天朝(Celestial Empire) or Heavenly Dynasty is an actually used title in Chinese history.
We know that Chinese variant civilization is based on the Neo-Confucian sect developed by Zhu Xi
In the Confucian view, the emperor is appointed by heaven, and the person who becomes the emperor also receives the 天命(Mandate of Heaven)
Heaven is an important concept in Confucianism. Historically, Chinese emperors who obtained the Mandate of Heaven called their dynasties the “Celestial Empire”
This name is also more like a normal civ name
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Simply call it the Song or Ming dynasty, so that it is in line with both the Abbasid and Ayyubid dynasties.
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Yes, but it’s still kind of weird as a name…
Well, as I understand it, Koreans also tried to adapt the concept of heaven’s command to their culture around the middle ages during the Goguryeo Dynasty. Then the question would remain whether the civ is a variant of the Koreans or the Chinese.
But yes, it is a nice name, I have to admit that (“Celestial Empire”).
As an additional note, something curious about the “Jade Empire” name: and that I think none of us realize is that the first name for the variante, “Jade Empire” could have create more confusion in the future of the franchise, since there is another civ that used jade excessively: The Mayas (If it is which in the distant future is considered adding them). And I’m making a Mayan concept, but since right now there is all the paraphernalia of the new expansion, I prefer to release it after November.
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The Heavenly Dynasty was a term used by neighboring countries in ancient times to refer to China as a unified dynasty, and it was also a respectful title given by officials to their own court during the authoritarian era. The term ‘Heavenly Dynasty’ originated from the Han Dynasty in China. Due to their strong national power, the Han and Tang dynasties established a Heavenly Dynasty system with China as the suzerain and neighboring countries as subordinate and vassal states.
And the affiliated and vassal states refer to China as the Heavenly Sovereign, such as Goguryeo, Turkic, and Xue Yantuo. The term used by feudal kingdoms throughout history to refer to their own country as the political, economic, and cultural center of the world, and as the “Heavenly Kingdom” leading the surrounding barbarians in various aspects.
In fact, the term “heaven dynasty” is a bit arrogant and disdainful towards other places.
Usually, only a dynasty that unifies the Central Plains and radiates culture and technology to neighboring countries is called the “天朝”.
The dynasties that achieved this in history include Han, Sui, Tang, Ming, and Qing.
Anyway, the name ‘Heavenly Dynasty’ is better than Zhu Xi’s…
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I agree with this suggestion, Many people have mentioned the name ‘Celestial Empire’,not a controversial historical figure. The Celestial empire is a self proclaimed concept that has existed in China since ancient times, and is not a fictional concept. And Zhu Xi’s Neo-Confucianism provided a basis for the legitimacy of royal power. The Celestial empire is also a respectful title for the court, which is in line with the variant civilization of Chinese centered around the ruling ideology of the court.
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My complain about ZhuXi’s Legacy is that it feels incompatible with the original civ “Chinese”. Actually I consider all variant civs name is separated when comparing with their original civs’ name.
I personally recommend
Chinese → Chinese (Something Make Sense)
ZhuXi’s Legacy → Chinese (Neo-Confucianism)
but it seems many people dislike such method of naming like Civilization franchise. And I can’t come up with a better naming way either.
If the new DLC of the Chinese is militarized and full of aggression, I think “Conqueror Dynasty” would be a very intuitive and good name.
This name is too Western, I tend to directly use specific dynasties or military designations that have existed in history as the name.
The problem is that we already have Song and Ming Dynasties in China
This is not a problem, just like in the game where both the Yuan Dynasty and Mongolia exist, the conventional CHN can be seen as a macro dynasty, while the variant CHN is a micro dynasty.
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Is that a problem?
As far as I can tell, they are barely represented with very small bonuses. Like Yuan’s bonus being 15% movement speed and unlocking Firelancers–is that truly representative of the Yuan? The Chinese as a civilization features 4 such periods, and cannot really afford to make them any more complicated lest they wish to make it more bloated.
So while both Ming and Song are technically in the game, I don’t see why a variant civilization could not fully represent one of those dynasties. I believe this would the best way to do a variant, anyways, as it uses the same state entity, but concentrated into a specific period with a specific identity to better represent them individually.
I did not check, but I think it is a problem as long as I am not sure any of those dynasties last from 800 to 1600, time period covered by the game.
Actually it’s 750 to 1650 but yeah…
Seriously just rename/ remove the entire “dynasties” system and free those names
Historically every dynasty transformed into another dynasty anyway means violent/ coup/ civil war or foreign invasion. Every emperor would want their dynasty to last forever of course. Imagine every time you “advance” to the next age and there is a civil war happening in your base.
Agree with this man ,
Now i know why it called Empire of Jade
It’s several times better than zhuxi’legacy…In the meaning of design
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