Vietmanese vs Berbers

What do I do? Just resign right away??? :slight_smile:

As Vietnamese? Use your better eco to play towards Rattan Halb probably. As Berbers? Play defensive early game probably, and then try overwhelm with knights in Castle Age.

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Yeah, as Vietnamese.

Open archers, get Wheelbarrow sometime in late Feudal, go up to Castle with a better eco than Berbers, play Crossbow + Pike most likely, and then get to either Arb/Halb or Rattan/Halb.


Play as Berbers against Vietnamese to find out how they beat you and you will know it

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  • Keep the game in feudal. Vietnamese have better feudal age.
  • Drop castle in early castle age, so you can cover your mobility weakness.
  • Force him to trash war when you reach imperial. Vietnamese have better trash units.
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how do you keep the game in feudal?

Which map are you talking about? Because that will dictate your strategy. If it’s a very closed map like Black forest or Arena, it’s a mistake to go very aggressive in Feudal age. On those maps you should fast castle (assuming you’ve walled the opening early on Black Forest).

However, if it’s a relatively open map, the way to keep it the game in feudal is to be super aggressive with your archers, break into his palisade walls and kill any villagers who try to wall behind. Palisade gates in particular are extremely weak to archers with fletching. You need at least 2 archery ranges constantly producing archers. Make sure you get fletching first then armour upgrade later. And also add spears with armour. He will be forced to make skirms which will keep the fight in feudal age.

Once you’ve broken in, surround his town centre and resources with groups of archers so he’s got nowhere to run. Shift queue his farms with your archers so he has no food income. Send a few villagers forward to build a tower on his gold and wall it in. Build another archery range in his base so your archers don’t have to walk as far. Make sure you watch if he tries to take another gold or woodline somewhere else and chase him ruthlessly. You get the idea.

Basically you’re being being too passive, which is probably one of the most common mistakes in this game. Make sure you have keyboard shortcuts (hot keys) set up for Select All Archery Ranges and Make Archers. So you can keep your production buildings and town centre going constantly. If you’re doing it correctly, your food, wood and gold should be close to zero unless you’re saving up for upgrades or castle age.

Not always, Black Forest is a closed map with options to do lots of funny things depending on the map generation, however I think the OP is talking about 1v1s anyway.

In teamgames, feudal (if not dark!) age aggression is pretty common and often effective.

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You can go whatever in feudal age. Keep your base walled in castle age to avoid knight spam. You have all the tools in imperial. Also better eco the whole game since feudal age.

Yeah I know, and black forest has been on the 1v1 ranked ladder before. Should be no risk of a sneak if you send a villager to wall early enough. So it is a fast castle map.

Obviously. And in 1v1 too. That’s why the rest of my entire post was all about feudal age aggression, so I don’t understand the point you’re trying to make, since you’re not contradicting anything I’ve said.

Feudal age aggression is very possible specifically because players try to fast castle. Trushing against Palisades is very doable as an fc player won’t get stone walls until well after the start of your trush. Hell even on arena with stone walls trushing was used for a while. That’s not to say that you have a ton of time to attack in feudal, there’s definitely a specific time frame of effectiveness.

It’s not just palisades on BF. It will be palisades + houses behind. Or double palisades at the very least. If it was just single palisades you could easily break in and heavy feudal archers would be the meta for BF, which it isn’t. And trushing on Arena isn’t worth it. Puts you way too far behind economically since you need vils on stone as well as vils forward building and FC times are so fast on that map, you won’t be able to do enough damage to make it worthwhile before enemy has siege and castle age units. He can even easily kill it without siege or units with just a forward TC.

Houses in dark age are fairly weak too. And from what I’ve seen in rage forest it’s definitely possible to break in and deal damage.

Although tbf the map gens are often (but not always) more open with their version of bf. The pockets also get involved start of castle age to capitalise on the opening/defend their flank and it isn’t entirely clear whether the person breaking in is generally advantaged or disadvanteged compared to the other flank.

But it definitely isn’t black and white with regards to fc being better than trush of bf.

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It depends. Team games are different from 1v1. Obviously you can be more aggressive if multiple players are trying to break in. Rage forest is also different from BF. But 1v1 on original BF, I would say it’s not standard to trush. I know it’s not on the ranked ladder regularly but it has been there a few times.