From all units, which unit you think could be the most interesting if changed

Age of Empires IV IV - Discussion
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For me I think maa now is really not fun to watch and to use. If Maa have stance lets say , defence stance - slow walking with shield infront reducing arrow dmg , normal stance, and disarm stance - you take off your weapons and run faster, you can activate normal stance after. Also maa for HRE can give armor to the backline, that way they can be truly unique.

The unit that I would like to be changed most from the begining will be the priest. There can be so much stuff added to it, mass fear - because religion… if you can convert you can put fear to the people , even can work on military building to reduce their production, can be used to towers to ungarrison units, etc. Also tons of other stuff can be added.
The thing that bugs me most is that priest, shaman, imam etc. are the same. Shaman and priest have nothing in common. Religious prophet vs spiritual teacher, seeker, etc. Maybe this can add a little bit of flavor if let’s say shaman from mongols doesn’t act like HRE priest.
My two cents tho.
What are the units you would like to see improved ?

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Regarding religious units, you are right.

I feel that while Aoe4 evolves a lot of mechanics from Age2; When it comes to monks I’m sad that the amount of temple tech in general has been reduced so much, mainly because it changed the conversion mechanic.

In age 2 I liked to improve the maximum monks, for my desire to evolve each civ to the maximum as if it were an RPJ. I lost that habit in Aoe2DE, because apart from taking relics and converting one or two units, gold is limited, and it’s better to prepare more troops, or heal them up front in the castle. It was more profitable to convert when there were 75 units per civ, and the armies were smaller, now that they are huge (200, 300 population) it is no longer so easy for a monk to convert… or even profitable.

So far the Age game where I like religious technologies the most is in the AoE3: Wars of liberty MOD. There they reproduced well the differences between religions that were in each civ, by choosing 1 and obtaining special technologies. Pastoriles, for example, produced shepherds from their homes. The inquisitor was a type of anti-religious unit assassin. Everything was great, especially sending villagers to pray at the temple, I LOVED IT.

They could also consider more religious technologies shared between countries with the same state religion, affecting the customs and habits of the general population for good, something like this:

  • Catholics and Orthodox tech:
    1.1.- Evangelization.- Religious units can convert units without a relic but individually.
    1.2.- Mendicant orders.- All units cost -5% gold. (get rid of goods)
    1.3.- Easter Preparations.- All units cost -5% food. (for fasting)

  • Islamic tech:
    2.1.- Preparations of the Month of Ramadan.- All units cost -5% food (for fasting)
    2.2.- Jihad.- generates a damage bonus for all units against religious enemy units +5.
    2.3.- Iconoclasm.- increases the torch damage of all units by +5.

  • Mongolian Animism->Tibetan Buddhism: Religion of the Mongols, it already has its tech as their stone system so it is better not to add more:
    3.1.- Stone system in the Ovos.- the one we already know.
    3.2.- Change to Tibetan Buddhism.- Now the temples also generate religious aura of the ovoo.

Civ that require some unique religious technology:

  • English: Priest Hole.- English Houses and Temples now allow to hide/garrison 3 priests. History: Yes, they hid from Elizabeth I, in holes built by nobles who hate the religious persecution of the new queen. Nicholas Owen, a builder of more than 100 priest holes, was sentenced to death and is now a saint of England.

  • French: Cult of Joan of Arc, Patron Saint of France.- Increases +1 attack to all French units. History: Due to the fervor for Joan of Arc, both nobles and peasants enlisted and fought harder against the English.

  • Mali: Under construction (I need to read more about Islam and Shamanism in Mali)

  • Chinese: They need many related to Confucianism (which is unique for them), the buddhist part is represent by the Pagoda building.

Civ that already have unique religious techs:

  • HRE: They already have 3, and in fact that the Prelate is built in the Town Center is a reference to “Plenary Indulgences”, by which the emperor chose priests without going through monasteries. The same prelates are a reference also to the “prince-bishops”.

  • Russians: They already have 3, and the warrior monk is a reference to the monk Pelinat and other monks who followed him. Even the Landmark is the monastery where it came from, it’s well done.

  • Abbasid.- They have 3 in the Religious Wing, All-Seeing Eye

  • Sultanate of Delhi.- They have 4, and according to the master’s short history facts, “Swiftness” reflects that the scholars ran from Badgad to the caliphate to take refuge from the Mongol invasion. Zeal is an obvious reference to Jihad, Efficient Production refers to schoolars teaching their science to military troops so they can complete their training faster, Tranquil Venue is a reference to the peace that should exist in a mosque and the flourishing of hospitals, All -Seeing Eye I guess it is a reference to Allah watching over the schoolchildren in India, so they have become vigilant… or Shiva’s third eye? or in the eyes of Buddha? Since they are schoolchildren, and of various religions, I suppose it is good technology to represent them.

  • Ottomans: Field Work Vizir point, which spawns 2 monks and gives them a passive heal aura.

  • Mongols: Practically their system of stones is part of their religious idiosyncrasies of Ovoo and shamanism, just as their temple is the passage to Tibetan Buddhism, the current majority religion of Mongolia. I guess.

2 Likes
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I 100% support more special abilities for units but is this really something the majority of the cummunity wants? I like the proposals in both posts and also previously ppl have made great lists of possible special abilities for units but sadly those topics usually go down the drain.

1 Like
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Yeah awesome post by Golden. You go in depth a lot which was interesting to read. The only thing that I don’t agree is that HRE,Rus, Abassid and etc are fine.

For me priest need to have totally different playstyle one from each other.
You said something for aoe3 which I didn’t played it but as someone who loved aztec I like how they dance for ceremonies and add priests to that., this was unique.
HRE even if they have “THE” different priest, I don’t feel like I am playing something unique.
Its basically same priest with aura ability. Both of them you will put them as part of the army and you do nothing, they just sit and heal/buff. Rus, same stuff, only that the guy is on horse. Could be much more interesting to inspire horses to go to war or maybe something with the animals because they were hunters.

When I first played Abassid I was so hype to convert units, maybe because I like to micro . When I understood you need forth age to get this upgrade to MAYBE convert one knight while 30 charge on you and archers shoot from behind with mangonels.
This upgrade is useless, maybe in really weird moments when some elephants are coming and you convert them but that’s it.

Ottomans have good card system and I really like it but still, same priest, almost same gameplay.
If the priest are like core support unit with different abilities, not passive but active, because passive ones just doesn’t change the way priests feel.

Atm there is almost no difference if you play Mongols and bring shamans with your army and playing HRE and getting unique priest with your army.
Absolutely the same.

The thing is there are so much stuff around priest that can be added it’s infinite.
Priest can influence, can cause fear in some people or give hope to others.
Can convert people to their faith or even at some “Holy” civilizations, priest have the power in their hands to start a war.
They can unite people or split them apart.

They can buff with so much different auras, because religion is not for a single person, it’s for the mass of people. So when you have buffs, debuffs, heals, you cure the peoples heart not going from one to another to stick them with bandage.
That’s a medic.

Shaman can do sacrifices like Celts in AOEO. Didn’t play much that game but there are some really interesting stuff. Celts can spawn dears to sacrifice them for different army buffs. Imagine that to Rus or Mongols.
Just giving unique command to your priest would be much more interesting than +5% bonus dmg.
Yeah you do more dmg but … meh
Next civ - 5%food cost. Strategy and economic wise would be huge ofc, but I won’t feel like my priest are unique, just some numbers behind my units.

Also something I would love to.
Relics are the most boring mechanic in RTS games literally.
I imagine if someone get relics to get 3,4 choices on the screen, the same how you age up in aoe 3, you choose your politician or tribal chief to give you different stuff. Now imagine something like that with relics, you get relic and you choose from couple different choices, heck you can even unlock mercenaries with that to add different units to your stable, barracks, archery range or maybe some mercenary building.
There is just so much that can be done.

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Firstly aoe3 relies on vast amounts of imbalance

Almost none of these are religious tech, they’re just eco techs

Jihad is almost impossible to balance.it could either be OP or useless depending on civ match up, that’s bad design(which fits with the whole aoe3 imbalance theme)

Literally useless

+1 atk is worth more on archers (drastically changed hits to kill armoured targets) while being almost useless on things like knights, and weaker on siege and xbows (all the main french units iaw)

I don’t think it’s a bad idea, but it’s obvious what it’ll be effective for, which is not what french use very often. ie I don’t think it fits their theme

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i think crossbows are incredibly boring. they’re just archers with different counters

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When I was referring to Age3, I was referring to the “Wars of Liberty” Mod, which believe me “is totally different” from the Aoe3 “Vanilla” mechanics. Check out their Wikia fandom, it’s great.

On the shared civ religious techs I proposed: Yes, they are eco-tech, but technically because of their lore they are religious activities that compete with the temple, it would be rare for them to develop in the urban center or in the blacksmith, like many state unique technologies are developed in the castle (like the Chinese “Extra Materials”, or the “Slow-Burning Defenses” of the Delhi Sultanate, or the British “Network of Citadels”). Maybe do it in units created in the perimeter of a temple or mosque, it would be great.

About Jihad: I personally think the Delhi Sultanate’s “Zeal” technology better reflects the idea I had of Jihad, easy it should be a technology shared between islamic civs. You would watch the Jihad version of WarsofLiberty, “thats is broken”, here I upload an image (Yes, faith is one more resource in WoL, just like the one in Age of Mythology):

Jihad
Jihad1304Ă—390 98.7 KB

About the Priest hole: It is the little I found related to particularities of English Catholicism before the Anglican period. Easy if they take out 5th age in a future dlc, and they give a choice between Anglicanism and Calvinism, there is a lot to take out. The other option that seemed interesting was “MAGNA CARTA”, because it was approved by the Pope, who was English at that time. As for the bonuses, I’m going to play some English games to see what they lack or shine to decide.

About French archers, you’re right: when I played the Mali, and activated their +2 attack tech on archers and javelinmen, on top of their poison buff, I felt how powerful archers can become if you give them an attack buff and other bonuses, same reason that the Mali don’t develop “fire arrows”, although in theory for balance, maybe at some point they will allow them to develop it, easy when they give siege damage to ranged units.

And it is true that the French of the Middle Ages did not excel in archery, or rather, they hated bows because of the English invasion (that is why they preferred crossbows). Perhaps the bonus of the “Patron Saint of France” technology should not be attack, it could be something more related to the bonus that complements the civ, such as “Production time”, which they already have in Stables and Galleries of Archery. Maybe adding “Monasteries increase the production of nearby barracks, shooting galleries and stables by +20/+30%”, and goes with the very concept of the idea. If it is considered very broken, increase its development price, since those are balance issues. Aesthetically, a statue of Juana/Joan/Jeanne could appear near the monasteries.