? Lord of the Rings?
Youâre using infinite res though, that inherently means pop efficiency becomes basically the only resource that matters, which favors units like elephants.
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Okay. Why then only single civ in the game has the strongest unit which takes insane amount of punishment to be defeated?
Ah I missed that, now it makes a lot of sense. Heâs playing some meme setting and talking about balance 11
No it wonât. When you have infinite resources, the cost and difficulty in building an economy needed for that wonât be apparent. Its extremely difficult to get such a macro and hold on to it.
No we donât. Its just powerful in the meme setting you and friends are playing. So if you donât want to get stomped by elephants just play ranked and youâd see how unusable Elephants are.
OrâŠjust orâŠyou can stop playing MEME settings which were meant for fun and casual gameplay if you are concerned about balance.
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You know - im playing Starcraft with absolutely ANY settings and every time there is a perfect balance.
Go play Star craft then and quit being abusive! If someone reports you I wouldnât be surprised
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Starcraft only have 3 race. It is easy to balance.
This game is balanced based on open map 1v1, different civ have different timing, and you can choose when to attack on open maps.
TG can never be balanced so there is no point to talk about TG
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Is this supposed to prove something?
From the first picture, I see corpses of eles and a whole heard at low hp. In the next, what looks like a fresh batch right on top the onagers which dont look like they moved even an inch. More, the siege is swarming over itself - did you a-move the siege into the ele ball??? I really hope youâre not calling âbalanceâ if thats the case.
If anything, the damage capacity in the first pic is enough to prove what I already know - siege can kill eles just fine. Beyond that is just the mechanics of a high hp melee unit vs a ranged unit that doesnt kite - clear situation to me.
I donât know much about starcraft but maybe there are no meme settings in starcraft. Aoe 2 has a lot of meme settings for casual players. CBA, Custom scenarios, King of the hill, Wonder race, Battle Royale, Infinite resources, FFA, Exploding kings, 10x techs mod etc. You just happened to pick a meme setting where balance is irrelevant.
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I donât know if StarCraft has an infinite resources setting, but if it does, it would be less unbalanced than AoE2 for a couple of reasons:
- In StarCraft stronger units cost more population than weaker units, and this is balanced in such a way that units have roughly the same population efficiency.
- In StarCraft, all races have essentially identical economies â there are no economic bonuses or upgrades, no discounts, and everybodyâs workers collect the same resources at the same rate.
Economy is a big part of AoE2. There are four resources rather than two, different resources are needed for different purposes, some civs have eco bonuses, different civs have access to different eco upgrades, and so on. Naturally the game is balanced around the bonuses that different civs have, including eco bonuses and discounts. If you play with infinite resources, eco bonuses and discounts become irrelevant, and thus the game becomes unbalanced.
As an example, I think you mentioned your ally played as Slavs. Slavs have a significant farming bonus, which gives them (I think) the best farmers in the game, two of their other bonuses are economic (discounts and free techs). With infinite resources, those bonuses do nothing (except the free techs which still donât require research time â though thatâs not relevant in the late game situation youâre talking about), so Slavs are worse in these settings than in a standard game.
3 Likes
An excellent read but I fear all our efforts will fall on deaf ears
The game is primarily balanced around these setting. but I Believe it is possible to balance both. In team most civilizations weakness can be negated through team work. If you want to nerf OP civilization in team games you should target their Meta strategy while buffing to other strategies to keep them viable in 1v1
Mayans: Reduce their archer discount or their wall discount.
Spanish: Nerf Conqs
Huns: Reduce stable team bonus or CA discount.
Mongols: Nerf Hunt bonus, Steppelancer HP, or Mangudai,
Turks: Remove free chemistry
Persians: Eco or Team bonus
I not saying all of these changes should be implemented but my point is that you can Completely Neuter any Team game civ with targeted nerfs. Viking and Briton are the best in game examples . And as long as these nerf are balanced out by buff that mostly effect 1v1 They can be balanced in both modes
Giving Spanish access to crossbow.
Turks: access to pikemen, or Skirms, or an early game bonus.
Persians: access to bracer along side Kamandran nerf
Mayans: access to Champions maybe Redemption.
I think it is entirely possible to have civs balanced on closed and open maps, 1v1 and team games. The problem is that most of these changes took away from their identity without really giving them a new one.
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The problem isnât elephants, itâs the savar. Those things kill everything that isnât anti-cavalry in a couple of seconds.
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All Savars need is upgrade cost increase, but since when Savars kill everything?, they are just slightly stronger than generic Paladin and die sooner to other Cavalry (Leitis, Monaspa, Boyar), and high attack ranged UUs (Genoese xbow, Composite Bowman). true area where theye excel is vs ranged units (Arbalest and Cavalry Archers).
4 Likes
Well then I guess Britons absolutely suck at the moment, 11.
TG can be balanced If the devs will do what you said, however, these changes might break 1v1 balance. Obviously the devs only care about 1v1 because all the recent changes are made around 1v1 win rate.
A 20th century hunter, who favoured the longbow, killed several elephants with it.
Craziest part is : he used a 115lb bow, not even the high end for historical warbows.
The team games are so disconnect form 1v1 balancing that you could remove all blacksmith upgrades except Bracer and Ring Archer Armor from the Mayans and still have them be a viable pocket Civ. If you want to Nerf Mayans primarily in team games nerf their UU or Archers. If you want to buff Mayans in 1v1 fill in their tech tree or buff other units. If you want to be buff/nerf Mayans in both modes target their eco. As long as buff coincide with nerf it is easier than you think to keep civs in relevantively the same position in 1v1âs.
This is a game where Cannons can reload every 6.5 seconds while moving, donât need to be packed up, remain operational while 10 villager repair them, have unlimited free ammo, and can 360 noscope-headshot an archer 12+1 arbitary tiles away. These decisions make sense in a game where the devs want player to have fun microing BBC without worrying about maintaining the supply lines necessary to maintain a long term siege. But it also means BBC doing realistic damage would break the game especially in infinite resources.