The best map pool we've had so far

Man, I wish Viper would choose the maps every time. This is the first map rotation where I haven’t actually used all my bans.

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It depends on your definition of best map pool:/preferred play style. I see 4 open maps, 1 close map, 1 water map and a random map. That doesnt seems to be a balanced map with many choice if you dont like open maps.

If you like open maps, this map pool is great. Otherwise it pretty much sucks. Just do the same story as TheViper (Not liking all these FC maps) for all these open maps. In the end it all comes down to taste. And the taste is different for each person.

I wish they had some prefixed spot for the places in the map poule, like 1 open map, 1 closed map, 1 hybrid map, 1 nomad map, … And then just have 1-2 spots open, which can be anything. That is a much better system for voting for maps.

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Next map rotation let’s have JonSlow pick the rotation!

Revenge for the open maps. 11

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But the key point about “open maps” is that very often you have the choice to wall up and turn it into a “closed” map. Whereas vice versa with closed maps you can’t do that; you can’t “open up” a closed map, so the gameplay is very predictable and boring. Just turtle FC boom every game. Open maps are more diverse, they give more options for more aggression in every age, or you can wall up and fast castle depending on your map, or you can do a bit of mix of both.

So closed maps are just not flexible. Whereas open maps can be either open or closed, so the possibilities and choices are there for lots of different approaches.

11 his picks would be Arena, Arena, Arena, Arena, Arena, Arena & Arena

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On Arena you can trush, castle drop, siege tower hop; on Hideout you can even play normal MAA archers.

Only possible when you hit Castle age. So they are still FC strategies. It’s a mistake to go heavy feudal age military on Arena.

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You are talking about your personal preferences, but you address them ## ###ts. You are preferring open maps because of your preference. Other people dont necessarily have the same preferences as you a look at the map pool in a different way.

You for example assume you can turn every open map into a closed map. But is that really the best strategy? The dynamics of every type of map is different. Open maps are played different then closed maps. And hybrid maps again results in a different dynamic. And Nomand starts are different to all of these as well.

Open maps are about early rushes. Closed maps are about late game battles. Hybrid maps are about a balance between water and land warfare. Starting without a TC add another layer to the map. And yes, these descriptions are very generalized, i know.

For me variety in the map pool means all these kind of dynamics are part of the map pool. One game i have to play on an open map. Next game is something different because it has a nomad start. Third game is an FC build on a closed map. Then i have to play a hybrid map and i have to maintain a balance between going for water and going for land.

A balanced map pool for me is a map pool in which all types of maps are available and no map is really dominating the map pool.

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Seems like

a s
f a c t s

is something bad to say and marked as ### in previous post…

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Viper didn’t choose anything outside the 4 dev picks though. The community voted on them. If people wanted closed maps, they should’ve voted for that.

Also, I’d say that 2 are closed maps. Arena and enclosed. Enclosed isn’t a typical closed map, but you can definitely play it like that in the early game. Wall up FC is absolutely possible on enclosed.

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TheViper also picked the maps in the voting. This way you can influence the voting as well. We had:

  • Enclosed
  • Haboob
  • Kawasan
  • Lowlands
  • Morass
  • Nomad
  • Northern Island
  • Seize The Mountain
  • Wade

Given this options, it is clear that we get this map pool. People who enjoy closed maps had no real option to vote for. Enclosed was there best bet. But even there i dont really see how FC is a good option, due to the lack of gold inside of your potential walls.

His picks for the voting had a major impact on the outcome of the poll. If he had put a more closed map in the map pool, i would be surprised if that map wasnt voted in by the player base.

I do understand Viper’s reasoning, but i wont agree with it. If you want something new in the map pool, then you have to put it next to the Arabia and Arena dev picks. This way you really get something new in the map pool to enjoy. And if people like it, then they will vote on it next time. Don’t expect the players to vote in new maps by their own.

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Haboob and Kawasan are actually bad. And here’s why.

Haboob is a laming map like socotra. But the difference is that there are 2 boars on Haboob and 1 on Socotra. And those 2 boars are much further away from the TC than on Socotra. Since the player bases are quite contactable, the players will try to lame each other in the center of the map. And that’s where the problem of generating animals comes in. One player can have 2 boars on the forward and another on the back. Same with sheep and deer. This is very unfair, unlike in Socotra, where boar and sheep are quite close to the TC.

Kawasan is a very snowballing map due to the center with bushes and relics.
Once a player takes the center, it’s almost impossible to lose. In addition, this whole area is on the highground, and it will be very difficult to repel the enemy from there. There is another version of this map where relics are scattered near lakes. But it’s best to have this position on the lowground.

Migration is a good map, but too buggy generations happens often.

But the bushes are exposed to raids in feudal. And it’s still nowhere near as snowbally as Golden Pit which is a way more popular map than Kawasan.

I kind of agree with you on Haboob, but I’d still rather get lamed than play all the prison maps we had on the last rotation. The opponent has the same vulnerability to laming anyway. I had a Haboob game before where my boar got lamed so I lamed his boar back. Even without laming back, it’s not GG if you get lamed. You can still lure deer.

It’s indeed a good map pool. Probably the best we had since voting moved ingame.

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I agree with @WoodsierCorn696 this map pool is great if you like the maps Viper picked.

I don’t mind it,

What gets me is that Viper was talking about variety, yet all of these maps are maps that have been in map pool (including maps not voted in). It just feels like viper wanted to play the maps he wanted to play, Not that what he would pick is intrinsically better. If you like the maps viper likes you’ll think he’s done a great job and if you don’t you won’t. But really I don’t see anything different here.

You can argue forever about what is the best map, or set of maps. But ultimately that is a subjective opinion, but I don’t really see any difference between what viper has done than what the devs do, except that viper swung it towards open maps in this particular rotation. Open maps being a subjective preference. Do that every time and that wouldn’t solve anything, just changes who’s complaining.

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That’s also one point important to pick up.
The new pool is actually NOT higher in variety than the last.
It’s only that it has a stronger focus on map types we also see more often in tournaments.

I want there to be more of an awareness about the influence certain very vocal content creators have in the discussions at the public places.

The thing is the previous map pools all have been voted for democratically. And claiming they would have been “bad” means actually claiming to have a superior opinion than the democratically voting playerbase.

Only because some people are more vocal on their opinions than others doesn’t mean they are necessarily alsoe more “right”.

At least the TO is very open in his very limited view on what he thinks is “good”. But the sheer fact that he says this:

Says actually a lot about him and that he’s not interested at all to make it “good” for everyone. He only wants HIS favorite Maps in the pool.

And I don’t think we should support this kind of thinking at all. It’s his own choice he limits his own positive experience that much. He should widen his perspective so he can enjoy more maps.
Not force other players to play only the few maps he likes.

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Clearly you don’t know Viper if you think he only likes a few maps.

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I am out of the context - did Viper really pick the pools this time?

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Golden pit is a bit different, you can’t with one castle cover the whole area with gold, unlike kawasan. And importantly, that whole area is on lowground, which makes it much easier to repel the enemy from there.

On kavasan, 5 relics are collected very quickly, and that’s like 7-8 villagers on gold for free (monk comes in handy anyway). Now imagine Aztecs/Burgundians/Lithuanians with 5 relics.

And bush food is a much more valuable resource in the castle age than gold (going there in feudal is pretty risky, but you can put up a tower). And now imagine a Portuguese/Franks out there with a cheap castle.