We’re getting back-to-back first time appearances of BF and Michi in ranked. That are also the custom game crowds two absolute favorite maps to play. Are you intending to argue this is not the result of the vote being available to custom game players?
You can try to pretend there’s no concrete evidence for this. But this dramatic shift in maps selected is clearly the result of an in-game vote for a game mode only played by a minority of the playerbase.
Elo IS experience. You can cope all you want but bud we both suck at the game. If you or myself were actually good enough to have informed opinions on what maps should be voted in and what the effects of our votes would be we’d be 1200+
Elo is not experience, it measures your skill. You can have 1000s of games and still be Low Elo, yet you gained experience
The only evidence you have is that a “dramatic shift” has happened. If it is because single/custom game players are voting just to vote or troll, or a larger part of the player base that didnt log into the forum is now actively voting, is something you don’t know. So don’t come with this kind of claiming. Yell at the “dramatic shift”, but don’t blame whoever you want because that’s what you think of based on nothing.
A lot of this reads as some weird elitism. Not everybody is trying to be an 1800+ ELO player. Lots of people just want to have fun. And a variety of maps is great for that.
You don’t want to play water maps? That’s fine, you should have an option not to. But don’t ask me to play arabia either. It’s the most boring, repetitive thing ever. They should just give more map ban options.
Elo is not experience
“Guys I swear I’m a master tactician I just can’t click fast” ahhhhh a tale as old as time.
DauT has half the APM of the rest of the pros and still wins, what exactly is your excuse for not being higher elo if you’re supposedly so “”“experienced”“”"
If you have an alternative theory I’m all ears.
I also never suggested it was malice. The game prompts single player and custom game players to vote and they do. It has the unintended consequence of the ladder no longer reflecting the preferences of the actual ladder preferences, which was the point of the voting in the first place.
Also, putting something in quotation marks doesn’t make it incorrect, back to back first time ever appearances as a result of player votes DIRECTLY following the change in voting is a exactly a dramatic shift.
Infinite bans doesn’t fix the map pool not being representative of the players who are actually engaging with it.
Sure, so implement a system where you need to play at least 5 games to vote. Also, who said anything about infinite bans? 2 or 3 is more than enough. It’s fine to play a map you dislike once in a while.
5 is far too low. 50 is the minimum.
It’s fine to play a map you dislike once in a while
And it’s not fine to have the majority of the maps be things that the majority of the ranked playerbase dislike. These games are minimum 30 minutes. Life’s too short to sift through 4 black forests before I can have fun.
There is the elitism I was talking about. If you’ve bought the game, and you’ve played 5 online games, you have a stake in it as far as I’m concerned. Also, why stop at 50 then? Make it a hundred. Or even two hundred.
A majority of players don’t dislike those maps, that’s just your perception. Most of the unpopular ones did get there by votes, even if you think they are somewhat biased.
I would absolutely be on board for this if it weren’t for the nicher nature of the game making that pool of players limited to the extent individuals and interpersonal interactions would determine the map selection. If the playerbase was more like 50k daily this would absolutely be the solution. But 50 will have to do.
People who know how the game works inside and out should be the ones determining something as major as the map rotation. This was the unintended effect of having the map vote be obscured on the website previously and moving the vote in-game has unintentionally ruined the ladders map selection.
Either the vote should be limited to people who know what they’re doing, or the vote should be limited to one map on the selection that can easily be struck by players.
Hmm. That would also mean you’d have to a political pundit or something to vote, wouldn’t it? At least a BSc in politics, or you don’t really know what you are talking about.
But hey, what you are saying will never go through. If it does, a lot of people will leave including me (and I have played way over 50 games). Chill, dude. I understand you are passionate, but you don’t have to ruin other people’s fun to have yours. You can just ask the devs for a ban option.
Ban option isn’t coming. It’s a logistical impossibility with wait times and accurate elo matching. Community has asked since 2019, time to accept facts. We will NEVER get infinite bans, it’s not on the table. Not because the devs hate us, but because they simply can’t implement it without things getting worse for the ladder.
You can keep screeching about elitism and now apparently politics(?) if you want, but you’re continually not forming any actual counter argument to my points.
You’re claiming I’m trying to take the fun away from other people while the map vote is currently objectively influenced by those who don’t even play ranked, all while threatening that you will leave if this ever changes? Is this not trying to take my fun away, as well as others?
I am not begrudging other players of not engaging in the ranked map mode or engaging with it in a limited capacity. I am thankful for the well roundedness of AOE2. But as a campaign/1v1/diplo player I shouldn’t be able to influence how Empire Wars, Death Match, Teams, CBA, Battle Royale, or a variety of other game modes are played, even if I dip my toes into them once and a while. They similarly should not have control over my time with the game. Leave the ranked ladder in the hands of dedicated ranked ladder players and nobody else.
Not letting people turn this into a concern troll circus where we pretend like this is about elitism and toxicity and inclusivity when it’s about a poorly implemented feature that prompts ALL players to influence 1 game mode regardless of if they play it.
Even a simple change like prompting players about the map vote on the ranked menu instead of the main menu would do wonders to fixing this.
Yeah as said Elo ≠ Experience. Elo originated from chess and measures your skill.
You can be 2k Elo and just have 100 games in as well as having 1000s of games and still be 900 Elo because you struggle at certain parts of the game.
I use hotkeys, have a peak eAPM (the more important APM as it ignores button spamming) of 100-120 in most of my games but struggle against certain rushes.
The player with 100 games and 2k elo who can beat those rushes is more experienced than you
This is a true statement. Saying single/custom game players are the ones to blame without any info is not.
The game now gives them the OPTION to vote, it doenst FORCE it. You are just jumping into this conclusion that they are voting indeed. We had until some weeks ago the preference of a very, very, very small part of the ranked playerbase voting. With the voting system in game, a broader part can vote. It can be that most of those new voters just rather these different maps, single/custom players are voting, both cases, we do not know unless the devs tell us it.
The game prompts all players regardless of which game modes they engage in to vote on the ranked map. This combined with all the new maps being custom game lobby favorites is evidence enough that this is the result of the bigger custom game scene overwhelming the poll and out voting competitive players on a gamemode they don’t even play.
You’ve yet to suggest an alternative theory on why this has happened. I notice.
The voting system dilemma is like the situation a cancer patient (let’s suppose it’s still at curable stage) faces when the doctor informs him of several alternative medical treatments. You know they are all bad and they will all imply pain, but the patient needs to bite one. So the patient will try to choose the optimal treatment: what may give him the promise of better results, under the least pain.
In the map vote, you vote taking in account your vote might not change the whole final decision, as it is just a small drop of water in an ocean. This is why, ultimately, I just take what comes.
You might not find that “x is not the best map type for you” and “you like more y map”, to avoid those s-situations you don’t like and usually happen in such maps, with an expectable type of team players… And that’s totally fine. Yes, there’s ban on maps but you can’t ban them all so… either in one way or the other, you will have to come across maps that don’t - usually - bring you the best of fun.
Then there are maps that go like food… A few weeks ago you loved them, now you prefer other maps, as you get bored of those maps or the specific game mechanics associated with those maps. So map preferences may also change, and it’s just expectable people may change their map vote types, favorite maps and even map bans, when people have them.
An A-map type played with minimally capable players generally implies, like gravity, that the game starting strategies are restricted to a specific type and other strategies will more than likely fail. In another B-map type, those same A-starting strategies that would be expectable in such matches may ruin your game early on in B, and vice-versa.
This is why I adopted this rule… Play whatever map comes, see the map-type differences as learning opportunities… Don’t be salty that you did not get the perfect map, just because of the map.
Another thing is “yeah but it’s expected to find very unbalanced games in A or B maps”. This is where the problem is not ultimately about the map but about each players’s strenght, team strenght and skills… If you have very skilled players all in team 1, and the least skilled players in team 2, you know steamroll of team 2 is clock-ticking, especially in ELO’s below 1000 (where you will come across players that you think are far way beyond the real ELO displayed - smurf cases - and where you stand 0% chance of fighting).
Map type alone does not determine if the game is going to be more fair or balanced.
The skill difference of teamplayers - either in each team and compared to other team players -, if abysmal, is the most determining factor to game fairness. This is where it can get tricky as there are no guarantees that game rigging can’t take place:
I’m more interested with fair game issues than map-tantrum. When the team game is massively unbalanced, you know the map is never the real problem. When playing with players that are not honest about their elo skills in the so called normal games, and everything is working normally in both teams, the map will not prevent a fair game.