French Knights. And more French Knights. MORE. MOAR!

Hi all,

What my friends and myself, as just average players experience, is a lot of French Royal Knights. Like a lot a lot (a lot). For most factions we from time to time see a lot of mangudai. Or perhaps a lot of camels. Even mass MAA from HRE. But nothing is as predictable as French going knights. Nearly pure knights. Every. Single. Time.

It seems that it is not even remotely relevant (1) what game type such as 1on1, 4on4, FFA or anything in between and (2) the faction of the opponent nor (3) the map. In fact, even (4) from feudal to imperial the logic seems to just keep spamming knights. Strat of the enemy? (5) just overwhelm it with more knights. Spears? Circle them, cause a split and then engage. No other faction spams knights till beyond the horizon like the French do.

Of course the world is not that simple and I’m dumbing this down to the conceptual point I’m making; but for the love of god every time I see French on the loading screen, regardless if it is 2on2 on dry Arabia or a 4on4 on confluence, I know my screen will be swarmed with French royal knights. No exceptions. The reason I don’t mention 1on1 is because resources typically don’t allow “swarms” so there we just see “hordes”…

Their auto heal, their speed (both in movement and the fact they can be produced early on) along with scaling upgrades over all ages… man, this is dreading to play. I’m not offering a solution. I’m not sure about the balance (in high level competitive play). I’m just signalling it as a member of the large middle group of the bell curve. I know people will be like “make walls”, “just go spears”; but that is not the point I’m making. None of these effectively mitigate the versatility of the royal knight (which we know empirically due to the fact they are still spammed like popcorn in a microwave).

No other faction than French seems this unidimensional. Of course one faction will always be the most; but does it have to be with the landslide distance to the number two that it currently is? Wondering what others think on this.

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In a team game, on a close map, knights are overpowered now special French knight, nothing can 2vs1 with knights even hand cannoneers. I think should change mounted units is 1.25 or 1.5 pop is fairer

[quote=“KiezelSteentjeh, post:1, topic:202703”]
t seems that it is not even remotely relevant (1) what game type such as 1on1,
[/quote] If enemy build only knight in 1v1 it’s free win. Especially if you have camels. BUild a few camels, then rest spears and crossbows. If you don’t have camels, just spears and crossbows.

[quote=“KiezelSteentjeh, post:1, topic:202703”]
) just overwhelm it with more knights. Spears? Circle them, cause a split and then engage. No other faction spams knights till beyond the horizon like the French do.
[/quote] Sounds like they are just better than you. You can also micro. But with xbows this wont work for them as you’ll be shooting while they’re engaging back and forth. Only thing you need to is to wall up and attack

Don’t play team games. Except if you and your friends are drunk and bored . Its impossible to balance.

Honestly couldn’t agree more. It’s really quite laughable… devs claim they want ‘unit diversity’… lol… uh huh. Since this game launched, every French player just spams knights. It’s a joke they havent fixed it.

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Knights are not the only problem, the real problem is that currently Horseman is not strong against ranged units, he is not as effective as Spearman against cavalry, so that the balance of the triangle is broken. After the Mangonel was nerfed, the problem was exacerbated Now, you just need to cover the Crossbowman or Arbalétrier with units for a while and the death ball will appear and knock down all units.

Please devs to strengthen Horseman against ranged units to make him as effective as Spearman against cavalry, so that the triangle balance will be established and solve the problem of Crossbowman being too strong.

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horsemen received already a buff against archer, if you have enough horsemen, its pretty strong.

My French knights never win me anything

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In the games I play, people normally use them with 10-20 bombard cannons. The bombard cannons walk through the base destroying every building, and the 60+ knights mainly serve to protect the bombard cannons.

If you can see only Knights in your opponent’s army most of the time then I assume you stuck in plastic league, no offence.

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French Knights are simply popular. If you force them to play other units using French, they will leave.
Same with Mangudai, most people see Mongols as cavalry archer civ and they would prefer as cavalry. If you force them to play infantry, they will leave. They are not there to compete, rank up and make money by streaming, etc. Most of them are there to enjoy. And that is what people enjoy. It is a subjective topic.

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What. When I am frenc, my main part of the army will consist of arbalatreers. Ranged are simply way stronger. Then I will have some kind of meatshield. Maybe knights, maa or spears. Having a few knights is also good for map control, and I do this with every civ when they become available.

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I’m not going to respond to your full post. The idea to just don’t play team games because of royal french knights shows how inconsiderate you are regarding the issue at hand. You dispose of a beloved game type for many players. You argue to not go to a forest to deal with ongoing forest fires.

I agree with you that ranged, mostly crossbows or its unique civ varation to it are very powerful. However I want to remain towards the topic at hand which are French knights; which show up well before anyone can make crossbows. Even in later stages, the sheer speed, autoheal and raid ability of French knights gives them a lot of options in dealing with crossbows.

As I’ve stated in the original message, I’ve oversimplified the case. Especially in 1on1 games they are often complimented with archers, but this serves only as a counter to their only counter: spearman. And even this is iffy. Knights often simply detour the spears just to raid. Or can more easily flank any ranged support as they are much quicker. In concept I’m not saying pure knights, I’m saying it consistently revolves around the knights to such a degree it becomes unidimensional and obnoxious. If you cannot see that then I assume you stuck in plastic league, no offense. I’m 1200 ELO 1on1 QM or 1400 ELO team games QM.

Just as firelancers were popular, before they got nerfed. Or mangonells before they got nerfed. Or demo ships before they got nerfed. I like you raise this point as it illustrates very well the issue: they are popular because of their ease. They can easily be spammed straight from feudal and they remain good up to and well into imperial age. With lot of HP, armor, auto heal and speed, of course this unit is popular. I have no issues to units using its civ unique varations; but no other faction has an unit that is this dominant. Longbows don’t raid this well, HRE MAA only kick in in later stages and are slow. The units should compliment the army, carry the army over the edge, not be its sole intent throughout every possible thinkable scenario.

No other factions spams one single unit so often as French. As you mention: we see some players spamming mangudai. Indeed. Some, sometimes. Not every single game in every single game type vs every single opponent on every single map. There is only one faction that does that, that is the French, with knights.

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