Jakcie A.I (Actual AI improvements)

Are there many new hidden AI changes in files? I’ve noticed that the AI ​​is getting better with each patch.

I think that with every patch/season update, the ai always gets additional changes not to its overall performance but to how consistent it can function without breaking. It is not this patch but I remember the Mongol ai around a year ago had this awful bug where it normally will not make another villager until around 10+ minutes in the game. It was never announced it was fixed.

Even though those types of obvious bugs are gone now it does not mean that the ai does not make bad decisions that any decent player would not make. More recent examples can include right clicking into fights, not aging up for 10+ extra minutes, release version of knights templar being broken etc. Although those have been fixed or at way less common from when I saw them.

Are there any particularly significant changes in the files?

Not really besides the new civs being added. Though I do remember mentioning a new “towers“ mode being added like a year ago which I think equates to crucible now.

How well does the AI ​​perform on the new Civilizations?

Decently well. Of course there are obvious missing features/bad plays such as the macedonians never using runestones or its other abilities, the tughlaqs not having good management with elephants, the sengoku japan not having opitimized yatais or the golden horde not making pastures but hopefully thats fleshed out or as I update the mod I get to fix those.

btw. New version is released, enjoy everyone

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Thanks for the information!

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@JakcieChan1178 You might be interested in this information :slight_smile:

All the bugs I’ve found in the new DLC. There are probably more of them there, and I’ll keep playing with the AI to discover the maximum number of errors and bugs.

All AI civ:

After the latest update, AI Hardest difficulty and above (Ridiculous, Outrageous, and Absurd) builds far fewer military production buildings than before. Basically, one siege workshop and maybe two or three barracks/stables/shooting ranges. However, this isn’t enough to replenish its troops after losses in the late game, so even with a lot of resources, the AI ​​simply loses due to a lack of troops,

For some reason, the AI ​​doesn’t age up for 10+ extra minutes (this doesn’t happen very often, but it does happen),

All AIs use the Meteorite for resource gathering, but the AI does not prioritize Meteorites, and instead mines stone and gold on the map, although extracting resource from the Meteorite and protecting it would bring the AI more benefit.

House of Lancaster AI :

Never builds the maximum number of Manors. Generally, the AI ​​builds a limited number of Manors, ranging from 5 to 8 maximum, although the maximum limit is 11.

Golden Horde AI:

Often Golden Horde AI not aging up for quite a long time, even longer than other civilizations,

For some reason, the AI ​​also does not use Double Broadax technology, although it is standard for almost all civilizations.

AI ​​doesn’t research Ovoo Offering and Ovoo Ceremony and thus becomes significantly weaker due to lower stone income. The stone is very important for this civilization,

AI ​​doesn’t use Archery Range, Barracks, and Stables Reinforcements, which greatly slows down the AI’s attack speed and troop recruitment. This is a very important technology for the Golden Horde,

AI ​​does not use Beachhead technology and doesn’t use Rams ability to make a defensive point from it,

AI does not use Glorious Charge technology and the Glorious Charge ability itself,

AI ​​does not use Khan Debuff Arrow technology or the ability itself,

AI ​​does not fully utilize the Relic Ovoos correctly, since even with additional Relics, the AI ​​still does not build additional Relic Ovoos, and the AI ​​does not even build the maximum number of Ovoos that are available after Age up,

AI ​​does not use Triple Shot technology and does not hire Kipchak Archer, nor does the AI ​​upgrade Kipchak Archer.

Macedonian Dynasty AI:

AI ​​often places the Varangian Warcamp incorrectly, especially on water maps. Yes, the AI ​​tries to place the Varangian Warcamp near the water on the shore, but it very rarely succeeds, because of this, the AI ​​cannot hire ships,

AI ​​doesn’t use the Cistern of the First Hill Landmark it still has 9 charges, although the AI ​​should use them to increase the work rate of military and research buildings. Unfortunately, this Landmark is completely useless for AI without a fix,

AI ​​doesn’t use the Palatine School Landmark and also doesn’t recruit Elite Cataphracts, this Landmark is also useless for the AI ​​without a fix,

AI does not hire Huihui Pao, Nest of Bees and Royal Cannon from Foreign Engineering Company Landmark is also currently useless for AI Landmark without fix.

AI ​​does not use Runestones from Atgeirmaðr, Bogmaðr, Varangian Guard and Riddari Knight to buff units,

AI does not use: Riddari Knight - ability Throw Axe, Bogmaðr - ability to Bypass Armor , Varangian Guard - Berserking ability,

AI does not use Liquid Explosives technology,

The AI ​​doesn’t use Cataphract’s Trample ability, I already described this a long time ago - it still hasn’t been fixed.

Sengoku Daimyo AI:

AI ​​uses Yatai strangely. Sometimes the Yatai AI moves from one resource point to another without reason. Then, when the AI ​​researches the Yatai Farm Gather technology, instead of placing Yatai near its farms for passive resource income, the AI ​​does nothing with the Yatai; they simply stand in the places where deer or boars used to be. The AI ​​also often abandons Yatai at the site of resource points and no longer uses them. It’s also necessary to increase the number of Yatai used by the AI (so that the AI ​​uses all), as there are quite few of them, and in the late game the AI has none at all; unfortunately, the AI stops using them, even though they are very useful for placement near farms with their bonus. In fact, Matsuri is currently simply broken for AI and does not provide adequate bonuses and advantages,

AI Sengoku Daimyo has a rather strange initial build, because of this the AI has no wood for further buildings and the AI mines gold only with workers without a Forge.
In short, at the very beginning, there’s some slightly incorrect build order. The AI gets wood, but time is already lost and the AI falls behind in growth,

AI ​​does not use Koka Township Landmark and its abilities Scout a target area and Shinobi ambush, without fix it is useless,

Tughlaq Dynasty AI:

Often Tughlaq Dynasty, as well as Golden Horde AI, do not age up for quite a long time, even longer than other civilizations,

AI very often leaves Worker Elephants idle, it’s cool that AI hires the maximum number of Worker Elephants (20), but AI often leaves them in different places on the map without work. Worker Elephants often stand in the place where resources used to be. I also noticed that when the AI leads an army into battle, it takes several Worker Elephants with it, but why, since the AI doesn’t use the Field Repair Site ability. There are often situations when a Worker Elephant is standing not far from villagers who need to bring resources somewhere, but the villagers carry them to the Town Center over a very long distance; also, Worker Elephants frequently do not approach villagers when they are needed. I’ve noticed that in the late game, the AI often leads almost all of its Worker Elephants in the Tughlaqabad Fort and they just stand there also, I’ve seen multiple times that the AI leaves several Worker Elephants near the Town Center even though they are clearly not needed there,

AI does not use Governor Ajmer (defensive).

AI does not upgrade defensive weapons such as Springald Emplacement and Cannon Emplacement in Tughlaqabad Fort.

AI often uses the bonuses from Tughlaqabad Fort incorrectly. For example, when the AI use Governor Bhakka, which specializes in a Food bonus, there are no farms near the Tughlaqabad Fort. Also, for example, Governor Jalor specializes in Cavalry training, but there are no Stables near the Tughlaqabad Fort, just as there are none near the Tower of Victory Landmark if it is present. This also applies to the Palace of the Sultan Landmark, as the AI also doesn’t know how to use all Governors correctly.

The AI does not use the Trample ability on War Elephants and Raider Elephants.

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Cool that you’ve managed to already collect all these data in such a short period of time! Btw yesterday I was playing a 4 v 4 against Hardest AI unmodded, and all 4 of AIs went to Imp in less than 25 min, in 3 years that I’ve spent playing against AI it never happened, I found it curious that now AI know how to fast imp with various civs, I think it adds a lot of depth if it could be replicable

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You’re welcome! Gathering all this info took me a ton of time, but it wasn’t for nothing :slight_smile:

I want to go more over these limitations and why I can and/or cannot fix these.

For one, you must understand that my control over the ai is limited. For example. Tughlaq worker elephants are very limited to me. I cannot tell them to send one to scout for sheep. I cannot tell them where to go. I can only tell them that if they want an elephant, whether they should prioritize the elephant over other items. But stuff like that only works up to a point. For example I cannot direct elephants or control how far the ai determines a good elephant position, so one elephant can be multitasking a decently far away wood gathering and gold mining operation when you can just make 2 elephants.

That does not mean that those types of reports you make are worthless. Keep them coming actually plz. Me and the devs always miss something to put. For example, yes, the Tughlaq cannon and springald emplacements on their keeps are flat out missing in the eco file and I didnt see that until you pointed it out, they should be making that now.

One thing I do appreciate is build order complaints such as sengoku or playstyle complaints like golden horde, no military production, etc. These do indeed have the potential to be fixed (in a weird, jank way)

The main thing I want to share though is things I think its addition would hurt the ai. Mainly abilities. The main thing I have to share is that “complex“ abilities that require an extra action (example is trample which needs an extra left click) seems to be impossible to implement for me. Unless im missing something because I swear this thing used to be done before but it just does not now. But what I also want to share is the less complex abilities. They can be done, but they are very dumb with it. They auto activate them when in combat as soon as its available. Now that does not sound so bad for things like khan arrows for mongols but for beserker abilities that also give a debuff it makes things more complicated. For now the only abilities I have active that debuffs troops are byzantine spear shield wall and mac archers because they just debuff movement for a pretty good buff. Antoher thing is trample as ai elephants are not smart enough to try and walk to a siege weapon after trampling for example, I find they just destroy their own units as much as their enemy.

Overall, I do appreciate these reports. I honestly cannot implement most of these as I dont have control but whatever I do add from these is thanks to you pointing them out.

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Wow!
Thank you for the very detailed explanation of the situation regarding the state of AI :slight_smile:
I’m in no way forcing you to fix anything or do it the way I want; I just shared the information I found so that you would know what works poorly and what doesn’t work at all, so that it might make it easier for you to update your mod :slight_smile: In any case, I’ve already sent all the errors and AI bugs I found to customer support.
I’m very glad that you released an update to the mod that I and many other players enjoy playing.
Thank you for your work!

By the way, did you manage to get the AI to use missing units? For example, Kipchak Archer…
It’s a shame that many Macedonian Dynasty and Sengoku Daimyo Landmarks don’t work for AI use :frowning: Especially the Macedonian Dynasty…

Anyway, thank you for your work; if I find anything else strange, I’ll share it with you :slight_smile:

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