Some insights from a Chinese player regarding the new DLC, as well as the general feedback from most Chinese players regarding the new DLC

It is quite appropriate to consider the Jin Dynasty as an independent civilization. Because the Jin Dynasty was not as special as the Yuan Dynasty and the Qing Dynasty in history. It was a different cultural regime that emerged as a secondary civilization against the main Chinese regime. AOE4 focuses on nation-based states. Although China officially promotes the Jin Dynasty as part of its historical culture for practical political needs, the Chinese historical passion and folk traditions actually show hostility and aversion towards this nation and regime. Moreover, in other parts of the world, people generally believe that “Chinese have been fighting against the Tatars for thousands of years, while the Yuan Dynasty and the Qing Dynasty were directly ruled by the Tatars.” The Jin Dynasty merely allowed the world to understand a specific branch of the Tatars. Therefore, objectively speaking, there is nothing wrong with it, and it does not violate any taboos. It also gets rid of the reputation of always selling variant civilizations. As the theme of this issue, one of the most famous historical stories in Chinese history - Yue Fei’s resistance against the Jin Dynasty - is correct. The Jin Dynasty was developed independently rather than directly adopting the models of China or Mongolia.

However, there is a major problem. The theme of this issue is the legend of Yue Fei. This is clearly a topic suitable and even catering to the Chinese market. We do indeed like Yue Fei. But only the Jin Dynasty can be played in PvP mode. This makes Chinese players very dissatisfied. There is a situation where the main character of the campaign cannot be used in other modes, but you can use the villain of the campaign. This is like calling the legend of Joan of Arc only playable in the UK where burning Joan of Arc is the rule for PvP. And the Jin Dynasty is not like the UK. Now, there are no people of the Jin Dynasty ethnicity who would play AOE4. This makes Chinese players’ excitement and sense of respect they initially felt towards the Yue Fei legend suddenly turn into annoyance and aversion. If both the Jin Dynasty and the variant Chinese Yue Fei legends can be played in PvP mode, in China, it would definitely sell well and even attract many new players. Even if the variant of Yue Fei is only slightly changed like Joan of Arc, with some units and special units from the campaign. Then Chinese players would be willing to play as Yue Fei. While other region players would normally play both civilizations. There is still some time before the new DLC is released. We hope the AOE4 studio will seriously consider this matter. The dissatisfaction of Chinese players without Yue Fei in PvP mode is the voice of the majority of Chinese players.

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Yes, all Chinese dynasties up to the Song and Ming dynasties were of Han origin. The only foreign dynasties were the Liao (Khitans), Jin (Jurchens), Yuan (Mongols), and Qing (Manchu, which in turn descended from the Jurchens)… This explains why the Qing were overthrown in 1911 and the Republic of China (aka present-day Taiwan) was proclaimed…

As I understand it, the Jin Dynasty can be played at the beginning of Yue Fei’s campaign (the prologue and at least the second mission), before taking control of him in the following missions until the end…

Ummm, yep. Maybe renaming the new civ as “Yue Fei’s Army” would’ve been a huge hit with Chinese players, especially since the faction already features so many Song-style units.

Maybe they really should have put the spotlight on Yue Fei instead of the Jin. I don’t know if this sounds a bit racist, but Chinese players definitely prefer Yue Fei of the Song Dynasty.

China Changes


I want to assume, and it’s just an assumption, that the Devs want to gauge the reception of the campaign civilization to see if they’ll make a variant or further changes to the main China civilization.

In this case, it’s possible, and this is purely hypothetical:

    1. That main China will have several changes, many inspired by elements they’re going to add to the campaign.
    1. That they’re going to release “Song Dynasty” or “Yu Fei Legacy” as a variant at the end of the year or in the coming years.

I’m betting more on the first option, because in the trailer images, not many new Chinese units or Landmarks were seen, apart from the generals (Yu Fei).

On the other hand, there are some elements, which I mentioned in the main thread, that, now that there’s a specific thread about the changes to China, it would be good to emphasize them:


1) Bee Nest become a regional unit??


The trailer showed some footage of the Jin using Bee Nest with their unique technology. And we know this unit is Chinese, and that unique units are rarely shared except by variants or mercenaries.

It seems that what’s really happening is that the Bee Nest will no longer be exclusive to China, but will become a regional unit, replacing Mangonel for many civilizations in that region.

Which is good, since it will set a precedent for not having to force variants if one civilization has a unique unit shared with another; there can be “Regional units”, like in Age of Empires II.

Now, potential “Korean” civilizations in the future will be able to have their own unique Beehive (Hwacha) without much trouble.


2) Wait, Traction Trebushet also become a normal Siege Unit and not more unique???

Yes, among other discoveries, it seems the Jurchen don’t have Counterweight Trebuchets, because historically, they didn’t have them. In fact, the Mongols acquired Traction Trebuchets from the Jin Dynasty, so it makes sense that they would have them too.

This is curious; perhaps it could be done that many civilizations that ended before 1250 have traction trebuchets instead of counterweights, like the Macedonian Dynasty in the trailers, or the Japanese and Sengoku (who never got Counterweight Trebuchets, hehehe, time to give the Japanese a serious Nerf).

And well, the precedent for this would also be the same as why some civilizations have Bombardas and others instead Culverins. So, in a future, some civs gonna have traction trebs, an other Counterweights, jeje.

Finally: If Chinna gonna preserve its Counterweight trebs or get “Traction trebs”, It’s probably a dilemma that will keep us up at night until the May patch.


3).- UI changes: Blacksmith Technology Icons

Yeah, new Icons, this time the technologies has more layers to repressent their level.


Why aren’t these elements mentioned in the DLC announcement?

Easy, because “They’re not DLC elements.”

They’re going to be a FREE update, and they’re going to affect many civilizations, not just China, which is already a main civilization in the base game. I suppose they’ll announce them in the Patch Notice a week before the DLC, or even earlier, depending on how they want to manage the hype.