+1 PA gives huge resistance against archers. Cavalier tank 35 Arbalest fire while Boyar tank 50 Arbalest fire. Boyar tank 42% more hit. You can try 15 Boyar against 30 Arbalest or 15 Cavalier against 30 Arbalest. You will see that Boyar easily wreck these number of Arbalest but Cavalier will be destroyed by these Arbalests.
In melee fight, power gap among Boyar and Cavalier is huge. Even against Halberdier, Boyar is distinctively better than Cavalier. Boyar kills Halberdier in 4 hits while Cavalier in 5 hits. Cavalier tank 4 Halberdier hits while Boyar tank 5 hits. You can try 20 Boyar vs 30 Halberdier and 20 Cavalier vs same number of Halberdier. You will see that 20 Boyar beat 30 Halberdier and Cavalier is destroyed by 30 Halberdiers. Against Camels, Boyar is a lot better again. 20 Boyar beat 15 Heavy Camels but 20 Cavalier will die 15 Heavy Camels. Boyar tank 9 Heavy Camel hits while Cavalier tanks 6 hits. Boyar kills Heavy Camel in 9 hits while Cavalier kills in 11 hits. Boyar is equal to Paladin in terms of power while Cavalier is trash comparing to Paladin.
On the other hand, Berserk isnāt that much better than Champion. Berserk is countered by Arbalest and HC just like Champion. Berserk is worse than Champion in melee fights as well. Berserk is better in raiding due to speed and it has pop efficiency advantage. Choosing Berserk over Champion is trade-off but choosing Cavalier over Boyar makes no sense. It is choosing Paladin or Cavalier when both option available in Stable.
I said that nerfed Leitis and Coustillier are still very strong unit. In this forum, other guys replied that these 2 unit arenāt good because pros donāt play them at that time. After that pros started to Coustillier and Leitis and these guys started to say that Coustiller is OP. They didnāt start to say Leitis is OP but I am sure that they will say that when pros use Leitis successfully. I watched Tatoh vs a player. In this match, one side charged enemy trebuckets with castle Age Leitis. Other side with Mayans was defending these trebucket with Halberdiers which has more number than Leitis. Castle Age Leitis annihilated all Halberdiers and Trebucket afterwards. Leitis won the game with this charge. I am sure these guys would say Leitis is OP please nerf if they saw these match I mentioned above. I still think Leitis should gain its 1 PA back. In return, their cost should abe adjusted to 70f 60g and elite Leitisās damage decreased to 12, 15 (Elite). Leitis would be balanced in this way. Right now, 1 PA in Castle Age is big weakness.
I want Berserk to be buffed. Give +1 PA, +0.1 speed (1.15 speed), more hp regen (40 to 60). In return, its cost increased to 65 food 35 gold (+10).
You might have noticed that this sentence was written in past tense, and that I added that it explains why people arenāt used to use them.
Sure, paladins and boyars can beat halbs but thatās extremely expensive and should be avoided, as it canāt be sustained for long.
Yes but they can actually reach them, unlike champions.
Lmao what? More attack + more armour + HP regen = worse in melee fights???ĀæĀæĀæ???
You might notice someday that boyars donāt come out of stables. Or that if Slavs had paladins and Vikings had no champions you would be saying the same thing but with the Slavs/Viking stuff switched.
Because those two units started their career as OP units instead of UP so at least people will be more used to using them.
I didnāt even say Boyars are bad, I just said people (including the pros) arenāt used to using them and why massing boyars is not as easy as massing berserks.
1: Castle age leitis always had 1 base pierce armour, only the elite version was nerfed
2: You wrote a huge post about how berserks should be super buffed to become more different from champions but you want leitis to become more similar to knights?
I guess the point is gold cost on a unit. People do cavalier in imp because they might have played knights in castle age and early imp you still should have enough gold to hold on for heavy cav for some minutes. However at some point in imp you canāt really sustain that and the time window to switch into boyars might be too short for the investment. So usually you go hussar instead. However berserks cost way less gold than heavy cav unit so you can play them way longer.
Berserk is the ultimate melee killer unit. Not only do they easily win vs champs also they shred through cavalier and even can beat paladin bc of UT. Sure there some melee UU which beat berserks but if you look at generic units the only unit that does well vs berserks is arbs. And arbs arenāt a great late game unit most of the time. Also you have to stay as one large group bc otherwise even berserk will overwhelm them.
With micro, Berserk is killed by Arbalest and HC easily just like Champion.
Do you know that these unit has different cost. Berserk is approximately 30% expensive than Champion. You should try 13 Champion vs 10 Berserk and you will see that Vikings Champion beat Berserk.
Berserk also donāt come from Barrack. Castle restricted UU production but when Castle Age unit is a lot better than Stable unit, you should go UU unit instead of generic units.
Totally wrong statement. I expressed that forum guys claimed that these units arenāt useful anymore because pros stopped to use them. Now, pros strated to use Coustiller successfully again.
Why massing Berserk is easier than Boyar. Their creation time isnāt that much distinctive towards Berserkās advantage.
I remember that non-elite Leitis also had 2 PA. but I am not sure. Yes, Berserk need to be buffed immensely to be strong unit. Current Berserk is really bad unit.
I didnāt say Leitis should be similar to Knights. 1 PA is huge weakness especially in team games, it should be changed.
Not quite as easily according to people who had to deal with both. Even then , berserks can escape more easily while boyars are actually worse at doing so than kts.
Almost all of which is made up of food and Vikings arenāt the kind of civ that struggles with that. So that 13 champs vs 10 berserks fight is never going to happen if both players played well.
Precisely. You think choosing to make cavalier over boyar would be a mistake if they were from stables, and thatās quite right, but choosing champions over berserks would be just as much of a mistake.
Bruh were you living under a rock around DE and LotWās release? And anyway I said that because I didnāt mention pros at all (so telling me that the others did is kinda pointless) and because my explanation fits for most MP players anyway.
BTW outside of their charge and cost coustilliers are straight up worse in every way to Burgundian cavalier/paladin so with the logic you applied to berserks they would receive massive buffs.
Because boyars have almost the same cost as a mameluke.
This statement right there is what will make most people not agree with you.
You didnāt say it but if you give them the same pierce armour as knights and a damage output/price closer to knights thatās the result anyway.
But Leitis at release was soo poorly designed (basically same Boyar cost, with slower TT, for an unit that was slightly better than 23 attack lith paladin while also having weaker HP and PA) that noone used them, was after the buff ofc (while also still being ignored in favour of Knights)
Interesting consepts, I too feel like the Vikings should be altered.
The main emphasis is on the long boats and their over use of Arbs, the rest are not to important and can be left as is.
Have Vikings lose free hand cart + lose Arbalerster but instead they get Halbedier,(NB!) have their longboats be able to attack as well as transport units (Infantry only) (loses transport ships but they have non attacking Longboats in feudal age.) and gift them cheap trash units.
Castles cost change to 450 stone and 300 wood (Wood castles have lower HP) ORā¦ Since they get Halbs change their unique tech Chieftains to allow Beserks to be made in TCs even after all castles have been lost.
Iād enjoy raiding coastlines and rivers using longboats to transport infantry and skirms to the shores of my enemies.