Don’t begin to justify it. Winter is declaring 1v1 dead until fixed. Artosis won’t play until fixed, and I haven’t heard from many others.
There is something wrong with people who defend how it currently is, some breed of shill.
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You are totally right man. I dont like playing against the strat and I dont think it should be a real thing…
I want to see it go away because its retarded.
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But, if we do that, mongol will become like other empires and take out the only asymetry in game. xD
It’s not broken. It’s early and people are just playing the most greedy openings possible.
Lol, this seems like to make the Mongols unplayable.
The simple solution is to create a safe zone. So the Mongols cannot build its TC around your TC. Very simple. Anyways if you can’t deal with it try to find another way to play. I was able to defend myself on a 1vs1 match against the Mongol TC rush. You just have to build a lumber mill 1st. Then make a lot of wood. So you can build the buildings you need the most. For example, granary, quarry etc and barracks. Send your villagers far away so your enemy cannot see you and age up after that. Then buy the siege upgrade train a few infantries and build a ram and chase or destroy the Mongol TC.
The Mongol TC rush is formidable for the noobs. So yeah I understand it, but calling for such nerfs would make the Mongols useless as they have only one plan and it must work in the early game.
I am playing on a rather high level - Elo 1250, Top500 Leaderboard, and i have not yet been cheesed by a Mongol with a TC Rush. That seems a little like a Persian Douche to me, hit or miss, but honestly doesnt sound to difficult to fend off.
On “higher” Elos the common Mongol thing to do is to attack with 2-4 Horseman and the Khan around Minute 4.
I assume that for a newer player, once the panic kicks in that early it seems like a really difficult strategy. Just keep in mind, the Mongol is not producing Vills while moving, the Mongol TC does not have more HP - as far as i know, and technically you should even have more vills beeing able to shoot arrows, or 10 Vills shooting arrows while your other vills do other stuff.
Keep a calm head, know that the Mongol sets himself waaaaaaaaaay back with this, and the only thing not allowed to happen is that he kills you off with this. Then you basically won the game.
I was telling the other guy the same thing. I play as the Mongols and in the custom matchmaking people try this after reading it xD
So I just tried to help the noobs what a delayed TC is far behind economically.
For me as the Mongols, I end the game at the 6-minute mark after having a ram or two in 1vs1.
I think it is the best infantry civ at the moment.
And is an S tier economy civ which is really nice.
Archers and Rams i assume?
If scouted, 1 or 2 Towers at the eco positions, couple of spears to torch the rams. And then the action begins. If not scouted and you went 2nd TC first, then ai ai, good luck fighting with the vills XD
I actually love how the game plays out that early already.
Let the speed improvement be 25% more only. So you can better defend if you see it coming.
Nah, you send you spearmen into the stealth forest to build rams and hide the barracks far away from the Mongol TC so the scouting wouldn’t get any info.
1st you build barracks and send it away.
2nd you build blacksmith after aging up and upgrade the siege. so you infantry can build rams.
3rd train more spearmen and build more barracks and send them close to the enemy.
4th just to secure from enemy raids, build outposts.
5th aim TC 1st with rams take out enemy troops with spearmen and train while attacking the enemy.
And you can defeat anyone in 1vs1 easily.
Archers die real fast bcse most of the people pick French and train cavalry. This is why I prefer spearmen. They think French is the best civ and end up destroyed in 6 mins xD
That’s because the people who are doing it all the time are higher ranked than that.
One of the people wintergaming played against who was also doing the mongol TC rush is currently 37th on the leaderboard. Wintergaming beat him, because he wasn’t even that good at it, yet he’s top 40. I’m guessing from the name that the player who is 2nd on the leaderboard has got there by doing it, too.
From the number of games played, I suspect these are alt accounts where people are just making a point, and they’re stopping doing it once they’ve got to a leaderboard position that they feel proves how broken the strat is.
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You need to hit Feudal and need a blacksmith to get the tech. The TC hits you at 2-3 min which means it can stop you from going Feudal. This strat you propose will only work if you manage to build these things first.
Its not like the TCwont move on. Good players wil micro it to places that will impact your eco or building work.
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This is a bit of an assumption. It could easily be “it doesn’t work once people realise what you’re doing”, and so people stop doing it.
It’s early days for balance yet. I don’t understand the need, less than a week from release, for people to go “this is broken and needs nerfing”. People have barely had a chance to work out counters to certain strategies yet.
Don’t get me wrong - I like developers to be proactive about balance. But I also dislike kneejerk changes from a non-existent meta because the game’s been out five days.
OMG, you can easily hit feudal or destroy the Mongol TC bcse you will have more villagers if you arent a noob that delays TC by not producing villagers. More villagers mean more arrows will be fired at the Mongol TC. And you can easily win the game just like that.
You simply need lumberjack built and then you can build granary using the wood and then quarry and you can age up. These things need to be a little far away. But definitely, the Mongol TC rush is not very effective against pro players. Only effective against noobs
Again you just need to be creative and build that lumber far away. Very simple, Each time the Mongol TC unpack, they are delaying TC which means economically it is far behind you.
Dude calm down man… I have yet to see someone go feudal in 2 min and let alone you stay in your own TC shooting at a other TC for 5-6 min… I am getting the feeling you dont know what meta is…
Your other points are valid tho but it does require you escaping with 2-3 villagers and your opponent not noticing it. It is beatable (have done it myself) but i do think its way to easy for a mongol player to pull off.
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Wintergaming specifically said he’d stop once he got to around the top 100. Now he’s gone back to playing normally, he’s at won 1 lost 7 for today, that’s how inflated the strat made his rating, and he didn’t even keep going to see at what level he’d meet players who were sufficiently better than him that it would stop working.
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I’d like to see how it holds up over the next week or two, for sure. There’s enough evidence in this thread that it’s not outright broken - or at least, could do with a bit of confirmation to make sure it’s not a skill disparity issue vs. outright cheese.
(that said, from what I have read, moving Superior Mobility to Feudal might be enough by itself)
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There is a player who is 37th on the leaderboard from doing a mediocre execution of this strat. We know it’s mediocre, because even wintergaming was able to beat him in a mirror mongol tc rush game. 37th is 3 places above Hera and 2 places below Tatoh, so I’m pretty sure the only skill disparity is going to be that his opponents are miles better than him.
well, if you look at the timing, the tc can be there around 2:03. If that is the case, then prepare for the worst, and when you see that the player will not be using that strat, then you can ease back a bit and play your strategy knowing you will not get cheesed.