Make Armenians Historic Again



Disclaimer: No pretence of balance! It’s meant as an example of historical authenticity.

TLDR: “Armenians” dont have enough Armenian flavour, nothing about the civ design is recognisable as Armenian except the fortified monastery. Its especially painful as even legacy civilizations with goofy designs are getting reworked for the sake of authenticity. It is very disappointing for history enjoyers and to those of us who have waited 25 years for this addition. Not even the UU has an Armenian name…(Netadzik).

The current “Armenians” civ does not represent its historic namesake, without this label it would be impossible to guess that it was inspired by the medieval Armenians. The civ designs resembles more so the Swiss Confederation and the Venetian Republic than the Kingdom of Cilicia! Bagratid Armenia fielded the Ayrudzi, which was the name for the cavalry corps ‘numbering one hundred thousand’, composed entirely of nobles who fought as horse archers and cataphracts. It is said that ‘Cilicia could muster seventy thousand knights’, exaggerations I am sure but illustrative nonetheless. Then why are they a naval and infantry civ?

The excuse for this apparent contradiction is that the civ design is based on Cilicia rather than Bagratid Armenia: Yet this highly ironic, Cilician society was even more feudal than Bagratid Armenia, it became a fascinating hybrid by adopting many Latin customs including chivalry. The traditional great estates were broken up and parcelled out to manor lords in order to provide for the training of as many knights as possible in the Frankish style, there was no place within the institutional military for commoners beyond the city and palace guard. That’s why Armenians of this period served as professional infantry under Byzantine, Seljuk and Arab command yet infantry never formed a significant part of their own military composition.

Furthermore the “Cilician fleet” was merely a merchant marine which at best hunted pirates in coastal waters, it is absurd and cruel to call Armenians of all people a naval civ. The focus on monks is also inappropriate because whilst stubbornly Christian they never proselytized extensively beyond the Caucasus, and the Warrior Priest is of course complete fiction. Meanwhile Cilician fortifications had dazzled the crusaders and Cilician engineers helped them extensively with sieges, yet this isn’t included in the civ design at all.

My rework is just for inspiration no pretence of balance, elaborated:
-Armenians have been famous for their smithing since the bronze age, they furnished many empires with their armouries.
-Walled Orchards were and still are an iconic part of Armenia’s economic life, much more authentic than the totally generic mule cart technologies.
-Nakharars were the great houses of the nobility who could afford to fight as cataphracts and for which they were renowned.
-Merchant marine of Cilicia represented by militarisation of civilian ships.
-Trade cart bonus to represent the powerful network of Armenian merchants.
-Fortified monasteries were utilized as forts out of necessity during periods of foreign occupation.
-Trebuchets represent the great workshops and engineers of Cilicia.

If you would like to read the great comments discussing the balance issues check the og post:
https://www.reddit.com/r/aoe2/comments/1jhgy5f/make_armenians_historic_again/

7 Likes

“Cataphract Archer” sounds very interesting, but:

  • Arrows dealing splash damage, replacing Logistics, means Nakharars would handle mass archers better than Cataphracts.
  • They’d be better against heavy cavalry than Cataphracts since they can kite, unlike Cataphracts.
  • They’d deal with infantry much more efficiently.
  • They would negate the bonus damage from Halberdiers, Kamayuks, Camels, Camel Archers, and Genoese Crossbows.

That sounds overpowered. It’s essentially like massively reducing two major weaknesses of Cataphracts. Only Ballista Elephants, Elephant Archers, Hussite Wagon or War Wagons could likely deal with them efficiently, unless Nakharar’s other stats are reduced.

Very nice, I agree, their lack of historical accuracy is mind-boggling.

I already replied to your reddit thread actually. The fine balance of the proposed changes doesn’t matter as much as the idea of change itself. They deserve this.