Thoughts on Genesis Tournament?

The tournament is hard to watch, every game is boring. The game is either French-French; French-Mongol; French-Rus; English-French. So much for diversity. The lacking of many micro features such as dodging missiles and projectiles has already made it unfun and unexcited, and the over-picking of French makes it even worse.

By no means I’m against players picking the best civs in the game that can warrant them the best chance of winning, but it makes the tournament so stale and boring. The one to blame is definitely Relic, and if there is no patch after the tournament, no nerf or buff to the civs, Relic would show that they are incompetent and incapable of handling this type of game.


I found the overall gameplay was fun to watch even with the frequent mirror matches. The micro required to control a French knight push is way higher than anything we were seeing in aoe2 but I can see how if your watching from a casters perspective it is less exciting. I found it pretty fun to watch player pov in french mirrors.

I think the main issue with the balance right now is that only some civs were included in the betas. We thought that nest of bees and English longbows were OP because we didn’t see what their main competition was in early French knights. Beta testers pushed for balancing a game based on incomplete information, relic balanced based on that feedback and now the civs that were powerful but not in beta have rode into launch un-nerfed and are dominating the meta.

Getting a game to settle into a balanced state is pretty much impossible but it’s generally good practice to at least make quick changes to picks that are dominating the meta, particularly early on in the meta.


so i wonder if the rumor that they are waiting to release the patch after tournament is true or false.

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This would be really stupid in my opinion. Letting thousands of players wait so that 8 players can play on the same patch?


I don’t think they’re waiting for the tournament to finish.

Some Age 2 tournaments have been played in older Patches (active when the tournament was announced) to make sure that recent additions to the game don’t interfere with the preparation of players.

They have different branches as you can see here

They don’t need to wait for the tournament to be over to patch the game. They even have a different branch for the currently running official FFA “tournament”.

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The game is fun to watch at tier lll, in tier IV is a spam fest, the player that spam more units and more castles win… I agree, there are games that there are no unit preservation at all, other games with +160 villagers and 40 military units, the only fun games I’ve seen is when HRE or Saracens are picked… Also cannons make the game boring, walla are useless when there are cannons so the big feature that relic introduced in age IV is not used by anyone, no one use walls in walls simple because cannons negate walls.

The game hasnt been out 2 week and there is a Tourn already? Like is the game even balanced for Touney play LUL


Bad. Watch game doesn’t work.

Personally I’m just not a fan of the spectating in 4, I think that is the main turn off for me. It has been very refreshing seeing some new ppl involved, and I think its pretty competitive for being out less than a month. Potential is there for many more tournaments to come and thats exciting especially with the balance changes we will see over time

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Worlds edge is running the show now… not relic

You speak as if the devs don’t understand balance. They have a balance team with AoE players for heavens sake.

If they nerfed everything but the French and Rus, but forgot to nerf these two, that would be a very silly error. I’m sure they didn’t forget to just nerf these two.

My theory is that this French overpowering is actually intended. New players will stick around if they can play and win without much skill. New civs always end up like this. But they get balanced out later.

You’re talking about it like it was a highly complex math problem with thousands of unknown variables that only slowly clear up once players turned out hundreds of thousands of matches…
What a twisted reality. The current issues are meant to be solved on an excel sheet by game designers long before a game releases, not on the back of paying alpha testers.

Really? This looks like a child shoving around playmobil figures. You cripple your hands a lot more to reach the same goals as in AOE2’s micro, while it looks a thousand times worse for the viewer. The only way to appreciate this spectacle is if you have played it yourself before, so you can imagine and partake in the painful input lag and dodgy unit responsiveness and pathfinding.

Not sure that this was intended for the initial civ line-up. But god have mercy on us when they drop the first paid DLC civs.


If u check aoe2 stats
French picked 15%, Britans 13% other 36(!!!) civ - the rest.
both civs are easy to play and have higher winrate for new player. While not being broken for higher ranked players.
Also new civs are OP because devs wanted to push sales. No one would buy a DLC for a civ which are mediocre. Not for new players without skill.

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You compare 15% to 80% ?

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You can make a Civilization easy to use, but avoid making it OP in any scenario: on AoE2 Franks, Huns and Goths are Easy to use, but in no way they can steamroll the rest like they do here.

Right now you can win against a Frank in AoE4, but you need to do everything perfectly and perhaps wait for an error on the other side.


dont know how to answer to you.

Some math:
100/38=2.6 → 15/2.6=5.7 French picked in 5.7 times more often than pickrate for one civ with uniform distribution.
100/8=12.5 → 80/12.5=6.4 French picked in 6.4 times often more than …

Anyway, it’s numbers describing pickrate, and u can compare them, even if one number is 100% and another is 0%.

It was easy statement, civ can be easy to play and strong for new players, but balanced for pros.

source Liquipedia

pretty small sample size. also no water maps in Genesis. 3 loosing mus for French.

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is this just main event?