The Balkan Empires Expansion Pack,idea

The new civs Ottomans and Malians left us wanting more,whole community is asking for Byzantine Empire(and im too looking forward to it).
So my idea for next Expansion is the balkan empires
Byzantine Empire,Serbian Empire and Bulgarian Empire.
These three were one of the strongest Balkan Empires during the Medieval ages until Ottomans came.
It would be super awesome to get a paid Expansion pack with these three civs,new biomes and maps and a Campaign for some of these civs.
Personal message to the devs…make this a reality!


the Serbian empire lasted for a short time and had a local character. the opposite Bulgarian Empire and Byzantium is something I would like to see in the game. culturally and architecturally Bulgaria would also represent medieval Serbia in some way

What’s of greater importance for me is to keep making the newest civs more unique and interesting with a variety of unique and culturally appropriate units, buildings and techs. Not everyone needs to have a crowssbow or a Knight or a cannon, even more so if these weapons were never used by that civ. Malians seem to be a step towards that direction having all unique infantry units but it can go further than that.

Bulgarians did have some bright moments in their medieval history, mostly between the 9th and early in the 11th century… However compared to AoEIV’s expansive timeframe they were very short-lived and I doubt I would give them a seat before several other civs around the globe manage to make it into the game.

u have 1 and 2 Bulgarian empire, it was present for most of the timeline that the game covers

  1. Bulgarian empire 681-1018 337 years

  2. Bulgarian empire 1185-1396 211 years


so it was more present than many desired and some already existing civilizations
again, no one expects DLC right away, I’m just saying that they deserve to be in the game, that’s all, there’s no need to downplay the importance and selective selection of facts
of course there are MANY that are higher on the priority list, I would agree with that


These civs would all be called Byzantines, Serbians, and Bulgarians respectively.

9th-11th centuries → the territorial rise and peak of the 1st Bulgarian empire.

Nothing is downplayed. I think I was lenient actually since its peak was actually in the 10th century. I thought you were not interested in small local powers as you said, so I only mentioned the limited timeline when Bulgaria was a rather significant state. The chronological boundaries that I used were not meant to say that Bulgarians only existed in these centuries, I’m sorry if I wasn’t clear.
Feel free to want them in the game, I too think they have an interesting history, starting as a turkic tribe that immigrated all the way to southern Europe and assimilated so many different elements in its path. But after its annexation by the Byzantines and for most part of its history Bulgaria remained a local, peripheral power in the Balkans and that’'s a fact.

Who drew these maps by the way? Both of them are misleading exaggerations. Are they taken from the Slavic Wiki by any chance?
The first one shows all the territory that the first Bulgarian empire ever held in its history rather than territory that was ever held at the same time.
The second one seems to include a lot of Vassal territories, although no distinction is made on the map as if these were the state’s actual borders.

In any case, my point was that given the limited amount of civs AoEIV is going to have if it wishes to keep its semi-asymmetrical approach, potential seats should be reserved for civs with a greater impact, while also taking into account the cultural diversity of the civs. We still haven’t seen a single civ from the Americas or a Hindu civ and several other great options. Hopefully that will not be taken as an offense against your civ, although I don’t see why it would, not all empires were equally powerful and impactful, it’s not in our hand to change that by drawing random borders on maps. It would be nice if it was that easy.

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I think that our opinions are not opposite at all, I said myself that there are many more important ones. maps show the greatest territorial expansion, vassal states in the Middle Ages are another topic that I will not discuss. the only difference in our opinion is that I think that the Bulgarian Empire deserves to be in the game, of course, as one of the last expansions, as it was also done in AOE 2. I hope this clarifies what I meant

uh no thanks , even if its good to have more i preffer 2 civs really well designed that three civs and one of them is incomplete .

TBF , im good with ottomans and Malians , i can wait MUCH MUCH LONGER without byzantines

But yeah , it should be a thing for the future!








These aren’t medieval, but early modern houses. European houses did not have chimneys until the very end of the era and that’s after the fall of the civilisations this thread is focused on.

Rila monastery

You’ve had a spoiler alert with the chimneys but the Mamluk arches betray this building’s Ottoman-period origin. The church in the middle was built in the 19th century.

The other reference images should be fine. Arguably, the game is not too concerned with depictions of very period-accurate architecture (case in point everyone gets chimneys as early as Age2 which is, if we’re being pedantic, a fantasy aesthetic take on the European middle ages), but with Ottomans in the game drawing fairly strongly on the early modern Ottoman empire/Istanbul buildings and decorations, you would probably prefer to stick to the earlier Balkan Romanesque architecture to differentiate them vis-a-vis each other (the architectural traditions do merge under the Ottoman rule but that’s a later development as far as AoE4 should be concerned).


you are right about the Rila monastery that there are a lot of buildings from the later period even though it was founded in the Middle Ages. as for the house, the 3. picture is a reconstruction of a medival Bulgarian house in a monastery complex (it is possible that this is why it has a chimney), the point is that the first floor was usually made of stone, while the upper one was similar to the European one with small aesthetic differences, so I found the first two pictures that would be a good representation of Balkan houses. The Rila monastery complex was there as one of the possible landmarks because fortified monasteries were popular in the Balkans but u are right Rila doesn t represent original Bulgarian architecture.

Bulgaria was a powerhouse and rival to Byzantines and European nations, even reached empire status twice (in a very challenging, competitive region, unlike Rus, Mali, English, Norse or Portuguese empire in Brazil).

Bulgarian army was a mix of Slavic, Roman and Pecheneg elements and likely was stronger than French and English. Look at all the results of Bulgaria x Crusaders in the 1200s:

Bulgaria won over 80% of battles against French, English, and HRE.

So just like Hungary, the Bulgarian empire was a leading medieval military powerhouse, able to fight French, English, Byzantines, Mongols and usually win, before its sudden total destruction at the astonishing Ottoman victory in the Crusade of Nicopolis 1396 that shocked the world:

Bulgaria definitely has qualification for this game, even if not priority or too much uniqueness.

Serbia hasn’t. Serbia’s main achievement was as one of many Ottoman vassals, so is not as qualified as many other alternatives.


well Bulgaria was a vassal of Serbia in some time.
and it lasted pretty long time…and it is a big cultural nation.

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I am by no means diminishing the importance of Serbia, but considering the number of civilizations, and it would be good if we had at least one from the Balkans then by priority Bulgaria is the best choice
we won’t have smaller kingdoms from Western Europe either, so I’m satisfied if we get at least one Balkan empire


Emperor Dusan The Mighty of Serbia almost conquered Constanopole…but didnt do it…Serbias army was a force to be feared
we became Ottoman vassal after kosovo war in early 1400s.
beofre that…we and bulgarian fought aginst each other and byzanties who started to die along that time.

Here is serbia at its peak.
when bulgaria was a vassal.

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Bulgarian/Balkan medival architecture generated by AI

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