Italians and Byzantines need to change their dialogue language

[PCDragon3979]

With the upcoming Romans using Latin as their language, the current medieval Latin used by Byzantines and Romans makes it redundant, so I think the Byzantines should speak Greek, while Italians speak Italian.

[Jackbrick]

By all means but this should not be a top priority. This doesn’t have any meaningful changes like balance changes or something.

[MUTYLATOR5553]

In addition, Goths civ should speak Gothic.

[DukeOfLorraine]

Yes yes and yes

• medieval italian
• medieval greek
• gothic

There is no shortage of documentation for them, even for gothic that is the most obscure of the 3, a partial translation of the Bible exists.

I might add the Huns to the list, who currently speak mongol, but their language is unknown (even “Attila” is a gothic name, meaning “little father”). Civ 5 had to “cheat” by making Attila speak a siberian language, perhabs the same could be done.

[PCDragon3979]

@Jackbrick

By all means but this should not be a top priority. This doesn’t have any meaningful changes like balance changes or something.

The Imperial bonus is of no use for 1v1 maps, because their trade unit discount is only good for team games. Might as well make it a Team Bonus alongside Condottieri. The new Imperial UT is up to you guys to craft.

As for Byzantines, they are good in defense, but terrible in going on the offensive, since your dearest friends Paladin and Arbalester are not fully upgraded (Cavs lack Bloodlines, Blast Furnace, and archers have no other exciting bonuses). Maybe Logistica buff Paladins and Archers in terms of attack, at the cost of durability?

@DukeOfLorraine

Yes yes and yes

• medieval italian
• medieval greek
• gothic

There is no shortage of documentation for them, even for gothic that is the most obscure of the 3, a partial translation of the Bible exists.

I might add the Huns to the list, who currently speak mongol, but their language is unknown. Civ 5 had to “cheat” by making Attila speak a siberian language.

As said before, it would be nice to have the Byzantines and Italians speak their own respective languages.

For the Goths, there’s little knowledge for the Gothic language, but I was thinking them speaking Norse like Vikings, since their origins were old Norse, since their ancestral hometown was southern Scandinavia.

As for Huns, their language is disputed. Some say it’s Gothic, but their origins are Mongolian, hence their reusing Mongol dialogue makes sense.

[DukeOfLorraine]

@PCDragon3979

For the Goths, there’s little knowledge for the Gothic language

Gothic Bible

There only is a translation of the very best-seller book in history Dictionaries were made from it, and pronunciation was also reconstructed. For a few dozen spoken lines, there should be more than enough material, we’re not talking about dubbing the entire game.

[MUTYLATOR5553]

Translated into the Gothic language by Ulfilas, an Arian bishop, circa 350.

(The Gothic-alphabet version:)

    𐌰𐍄𐍄𐌰 𐌿𐌽𐍃𐌰𐍂, 𐌸𐌿 𐌹𐌽 𐌷𐌹𐌼𐌹𐌽𐌰𐌼,
    𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌷𐌽𐌰𐌹 𐌽𐌰𐌼𐍉 𐌸𐌴𐌹𐌽,
    𐌵𐌹𐌼𐌰𐌹 𐌸𐌹𐌿𐌳𐌹𐌽𐌰𐍃𐍃𐌿𐍃 ###############         𐍅𐌰𐌹𐍂𐌸𐌰𐌹 𐍅𐌹𐌻𐌾𐌰 ###############         𐍃𐍅𐌴 𐌹𐌽 𐌷𐌹𐌼𐌹𐌽𐌰 𐌾𐌰𐌷 𐌰𐌽𐌰 𐌰𐌹𐍂𐌸𐌰𐌹.
    𐌷𐌻𐌰𐌹𐍆 𐌿𐌽𐍃𐌰𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌰 𐌸𐌰𐌽𐌰 𐍃𐌹𐌽𐍄𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌰𐌽 𐌲𐌹𐍆 𐌿𐌽𐍃 𐌷𐌹𐌼𐌼𐌰 𐌳𐌰𐌲𐌰,
    𐌾𐌰𐌷 𐌰𐍆𐌻𐌴𐍄 𐌿𐌽𐍃 𐌸𐌰𐍄𐌴𐌹 𐍃𐌺𐌿𐌻𐌰𐌽𐍃 𐍃𐌹𐌾𐌰𐌹𐌼𐌰,
    𐍃𐍅𐌰𐍃𐍅𐌴 𐌾𐌰𐌷 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐍃 𐌰𐍆𐌻𐌴𐍄𐌰𐌼 𐌸𐌰𐌹𐌼 𐍃𐌺𐌿𐌻𐌰𐌼 𐌿𐌽𐍃𐌰𐍂𐌰𐌹𐌼,
    𐌾𐌰𐌷 𐌽𐌹 𐌱𐍂𐌹𐌲𐌲𐌰𐌹𐍃 𐌿𐌽𐍃 𐌹𐌽 𐍆𐍂𐌰𐌹𐍃𐍄𐌿𐌱𐌽𐌾𐌰𐌹,
    𐌰𐌺 𐌻𐌰𐌿𐍃𐌴𐌹 𐌿𐌽𐍃 𐌰𐍆 𐌸𐌰𐌼𐌼𐌰 𐌿𐌱𐌹𐌻𐌹𐌽;
    [𐌿𐌽𐍄𐌴 𐌸𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌰 𐌹𐍃𐍄 𐌸𐌹𐌿𐌳𐌰𐌽𐌲𐌰𐍂𐌳𐌹
    𐌾𐌰𐌷 𐌼𐌰𐌷𐍄𐍃 𐌾𐌰𐌷 𐍅𐌿𐌻𐌸𐌿𐍃 𐌹𐌽 𐌰𐌹𐍅𐌹𐌽𐍃.]
    𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽.

(The same text, transliterated into the Latin alphabet:)

Atta unsar, þu in himinam,
weihnai namo þein,
qimai þiudinassus þeins,
wairþai ##### ###############     swe in himina jah ana airþai.
Hlaif unsarana þana sinteinan gif uns himma daga,
jah aflet uns þatei skulans sijaima,
swaswe jah weis afletam þaim skulam unsaraim,
jah ni briggais uns in fraistubnjai,
ak lausei uns af þamma ubilin;
[unte þeina ist þiudangardi
jah mahts jah wulþus in aiwins.]
Amen.

[DukeOfLorraine]

The censor bot even censors gothic (yawn)

[Mahazona]

If the devs have enough budget for a new voice set might as well use that money to make a new civi voice set rather than fix old.

[MUTYLATOR5553]

What I like about the new civs is that they are definitely better suited to the Middle Ages in terms of spoken language. For me (Pole), the dialogues of units from Poles civ sound so ancient that it’s funny, for example, “sprawiacz” and “rybitw”. The King’s dialogues with Poles civ sound like from the times of the nobility in Poland, for example, “waćpan” and “waszmość”.

[DukeOfLorraine]

If possible they indeed use medieval languages indeed, the Franks speak late medieval french.

[DukeOfLorraine]

@Mahazona

If the devs have enough budget for a new voice set might as well use that money to make a new civi voice set rather than fix old.

I’m sure they could get some fans to do it themselves

[Quasibrodo]

I don’t really care about the in game dialogue. I appreciate that all the civs aren’t the same but I don’t notice it much beyond that. That’s just my take though. I’m sure for other people it’s a bigger deal.

[Prokman7582]

AoE2DE has its own price still, if I remember correctly.

[Gaudio3342]

It’s a pity they invested resources into recording line of an already existing language in the game (although with some gramatical modifications) instead of recording greek or italian and giving the old latin line to Romans.

[Albeman3246]

@PCDragon3979

while Italians speak Italian.

@DukeOfLorraine

medieval italian

There’s no such a thing as “medieval italian”. Italians language is something italians came up lately, from the italian unification onwards (1848).
The Florentine language has been chosen because it was used as lingua franca from the letterates. But common people used their own language: Venetian, Lombard, Sardinian, Genoese, Ladin, Neapolitan.

From a linguistic point of view, they are completely independent from the national language, with their own grammar, vocabulary and independent literary tradition. The common root was Latin language, so as an Italian I’m not concerned about the use of Latin as in-game language.

Otherwise, it would be more appropriate, from an historic pov, to slit the Italian civ then giving to the actual Italians a modern italian language.

[DukeOfLorraine]

I guess it’s the same for every civ, french too was a patchwork of regional languages until the late 19th to early 20th century. Still they picked one, I assume the version spoken around Paris as it was picked as the standard one.

So yes one medieval regional language would need being picked, most likely late medieval florentine indeed. Or medieval bolognese (first university, also relatively centered between Milan Genoa Venice and Rome)

[Grep0sofHeckels]

Genoese would be the best choice, so as to be consistent with the predominately Genoese theming of the current Italian Civ (UU, Wonder, Banner/Emblem)

[Gaudio3342]

@Albeman3246

italian

"There’s no such a thing as “medieval [language]”. [Culture’s] language is something [modern day people] came up lately, from the [modern country formation] onwards.

From a linguistic point of view, they are completely independent from the national language, with their own grammar, vocabulary and independent literary tradition. The common root was [former lingua franca] language"

Applies for almost any civ in the game

[AlphaCreator727]

I’m sure that nobody cares but Aztec should speak Nahuatl, not that nonsense thing that they speak