This post should be closed because either the user is trolling or incapable of having a constructive conversation.
Furthermore, it should be clear to everyone who has read some of the posts that Gargarensis either has personal problems unrelated to AoE 2 or is simply trolling,
is unwilling to listen to advice,
and simply repeats everything he said already multiple times.
Finally, another example of not wanting to listen to given advice.
AoE2 players: 40 villagers in Feudal won’t get you closer to victory
Gargarensis: *uses 40 villagers in Feudal and loses
Also Gargarensis:
I have given him the benefit of the doubt, and we have talked privately about his insecurities. I am trying to help solve them, which should help him be more confident.
Hey now, let’s go a little easy on the guy. He clearly has deep-seated self-loathing that he takes out on the game and its players. We should all try to help him overcome his insecurities, rather than bully and troll him, as that will just make his condition worse. Right now, he associates the game with successful people that he is jealous of; being mocked will further intensify his resentment, which could result in escalation of behavior beyond the relatively benign.
I will be honest, you cannot help people who don’t want to be helped, especially on the internet. If I was their friend irl, I would try to do something. You just cannot do that over internet, especially when they are just a stranger. That’s the unfortunate reality of 99% of cases. If he’s the exception and is the 1%, that would be nice.
But I think we all have tried to be nice to them as much as possible. So, I don’t mind a little trolling, especially when it is more funny than malicious.
I’ve been talking to him in DMs, and I think I’m starting to get through to him. I don’t want all my progress to be undone.
First off: I am not trolling. A seasoned forum reader would know the difference between a troll topic and this one. There’s another guy who claims that balance should be made around DM because mamelukes and siege onagers, and that topic went on for pages, and he truly didn’t seem to WANT to understand. So, this is to the guy who asks for the topic to be closed: why on Earth are you quoting a hidden post? It was hidden because it was wrong of me to bring up such an issue. I have a challenge for you: pick a craft, sport or activity for which you have no talent, and see if you can be so attentive to other’s advice.
It was Arabia (randomized by the queue). I myself came up with it, and I’ll explain. I always choose cavalry archer civs. I’m tired of reaching Castle age and not having enough resources to do everything I want: research thumb ring and light cavalry, build an university (for ballistics), research lumbercamp and mill techs, husbandry, bodkin arrow, and start creating cavalry archers. I figured out that if I reach Feudal with 40 villagers and castle with 55, I would have plenty of resources to do all of that.
It WOULD be succesful… if I wasn’t vulnerable to Feudal aggresion.
@Martinurello That was very good.
@Apocalypso4826 You’ve been very supportive and I thank you. However, I understand the backlash I might get if I don’t understand the basics.
If you want to stick with your strategy that’s fine everybody can play the game how they like it.
But If you want to have success with it i think you have to lose a couple more games to be on your actual ELO, as others already said.
What are your prefered Cav Archer civs?
Practically all of them. Mongols, Huns, Magyars, Berbers and Tatars. I haven’t played Cumans because their strategy seems to be oriented to building the second town center in Feudal, and it seems way too advanced for me.
You can’t just go straight for cavalry archers though, because they need a ton of numbers and upgrades to be effective. Going straight for cavalry archers just dies to knights or crossbows because they will always have the better power spike before you can get your cavalry archers with all upgrades going. Typical transitional strategy is to start with archers and build up archer numbers on your way up to castle age. Get bodkin, wood upgrade and crossbow upgrade as soon as you hit Castle age. Then you have the choice of either university/monastery/siege workshop or adding extra town centres. You can get the cavalry archer upgrades like husbandry + bloodlines later when you can afford them. Think about it this way, would you rather have 20-25 crossbows with bodkin as soon as you hit Castle age or 3 or 4 cav archers with no husbandry or bloodlines? Alternatively, you can start with scouts or knights, get husbandry + bloodlines for your knights first, then transition into cavalry archers while pushing with knights.
What’s your thought process behind getting light cav upgrade? It’s not necessarily wrong, depending on the situation, but you’re spending so much food, that’s why you have so little left for all your other upgrades. It’s best to just focus on one type of unit and get all the upgrades for that unit first before adding others. It’s a very typical mistake at low level to get upgrades you don’t need, way before you need them. e.g. Gold upgrade and farm upgrades can wait until you’re aging up to the next age. The only exception to this would be heavy scouts feudal strategy where you might want to get the farm upgrade as soon as you hit feudal. If you find you’re consistently unable to afford anything, it’s very likely that your town centre villager production is not constant. Don’t forget to make constant villagers, even when you’re attacking or being attacked. And having a market is useful to help you afford what you need, especially if you’re floating a ton of resources (usually wood) so you can rebalance your economy.
If you’re dying in Feudal age, that indicates that you’re staying too long in each age. So you need to go fast feudal and go aggressive and keep adding villagers until you’re up to about 38-40 villagers. Typical villager distribution if you’re fighting in feudal would be something like 12 on wood 18 on food and 8 on gold then click up to castle, then redistribute farmers to wood or gold after clicking up, depending on what strategy you’re going for.
If you’re really set on the idea of straight cavalry archers, your only other option is to fully wall your base and do a fast castle strategy. It’s not advisable if your map is very open with forward resources like berries and gold, but it’s much easier to achieve at low level and it’s an essential strategy to know. You’ll need to make some dark age farms and mill deer if you can afford the wood. Fully wall your base and go up to feudal age with 28 villagers with the last 3x vills 26-28 sent to gold. If you are fully walled, Do not get any economic upgrades or make any military in feudal age. This is very important. When you hit feudal age, make an archery range + blacksmith and send your next 2x villagers to gold. You should have enough food and gold to click up to castle age if you don’t get any upgrades or military. If not, you can either make a few more villagers or if you’re very close, just idle your TC for a minute so you can afford it. Then on your way up to castle age, add another archery range and get all your economic upgrades + fletching.
The most important thing to remember, dark age is the most vulnerable time in the game. You have no economic upgrades, no towers, no military aside from very weak militia. So without walls and just 40 villagers in dark age, you will 100% die to literally any feudal strategy, even straight skirms. You want to get out of dark age as soon as possible. And even with walls and fast castle strategy, you should never be making more than 28 villagers in dark age.
Maybe just try Cumans your palisades have more HP and your sables and archery ranges are cheaper.
And maybe If you go to feudal with like 30vills and then make a second tc you’re faster to your 55 for Castle.
Turks, Saracens, Japanese, Bulgarians and vietnamese are also not bad with cav Archers.
This makes sense. This also explains the desperation I’ve been feeling in past matches. I knew it was foolish to wait until I started producing cavalry archers to have any sort of offensive power.
A counter for skirmishers. In fact, I always strive to create a triunvirate of units. In the case of Mongols or Berbers, it’s cavalry archers - light cavalry - camels; in the case of, say, Magyars, it’s cavalry archers - light cavalry - pikemen. You advice me to “focus on one type of unit and get all the upgrades for that unit first before adding others” and it makes sense too. So yeah, it would probably be best to concentrate on archer smelter tech or Thumbring before researching light cavalry.
Overall, thanks to your post, I’m beginning to see where I’m going wrong. I would never have thought that not getting economic upgrades in feudal is essential to advance quickly to Castle - I always thought that the lumbercamp and mill techs are a must.
I’ll try them next, maybe they’ll surprise me.
I’m sorry to be making this back-to-back post, but I want this question to be on it’s own. It’s about build orders. I’ve been reading some for scout rush and archer rush. What they don’t specify is how to defend yourself. Suppose I make an archer rush in Feudal and my opponent does a scout rush. What do I do? The build order never instructed me to create a barrack. Well, of course it did, but only for unlocking the archery range. Creating spearmen would be out of place regarding the order. You see where I’m getting at? After watching some videos I know that scout rush is blocked with quick walling. So, let’s work with the opposite situation. My opponent does an archer rush and I’m the one doing scouts. I have no archery range. I could chase my opponent’s archers with my scout, and then we would be unable to really attack each other.
Another question: I’ve read the scout rush for begginers and it instructs to hunt the boars before the sheep are finished. Why is that? I always eat all the sheeps before proceeding to boars (naturally I put villagers in berries in the meantime). I need to know why making it simultaneous is better.
Yeah, build orders are meant to just get you set up, then you have to adapt. In the case of scouts, add a few spears in with the archers. If they’re doing lots of archers, you can add a range and go for some skirms.
Hunt is the fastest food source to collect by a significant margin, eating it earlier than most of your sheep means you can hit Feudal Age sooner, and still have sheep left over. You also don’t want to add too many on berries (4 is usually enough), because it’s a slow food source to collect.
The triumvirate theory is not wrong, but the triple composition you should be aiming for is gold unit + trash unit + siege. Main gold unit as your power army (e.g. knights, crossbow or unique unit from castles), trash unit (costs no gold) to fill its weakness (scouts/light cavalry/hussar, skirmishers or pikemen/halberdier) and siege (mangonel, rams, scorpions, trebuchets, bombard cannon).
You don’t need to make camels every game. You only need camels if the opponent is making scouts, knights or cavalry archers, because that is the only purpose of camels; to counter mounted units. If the opponent is not making knights or cavalry archers (or scout line) or he can’t make them because he is a meso civ (Mayans, Aztecs or Incas), it’s a mistake to make Camels.
This chart should help you:
You need one mainline unit (one of mlitia line, knights, and crossbows), and one counter unit. The counter unit should counter the counter to your mainline unit. So if you go knights, make skirms too. You need to know what your opponent is making before making a counter unit, since you aren’t familiar enough with the game.
It depends. The example I gave you was a specific Fast Castle example which you should only attempt if you have fully walled your base and you’re also doing a fast castle strategy. If you’re planning to be more aggressive with a fast feudal rush, you will need economic upgrades and you’ll need to spend resources on re-enforcement to replace what you’re losing in battle. Going fast castle without building walls is basically just a recipe for suicide
Yes, of course. Funny thing is, every single match for the past two weeks has been against a cavalry civ. People really like doing scout rush in arabia. So, I have internalized making camels. I’m not completely stupid, and I know that camels are useless if I go against an american civ.
(By the way, it’s american civs, not meso. Mesoamerica is literally middle America, and the Incas are from the South).
Oh, so very nice of you! Like I said before, I have some minimal knowledge of how the game works.
Indeed, I have a lot to learn. However, when the match is starting and the info screen shows up, and the map is arabia and my opponent is franks, only one thought comes to mind: cavalry counters, because the scout rush is a-coming.
Case in point: I’ve just played two matches in ranked, and I won. Yes. I can upload them here to prove it. First match was against franks and he tried to scout rush me. Second match was against portuguese; it was arena so there was no rushing, but he made cavaliers. So it’s pretty safe to assume that in every match, I’ll have to do camels. I was mongols in both matches by the way.
Mmm… fast castle sounds like the best strategy for me if I’m so adamant in making cavalry archers. I’ll probably need tips for walling. I guess pre-walling with houses in Dark age is essential, right?
