My balance suggestions for August patch

Yes, use more sarcasm mate. It’s not like Goths are really bad and that at high level they just don’t cut it.

■■■■, even at 1400+ going against goths is most of the times a free win.

Pick rate indicates what people like to play, win rate doesn’t mean anything. Once again, here’s the win percentage of aztecs on arabia:

Yes, I’m pretty sure that goths are better than aztecs on arabia just because the win rate says so

Let’s completely ignore the fact that the only thing going on for them is loom (+1 vill going up) and militias/m@a in early game. From that moment they are generic and are vulnerable to any of the top tier civ up until they can drop a castle and build up a solid eco that allows them to spam. They literally get slaughtered by any top civ but MuH nUmBeRz SaYs ThEy ArE gOoD

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Is this list updated after that goths got free loom, teutons a huge armor buff, portuguese and koreans a discounted buff, liths a top UU?

I definitely agree with an Italian buff in addition to the fix of the training time of the UU, their picking rate is too bad on arabia. Arabia must be weighted much more than islands since it is simply played around 50 times more.

The list seems a bit out of date imo. Still I am surprised that none except me asks love for Turks. Why this lack of love for Turks?

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Or what they believe can be a certain, secured or easy victory with some specific civs, which is more likely.


Ooohhh ok so all those wins shown on the stats page are fake? Or it comes from high skill being matched against lower skill… People mainly pick goth when they know the opponent is lower skilled than them? and that’s how they pull off these wins, because if it was equal skills then obviously it would be an auto win according to you…

Because you and others can’t seem to understand this… When we refer to pick rate and win rate, we arent saying they are the hard defining proof of anything. But that stats HELP give an idea of how well or how poorly something performs. Having the highest win rate doesn’t mean they are the best civ it means they generally perform better than a civ with the lowest win rate and the actual proof is how many times people are literally winning with that civ. How can you rationally deny that? “even though this circle is round it is not actually curved because etc etc”

Americans don’t literally have 2.6 children. Its physically impossible to have a 0.6 of a child but it gives an idea when needing to determine things.

People in ranked sure as ■■■■ don’t pick their favourite civs because of how much they like them, they pick the civs they believe will help them perform better.

Otherwise why do people lame? Tower rush? Cheese strats? They do anything and everything they can to win.

Yes goths might have difficulty in different scenarios. But statistically they are undeniably doing well across multiple elos and match ups.

A 3 month old post from viper isn’t the absolute proof of anything either…

The guy has numerous times said “this unit is fine” and then it was nerfed or buffed…


I actually think 2.0 fire rate will bring them dangerously close to their former strength

With recent resurge of people complaining about the arambai OP-ness, especially the Arena strat. So I doubt we will see them buffed

50g or 66g sounds more balanced

no, 10g discount would be more than enough


He is true. If I see Goths as an enemy I’m always happy, they are easily countered by almost every civ

It’s a Castle age strategy if you are speaking about double castle and I proposed an elite arambai buff

yet Hera won vs Mbl with Goths against Vikings, MBL even had 4 relics

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Don’t be mad! goths are easily countered and an auto win for many civs. Especially by one of the most powerful infantry civs.

Those wins mean nothing,the player must have cheated (sarcasm)


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Well Viper won as Mayan against Goths, s.hit like that happens sometimes.

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@phoenix1089 “Why Vikings Dominate Goths”. go ask Hera or any other pros if on arabia they’d want vikings or goths. Vikings eat goths alive.
Quoting from the video:
“Goths, oh my god! what’s the point? like… let’s just win first, then we can talk”
“He really tought i was gonna go mayans, vinchester did the same. it’s so risky”
“Vikings should dominate goths, shouldn’t even be a close game”
At the end of the video:
“I don’t understand. People pick goths for one match-up: if i pick mayans they win, if i pick anything else i win”
“there was really never any threat, the match-up is just simple”
“xbows into berserks just dominate goths everytime, there’s no chance whatsoever. you just force them into huskarls and then you go berserks”
reading chat: “if he gets tothe goths spam? he would never get there, and if he gets there i have berserks spam anyway. i will definitely win”.
i’d like to highlight one sentence in particular btw: I don’t understand. People pick goths for one match-up: if i pick mayans they win, if i pick anything else i win. this is the state of the goths: they have one good match up on arabia, against every other top tier civ in that or any other open maps they get shredded. but go ahead, tell me that Hera is wrong, just like viper was wrong 11

the fact that mbl lost 1 game against hera with this match-up doesn’t prove anything. it would be like saying that turks are great in ultra late game with no gold because mbl won an arena game against hera who was playing lith. @JoJo9942 if you could link that game i’d love to watch btw

Here is a “short version” (still 3h+)

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from the description of the video: impossible = really really difficult. Goths have prolly 5% winrate in pro play here imo.

still going to watch it, i want to know what happened for him to win 11

Franks, Celts and Mayans are also with unbalanced winrates across all elo brackets so here is my suggestion.


  • Castles cost 20% less (instead of 25%).
  • No longer have Crop Rotation tech.


  • Siege Weapons fire 20% faster (instead of 25%).


  • El Dorado tech increases Eagle Warriors HP by +30 (Instead of +40).

However all three Mayans, Celts and Franks are perfectly balanced.


Theh Celtic siege is fine and already fires 25% faster but is not stated in the tech tree.

In what world? lol
Check the winrates…

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So why are they overpowered beside winrates? Ohhh wait they are not overpowered


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and? why are they overpowered BESIDE winrates?