Next DLC to fix all DLCs - "Successors and Forebears"

Age of Empires II: DE II - Discussion
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I see a lot of negativity in the forums lately. As a group, the forum wants less civs, but wants to split existing civs which will create more civs. Some want less bonuses and gimmicks while simultaneously endorsing existing gimmicks. The ‘last chieftans‘ also seems to throw up a feeling of finality which seems to be driving the fate of AOE2. To give a chance to the devs to right the wrongs of previous DLCs as well as cater to the demand of civ splits, I propose this DLC “Successors and Forebears”

The DLC will have 5 of the most requested civs and some renames:

The slavs → The Rus (The Successors - New)

The saracens (Arabs) → The Ghassanids (The Forebears - New)

The Vikings(Norse) → The Varangians (The Successors - New)

The Dravidians → The Tamils (The Successors - New)

The Chinese → The Tang (The Forebears - New)

Benefits for devs for quicker development

  • No need for new voicelines for in-game dialogue
  • One of the unique units of existing civs can be shared
  • No need for radical new gimmicks
  • Tech-tree changes can easily make forebears stronger early game and sucessors strong late game

I won’t pretend to be an expert on the topic. If the forum feels, this could be a solution. Please feel free to share your suggestions.

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I don’t understand how it works.
Is it 5 new civs? are the old slavs/saracens and so on then removed?

I just want to say that currently I really don’t want any more than 2 new civs per dlc. it’s already too much for me.

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Yeah, I’m confused what the suggestion is as well. Adding five new civs but they share unique units with existing civs? And have similar but somewhat altered tech trees? How would this be a solution to any of the perceived problems people have with the game?

I think Ghassanids and Varangians are overly specific for civ names, and Tang was a dynasty, so that doesn’t work either. Also, to me as a native British English speaker, Norse is quite a pretentious and not especially accurate way to rename Vikings.

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So like what is this? Any tech trees? Who’s been asking for a long defunct orange drink powder as a civ!?

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Tang. It’sa kick in a glass. An old commercial from like 30 years ago

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I was trying to think how Fanta was involved in here somehow.

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Sounds like Etc Civs spits to me, if so Celts top of the list, Gaels - Celts can remain.

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Pretty confusing post I must say

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How is that a fix? (20 chars)

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To add to that idea, for the benefit of developers, the castles, monks skins and regional units can be the same.

The forbear and successor civs can exist side by side like Romans & Byzantines, franks & burgundians or like Poles & Lithuanians.

This is the design I want to propose for the Tamils which is mainly late game oriented. The civ’s main weakness is archers and skirms

The Tamils - Infantry, blacksmith and trade civilization
• Receive 1 gold for every 10 food collected (Internally counter should count 0.1 gold for every 1 food collected)
• Blacksmith upgrades are 50% cheaper
• Buildings, Ships and Siege are repaired 50% cheaper and faster.

Team Bonus:
Trade units work 10% faster (Move 10% faster and bring 10% more gold)

Unique Techs:
• Bakthi movement (Militia-line, Valari thrower and Monks move 25% faster) (Represents how militantly hindu belief spread)
• Crucible Wootz blade (Infantry and Cavalry attacks ignore armor)

Unique Units:

  • Colandia(சொழாந்தியம்)(Thirisadai renamed) (Warship) Generates +10 gold per kill
  • Valari thrower (ranged Infantry) (castle unit) - High ranged Melee attack(10) unit which can slow enemy units by 10% with a bonus damage of +3 against cavalry. Speed 1.1 and range is 4.

valari
valari640×480 81.7 KB

Overall tech tree can be similat to Dravidians. But late game needs to be buffed a bit to show they were the successor version. Some minor tweaks to tech tree is possible like including

  • Remove squires to nerf halberdier late-game
  • Remove gambersons to make militia line vulnerable to archers and skirms to an extent
  • Add Elite battle elephant upgrade to incentivise gold heavy comp
  • Add Full monk tech tree except heresay
  • Add Last cavalry armour
  • Remove Thumb ring
  • Add treadmill crane, Siege engineers

Rework - Dravidians - Infantry and Naval civilization

• NEW - Receive +10 wood for every villager created
• Skirmishers and Elephant Archers attack +25% faster
• Barracks technologies cost -50%
• NEW - Siege units have 20% more HP

Unique Units:

  • Urumi Swordsman (Infantry),
  • New - Colandia (சொழாந்தியம்)(Thirisadai renamed)(Warship) - Generates +10 gold per kill

Unique Techs:
CHANGE - Woots steel moved to castle age
• Wootz Steel (Infantry and Cavalry remove armour like Obuch)

• Lankan Elephants (Elephant Units regenerate 30 HP per minute)

Team Bonus:
NEW - Fishermen and Fishing ships +5 carry capacity

Poll - Dravidian civ wood bonuses merged
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In all seriousness I don’t recall a lot of asking for Tang… Tanguts (a real version) maybe but they’re not the same as the Tang Dynasty of China.

I have heard more want for Thai or Africans than for Ghassanid which sounds like a joke name even though I know it’s real. Seriously does anyone know ANY “ghassanid” civ concept posts over the decades?

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Yes, I don’t think they’ll change the names of the Vikings and Chinese… the rest might…

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Yes, different players expect different things to change. I myself don’t agree with all of @GentleEvening5 civ choices. But I think the overall idea is good. Some civs just have redunadant designs now like Saracens double capacity for transport ships who needs 40 capacity. A reworks to such civs and a modern adjacent version will be welcome.

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What idea is even here? There are no civ bonuses or uniques or regionals listed at all! It just looks like name drops

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And not even good namedrops… Does anyone at all want Ghassanids or the Tang as separate civs?

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TangUTs but those guys are very different

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Well, you made multiple good design of civs with tech trees and bonuses But how much did people appreciate it?

He posted in my thread after 3 years which means a returning player for new DLC looking for opinion on content. His suggestion may have been based on current stuff being discussed in the forum.

I agree with his view that civs which need rework are bundled as part work needed to develop a new DLC. Saracens definitely are a dated design now and dravidians are still problematic. New civs which are similar to existing civs will incur less work to develop. And the devs love to just copy code and game files to create new units, buildings and memechanismms. I added by including ‘dravidians’ design changes and Tamil as a new civ. You can add Saracens or thir vnewer counter parts 87

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The Saracens are a plenty interesting civ with a plentifully unique unit. Are you implying they are weak? Maybe in Arabia ironically enough but they have the camel motif going quite well

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I’m sorry but I don’t think you suggestion is going to fix anything about the chinese. About that, we literally have:

-3 civs designed from aoe1 timeframe info (Shu, Wu, and Wei).
-3 civs designed from aoe3 timeframe info (Muiscas, Mapuches, and Tupi).

So it doesn’t really matter. Devs don’t even know what they are doing and the last balance patch proves it. Just deal with it and keep playing if you still enjoy the game.

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