Mongol improvements in early game

For me the Mongols are very good in castles and imperial. Especially for the economic improvements and its landmarks The Silver Tree and Steppe Redoubt.

The Mongols are an aggressive civilization but are they doing it after the last patch?

Nobody wants to tower rush (developers and players). It seems correct to me, but according to the numbers almost 90% of the games the Mongols go for tower rush.

Many people want early lancer but I think the feudal unit of the Mongols is the Mangudai. While they have 85HP (about the same as a spearman or archer with 70HP) and their weaknesses are horseman (+9 Feudal bonus) and spearman (+15 Dark/+20 Feudal bonus) when you have a mass they are unstoppable!

How to improve aggressiveness in the early game?
I think one solution would be to give them free Survival Techniques.
This would be related to their nomadic identity and their movement on the map. It would make sense to have stables in the dark ages and be aggressive. You could go with early horseman without problems. It would also make more sense to give villagers a +15% speed bonus when building the landmark Deer Stones.

How to improve the mongolian defense in the early game?
A great Mongol weakness is the protection of his ovoo, this gives him improvements and bonuses. The ovvo has 1500HP and after the last patch you have to change its location faster. How to protect it? It is currently protected by towers and military buildings. I was thinking that a way to protect it would be to build a 2nd TC, but currently it is not very profitable to make a 2nd TC. Each TC costs 900W which is equivalent to 6 military buildings (150W). Why not change the cost of this building to 400W 300S or some equivalent in wood, 700W?

What do you think?

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I find mongols still be very effective early game. But they do have a serious lack and inability to deal with spearmen.

I think and from how it looks like. Mongols were designed to Dark Age rush the opponent and use bounty to make up for their lacking early eco.

I say, give back the original bounty.

Drushing with Scouts+Horsemen is already pretty strong.
Give the Khan ability to fire all types of arrows from the start instead of locked to ages.
Having Armor-Arrow would allow the mongols to do a quick dive under opponents TC. Or avoid getting insta-rekt by spears.

Reducing the cost of Mangudai would help follow this up. They are still a incredible weak but extremely expensive unit for their strength. They play much better in the early game stage, but their priceyness prevents it, as they are so incredible easily countered by archers and towers.

Being able to follow up the Drush with scout-horsemen army, age up into Feudal and reinforce the army with Mangudai in order to deal with increased number of spearmen defending would allow Mongols to be very aggressive and more in line with their Original Design that the Devs intended for them.

Have you not seen that they’re getting an early game buff tomorrow? They start with a ger now.

i posted this literally hours right before they released the patch notes.

personally I’m not impressed by it. Yes it does change up the mongol early game quite a bit.
BUT I feel more like they just found an “easy” solution, that in the end, wont really change much overall tactics for mongols.
Now I really do like the changes on the upgrade cost into feudal horsemen, that was very much needed.
The tower increased expenses and build time, I don’t really see how it would change mongol tower rush tactics that much.
Increased build time wouldn’t have to much to say for the towers, reducing their health doesn’t overall effect either (as by the time you have enough forces to take down towers) it doesn’t matter much if its taken down 2-3 seconds faster, for the average player.
I do see that it will throw timing off a bit at the very top competitive level. But the tower will still do what the tower initially will do. Slowing down the opponent age up and limiting their resources.

It’s a pretty sizable buff to any early game strategy they take.

It’s 150 wood, plus villager building time.

At the moment with Mongols I am finding it very difficult to get any early building bounty, players can simply have everything around the TC and make archers with a few towers. For a raiding civ there is often nothing to raid, maybe now with the tower nerfs and a faster age time with the ger it may be possible.

I also agree that if the opponent just makes archers and spears vs Mongols they have a really hard time to find a good counter.

Mangudai do need a bit of a boost in some way, so it can deal with the archers and spears combo.

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The main problem with mongols is that they are designed to be strong in dark age, but currently dark age doesn’t last long enough for them to be effective. It would be awesome to see the meta shifting to have more play in the dark age. that way we could see units like the early horseman shine. Maybe they should make advancing to feudal more expensive for all civilizations.

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Funny thing about dark age play is that in large team maps.

Youre first units wont reach the opponent before they already hit feudal lol.

Personally I would love id they doubled the cost of age ups from dark age to feudal.

I think its far to cheap and easy to just skip dark age content all togheter.

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Mongols imo should be strong in dark age and become weaker the longer the game goes. Idk why devs nerfed the early stone production when it was mainly towers that were OP. Making towers very expensive in dark age would have pretty much done the trick and due to the high stone production they could have stayed an aggressive civ in dark age.

Apart from that higher prizes for each age up would be great to me. Imo devs should aim for a very even win distribution across all ages. If it was 10% dark age and 30% for every other age it would be fine with me too though.

But vs English or French Click Surrender

Dev team ■■■■ you Just try to defensive and die