When the dev took away the Villager upgrades in feudal they never gave them something new which was weird to me Incas were always the weakest of the Meso-civ and It is confusing that they decided nerf them instead of Aztecs or Mayans. I have four idea on how to buff Incas
The first idea is too expand on the idea of Incas being a counter units civ and give them +10% to all bonus damage.
The second idea is too give them Inca villagers the archer upgrades so that when they garrison they will shoot more arrows.
The third idea is replace give to make farming upgrades give a discount on each farm instead of increasing the food each farm can produce. making farms cost 60/42/28/18 with each upgrade while only providing 175F. it’s much better to built a farm for 28W then reseed it 8 minutes later when your economy can better afford it making boom easier. Also remove the faster farm team bonus its a bad team bonus and it has too synergy with the buff that I just proposed. make the free Llama the new Inca team bonus.
The fourth idea is just a water down version of the third idea each farm upgrade makes farms 5% cheaper
What if villagers could drop off food from farms at castles, and farms provided a 50% projectile damage blocking effect like the Hussite Wagon, or gave allied units +1 elevation effect while standing on it? That would let farms be used strategically around castles to shield units or make them stronger, as well as making archer raids less effective on the economy.
A much better team bonus because the current one is trash, Infantry +2 LOS could fit here
Barracks technologies cost 33% less, one of the military bonuses still unused, so you have a super good Men at arms rush-Towers here, and switching from archers to eagles a much better choice and identity.
There was a similar pinned post about the Teambonus some time ago…
One of the resolution discussed was moving the unique castle tech Andean sling (slingers + skirmishers no minimum range) to be the Teambonus as this tech fits the typical power level very well.
The tech “couriers” (which was cut from the game at some point) could be re-introduced and give some kind of speedbonus.
For example:
all footunits +0.05 Speed (or 5%)
This would increase villager and tradecart production slightly (similar to the Berber bonus) but also mean that all military units have a very small micro advantage over the same enemy units that lack a speed bonus…
But I also like your proposed changes. They sound interesting.
Just make the team bonus “units on farms move 20% faster”, including vils and trade carts. Or make that a civ bonus and make the team bonus the +5 pop per house.
Simple as. It’s an early game eco bonus for the food heavy inca army, but the 24/min cap stops it from being OP lategame, and it’s also a defensive bonus to help them against early pressure. Lategame inca is fine, slingers are good, kamayuks are good, full barracks and archery range is good, their siege isn’t bad and they have redemption +3 monks. It’s getting there that’s rough.
Also thematic with inca roadbuilding- instead of building roads, you build farms. Like on your trade route, in your base. It’s a nice little touch.
The stuff proposed by @UprightAtol98 should be saved for another civ, with the all units are faster tech. Here we can have a more elegant solution, and as I said, it should be an early game buff more than a late game one.
Lategame Incas suffer a lot in Pro matches as they have great counters (in theory) but they all require gold while switching from one unit type to another also costs gold. Therefore in many games players commit to a unit type thereby not using the other good option Incas have (in theory…).
That’s an issue of meso civs in general, not just of incas. If I have to be honest no minimum range on skirms is never going to be as good as +1 damage and range (huge in trash wars vs hussars) or 1 extra projectile (huge on a similar level). Maybe something should be done in that direction too, but incas have a very deadly eagle pike slinger push that is expected to end the game- either in your favor, or not, if the gold runs out fast enough, same as plume eagle from mayans.
Their versatility comes at a cost- currently, of being usable at everything, but good at nothing, similar to saracens a bit with the tech tree. And also the cost of worse than average lategame due to lacking a raiding unit. The cost should be one or the other, and with meso civs it’s the former. Incas need an eco bonus to put them on par with mayans and aztecs, although arguably (not really) both of those should receive nerfs to their economies.
True actually, I keep saying “meh” to myself when I roll aztecs. Sure, the eagle pike spam is good, but there is nothing that great about the civ anymore. I need to see the pro winrates on tourneys on arabia with them, but I don’t feel like they are S tier anymore.
I just don’t enjoy playing Aztecs. Their archers are pretty average, they lack cav and gunpowder, as well as halberdier. They have nice monks and good infantry, but I personally don’t really like using either of those units very much. I can understand why people like to put them in S tier because of the eco, but they never really seem like they are the kind of civ that truly deserves that kind of placement as far as other parts of their playstyle go.
Incas don’t need a buff. They need a rework.
The only bonuses that should stay are their 10 pop houses and stone discout.
They are supposed to be a late game civ specialized in counter units. But they don’t have any kind of gold sustain like turks, aztecs and mayans (who are also mesos), persians, spanish, etc; or any kind of scaling food bonus like aztecs and mayans, khmer, slavs, etc for late game and fulfill their role.
The llama and extra pop houses are good for feudal maa-archers but they don’t have any military bonus that helps them punch. They used to have towers, but now that’s in the past. In castle age, they have to pay 200 food and 200 gold just to get their eagles to be cost efficient against knights without the economy to back them up like aztecs and mayans. They can castle drop about 20 or 30 seconds faster than other civs thanks to the stone discount and armored vills but in the current meta that’s not a good idea, and at high elo matches it’s almost impossible unless your opponent was distracted. Then again, setting up feints is harded for a civ without light cav or the eco to produce diversions. No way to distract your opponent unless you are already overrunning him or it’s a team game.
Incas are pure garbage at higher elo levels when you fight people who have around the same skills as you. Once you get pushed it’s super difficult or there is no chance to make a comeback, unlike there would be if you played berbers, mayans, poles, burgundians, ethiopians, etc.
On the other hand, I believe Incas are thought like a defensive civs which rely mainly on counter units, vil toughness and defenses.
Not sure if infantery techs discount would fit the theme, but it could be a good idea if they want to take the civ on another direction
My problem with incas is that, while with their wider tech trees and access to unique counter units I feel like they were supposed to be the strongest meso in the late game, they’re actually weaker than Mayans and Aztecs in imp due to worse power spikes and lack of bonuses for longer lasting access to gold, which is crucial for meso civs.
I have no real ideas on how to fix that, maybe give them something to replace hussars or bombard cannons which are the key late game techs for 1v1 that are not accessible by meso civs to differentiate them from Mayans/Aztecs, but giving them an additional UU feels awkward since they already have 2.
On the other hand I don’t think they need buff for early/mid game, their early game is solid and their mid game is decent aswell
I don’t think this should be an Inca bonus, but it’s an idea for an interesting civ bonus that I thought of. What if the civ could start researching techs from the next age an age early, but only while advancing. The effects wouldn’t be allowed to apply until reaching the next age, and the tech would cancel if the age up upgrade was cancelled. This could allow for some very potent powerspikes as soon as the civ hit the next age, but then power would taper off over time. I don’t think it really suits Incas, but it could be an option.
Here is my full list of things I think could suit Incas:
Slinger rate of fire reduced to 1.8 seconds, from 2.0 seconds and projectile speed increased from 5.5 to 6. The standard projectile speed for most archer units is 7.0 so this change would make slingers easier to use hit and run with. The slow projectile speed also means that enemies are more likely to dodge, even if only by accident, which only serves to further increase the lack of use that slingers see. The reason that they aren’t used very much, is because, as an anti-infantry unit, for the Incas a mix of archer line and another infantry unit is likely to be more successful. Slingers just don’t have the stats required, and they are tricky to micro, making them undesirable in the eyes of the average player.
Team Bonus changed so that that A) lets farmers drop off food in Castles, and B) units attacking while standing on or within 1 tile of a completed farm that you own have their elevation level count as one level higher than the level they are actually on. The current team bonus is one of the most useless in the game, at any level of play. It is undeniable that it needs replacing. This suggestion is intended to make the Incan players build Castles at strategic places, then use the villagers to farm around the castle, meaning that they can repair or build more if required, and units then get a defensive advantage while fighting around castles. This would also extend to trebuchets, giving the Incas a slight edge in trebuchet wars. This bonus would not affect movement speed for any players, or alter enemy units in any way.
Elite Slinger added. Elite Slinger has 50HP, 5 Pierce Attack, +13 attack against Infantry, the same other attack bonuses as regular slinger, 1.8 seconds rate of fire, 6 range, and 6 projectile speed. All other stats are the same as the regular slinger.
Villagers get +1/+1 armor while building and repairing, starting in Feudal Age. This could possibly stack with an additional +1/+1 per age, up to +3/+3 in Imperial. This could make greater incentive for tower rushing and castle drops, and be an interesting play into both the fortifications and the heavily armored vils.
Villagers can construct siege engines after building a siege workshop. This isn’t necessarily a great fit, but it does incentivize the Inca player to send vils forward to push the enemy.
The following are possibly ideas, but I’m not sure if they would be as good:
Incas start with the location of the 8 closest herdables revealed, to be kind of like the lama bonus and give easy food scouting at the start.
Incas begin with knowledge of all the stone mines on the map. This would help because it gives clues to where the enemy may be located, as well as playing into the theme of building fortifications everywhere.
Villagers get blacksmith upgrades from Feudal again. This could be an option, because with tower rushing nerfed, this is more likely to protect the Incas from raids, but not necessarily be used for tower rushing.