Except that thats how it should work. Same with any other action queueing. No point in limiting for A and not for B.
why don’t we just automate the whole game. what’s the point of making sure villagers don’t let an additional animal carcass partially rot because you forgot to micro after n amount of seconds. let’s just convert aoe2 into a mobile sheep game with pretty graphics. better yet, let us allow to have macros so we don’t have to use the keyboard so much.
like? (just asking, I haven’t opened DE/HD yet) are you referring to constructing buildings?
today I also learned (I hope the person telling me that was wrong) that aoe2 DE doesn’t force you to deliver resources before changing jobs. ?
seeing how aoe2 progresses, I can’t wait for aoe4 to show up. lol
warhammer 40k aoe confirmed
lol. basically: /thread
and what @PacificWheel208 is complaining about
This has existed since AoC, your resources get dropped off automatically when you build a new gather building (lumber/mill/camp/farm). It has not changed.
It sounds like the game you and PacificWheel want to play is AoK.
Why don’t we go further and make it so that villagers stop chopping wood after a single tree instead of automatically going to the next one? Why not do the same with every resource?
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If I remember correctly going from boar to farms (or deer ?) made you lose the resources in aoc. Unless I’m wrong on that too. I tested that back when I played and that’s what I remember memorizing.
Out of curiosity I will test this later. Hard to believe I got such a fundamental thing wrong. To me it’s seemed logical to deliver resources first before changing jobs.
kind of a flawed conclusion. Let me preface too I’m not arguing for realism in games.
They don’t stop going after meat when they finish a deer, since you say they should stop after every tree. That’s not how it works and no one is arguing for that.
Wood doesn’t waste as fast as meat does or at all, in game and in life. Why would I care if a villager chops down tree A1 or A2 (unless of course they are getting close to the wood line and create an empty tile). The same goes for meat and trees. You click on that resource and the villagers goes there. The rest is up to you.
You lose meat units after the kill, that’s a game mechanic. As far as I know meta is to make villagers work on one sheep instead of letting them decide what to do. In my humble opinion removing that by being able to queue is removing a core mechanic of the game.
Adding to that if you consider what the ratio meat to wood is, the free meat on a map is more precious than the wood. Making sure you manage that correctly at the beginning, should be key.
Like I said, you heard OP: it’s too hard. sums up this “problem” pretty well.
This was changed in HD (and presumably, WK), in AoC you used to lose meat if you tasked from a boar to a sheep or vice versa, but that hasn’t been the case for years before DE.
You’re right, it has about as much merit as an argument as the people who are crying “auto-everything!” at every single little feature that DE added to bring the game up to modern standards.
It’s not automated, you still have to make the conscious choice to task the villagers to the deer/sheep one at a time instead of letting their AI take over, it’s just that now you can do it up front with an action queue instead of checking on them every few seconds to see if they’re idle.
Is it easier? Yes, quality of life features make the game easier, they also make it more fun, and more accessible for new players, it’s also kind of an expected feature to have in a modern RTS game, and one a lot of players coming from other RTS games tend to ask about.
This game is about a lot more than tediously micromanaging villagers.
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I’m sorry, I’m not in this camp.
Making things easier isn’t fun either. I don’t want to veer off too much into esoteric topics, but as a teen I could also decide to start moving around in a wheelchair. Why should I walk in the first place, it’s too hard. I should make my life easier.
You get the free meat, you should do your part you get it correctly. I understand games are supposed to be fun but they should also come with a challenge. Going down that path they should skip all these steps and turn this into a clash of titans game or w/e these idiotic mobile games are called.
Anyway, I won’t be replying anymore since I’m the minority (according to you). I wanted to voice my stance on this, and didn’t understand why PacificWheel208 was flamed for it.
If steve jobs would’ve listened to the masses, the iphone would’ve never been created. Now look at all the sheeps buying this thing up as if it was the holy grail. He said it himself: people don’t really know what they want.
I agree, the challenge in this game comes from MACRO management - ensuring that your economy is properly balanced for the unit composition you are training, and reacting to the movements and reactions of your opponent in order to win the game.
Micromanaging your villagers for efficiency is important, and there should be some degree of this, but it should not and is not the focus of the game. Quality of life features like the ones discussed in this thread make it easier to focus on the actual challenge of the game, which is where the fun is for most players.
You’re right, and from what I understand neither you nor PacificWheel have played DE using this feature, why don’t you give it a shot instead of assuming it kills the game?
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Is it easier? Yes, quality of life features make the game easier, they also make it more fun, and more accessible for new players, it’s also kind of an expected feature to have in a modern RTS game, and one a lot of players coming from other RTS games tend to ask about.
You don’t need to convince me that his makes the game more accessible. But whatever new players think is mostly irrelevant to me because I was in their place and understand how they experience the game, it takes time before you can manage everything. But most new players expect to be capable of doing everything within months. Just look at all those topics on reddit.
Efficiency never was the focus for newer players. For them it doesn’t matter that they are taking 4 deers at once, it doesn’t impact them in a significant way. But this feature takes out all the nuance of the decay mechanic on all levels. They want to be efficient, but they can’t. So this feature helps them achieve it without any effort, well congratz.
While in other areas command queue actually increases the skill gap by offering unlimited options in each moment.
I just don’t like how it effects the game on many levels. And I don’t consider it fun or good for the game simply because it is easier or you can do more.
I think my perspective is very different than yours.
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I don’t mind change as long as I think it makes the game better. And I’m not a fan of this easy click click click click now it’s automated.
You misportray my argument.
I like to optimise these mechanics, and now it’s for nothing because a new player can do it faster without paying attention to it.
Eg; collecting relics. “relic collected sound” > go to last notification > hotkey monk > go to monastery > select monk hotkey > click monastery. Stuff like that I enjoy.
It’s harder to learn but faster than the traditional looking at minimap, select monk, look at minimap to find monastery, click monk to monastery. But now shift clicking is the fastest way and also the easiest way.And yes these things change the focus of the game. A valid reason to dislike something.
I’m not saying it’s not a valid reason, just that it would be nicer to have than not. Let me rephrase - I think that the goal of AoE is to balance an economy with military expansion in order to further progress to the victory condition (conquest, relics, or wonders) in an isometric, medieval themed plane. I think that if we’re willing to have shift clicks in general (which i believe has been accepted or praised by the majority) that the tool be as robust as possible.
I like the idea of luring boar for instance because that’s how boar were actually hunted historically. Meat rotting away food adds a certain realism (even though we accept that tree trunks don’t rot for some reason). I should be able to say hey villagers go hunt those four deer as easily as I say hey villagers go chop those trees.
You can actually micro villagers to cut specific trees in order btw. I’ve been in a situation where villagers are going to cut a hole in a woodline and instead of moving the woodline, I shift cut the tree that would create the hole and shift built a house just on the otherside of the hole so that when they finished cutting the tree they’d build the house and then start chopping again. This shift clicking doesn’t really remove micro, it just gives us more control of our economies and high skill players will just get even better economies and tighter play because of it.
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and this is exactly why I think aoe4 will bomb. In the end it won’t matter anyway. aoe1 is still being played in vietnam.
I insta-bought HD when I accidentally found out that it was coming out, I’ll have to rethink my future purchases. I guess the core demographic only matters up to a certain point. Thing is, this is the demographic that is there before the hype and once the hype dies.
I laughed at shroud (I don’t really watch him) when in one of his recent videos he said RTS games are dead. Seeing the changes made, I might change my opinion.
Funny to see I ended up in this thread when all I wanted to do is complain that people with weaker computers should be put in similar lobbies so they don’t ruin team games.
I’d be curious to know what the pros are saying about villager queuing. I know mbl loves his auto-scout. lol
read my response to Fano0517. this is not the same thing. tl;dr: you get free meat disproportionately to wood on a map, you better make sure you manage it correctly. i.e. there isn’t any need to manage wood from an economical standpoint. It’s readily available and doesn’t decay.
no, this just makes sure that you have one less thing to think about and don’t accidentally create an opening for your enemy.
All excuses for mediocre play.
also wood doesn’t rot. It loses water but that’s about it. That’s why I implied above it wouldn’t make sense to change it. If a game glances over realism to further gameplay, I’m all for it, but in this instance, with the wood, it wouldn’t be the case.
I think I’ll just have to agree to disagree with the idea that the artificial difficulty stemming from the mechanics of deer splitting is something good for the game.
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I fail to see why this is such a hard concept to grasp. you get free meat, invest the appropriate work in it.
it’s what you and the others were raving about: consistency. you select the villager, and point them to the resource. This is how it should be. You shouldn’t be able to mix and match different tasks. resource gathering, building, back to resources all neatly queued up.
You want a script/macro sequence to make the game easier. you know what this is called? a cpu. what you want is for people to be able to queue stuff and look at the screen. Maybe you should look into turn-based games. <3
It’s not a script or a macro. That implies it’s automating the task for you. You would still need the exact same number of action clicks (one for each deer). I get your point of view and I understand why you like the challenge. It can be difficult to build up that timing to check the deer at the perfect time to click the next deer. I disagree. However as you do not like shift queuing to begin with, I’ve accepted that changing your mind about shift queuing individual deer is not going to happen.
The mods can close this thread if they’d like.
yes while you go off and do other crap, while neatly circumventing part of the decay mechanic. why have the decay mechanic in there in the first place. might as well remove it at this point.
you see where this is leading?
anyway <3
I’m all for simplification cause i’m lazy af, but if we create artificial shit (games) might as well make it somewhat worthy of our time.
Oh, it appears, that it doesn’t work properly while paused. Otherwise it works. Should report it as a bug.
Tbh this comparison is bs. Just wait to meet stairs 11
The deal is to draw the line cleverly. Right now I have no idea why shift queue is making the game too ez, but villies going automatically to work was a great QoL improvement that totally didn’t make the game easier.
I’m not an iphone buyer. And I don’t need random dudes making quotes, be they billionaires or not, to know what features I think are fine for the games I play, and that I would never be able to touch AoK again.
Well that’s 20 bucks to “test” so I guess that’s a good reason to not do so.
No amount of QoL will change the fact you have to know that 4 villies are required to not waste meat, and that’s the most important part of the mechanic.
Shift-queue sounds about as game killing as AoC villies no longer being idiots.
??? I mean it has remained the same, except that now you can queue villies while waiting for techs. That’s it.
The decay mechanic means you will never get the full meat from any animal ever. It also means that if you get rushed and pushed of your hunts you won’t be able to get them back as you would with berries.
Btw shift clicking also means your villagers will kill deers regarless of where they moved, so if you want to be a pro micronerd that is more efficient than n00bs then just do this: don’t shift click, push your deers with your villagers, and you’re set.
Now that I think of it, many people neglect deer hunting or push them to their TC so this whole “deers no skill now” thing is barely relevant anyway. Now we don’t have to overfocus on something that niche.
I am pretty sure it works for monks too. I have used it successfully.
I have to say i dont use this very much, i always neglict relics. Most 1v1 are decided before relic gold really kicks in at my level. So I just forgot about the relics every game 11
Topic closed as requested by original poster.