What to do with the classic civs (Franks, Britons, Teutons....)?

[DynasticPlanet5]

Burgundian paladin is a timing issue. Why are we acting like we play in death match with infinite resources?

As a punishment for half cost Paladin ready to go because you got half price cavalier in castle Age is a lack of bloodlines

Not all power is based on 1:15 minute spamfeat

Which for Teutons is why I hate to suggest Light Cav as an option but it would solve a lot of issues where you can power spike into Lifhy Cav after large scout focus on farmin, and helps vs protected cav archers especially with the +2 armor to take punishment while rushing down horse archers. That or Bracer for more Skirm and Castle Reach

[yuksely1992]

Franks are a pointless civ to play when Teutons, Persians or Spanish exist anyway.

Teuton light cav would make it even more obvious, if anything.

[DynasticPlanet5]

Who use Spanish for an eco boosted knight boom?

No seriously is everyone really pretending there is no eco period and we just turtle forever

Someone ELSE please explain

[yuksely1992]

Why were you complaining about a supposedly cav civ having generic knights like 2 hours ago, then?

[DynasticPlanet5]

And reducing the power spike of Bloodlines would help all knights be less oppressive. instead of power creeping the Franks we could reel back the power of mounted units just a little to see if 5 HP would be too much

But nobody is saying “I want to go Castle Knights on Arabia. SPANISH!!!”

[Thire7]

@DynasticPlanet5

Why now 27 years later is the fact that not even 20% of the civs have this unit or an alternative?

Savar is a unique unit; like Imperial Camel, Camel Scout, Legionary, or Houfnice. Although that’s kind of a weak argument.

[DynasticPlanet5]

@Thire7

Savar is a unique unit; like Imperial Camel, Camel Scout, Legionary, or Houfnice

Nothing about these feels like some of their neighbors couldn’t have them either. Heck you can’t tell me some yet added African civ isn’t big on scouting or long term imperializing their camelry to a degree most Northern Indians likely did not

[smiki5five]

The Kanembu (Kanem and Bornu empires) could get imp Camels perhaps

[SMUM15236]

@TheTowerDefender

units that fulfill the same role with very similar stats, generally shouldn’t have different names or skins

I agree. So far the only unit that is like this is Rocket Cart.

@casusincorrabil

And my compensation to get there without overbuffing franks is to make the civ a bit slowe

Honestly with so many fast paced new Cav civs now in the game, I’ll say that will be a bad idea.

@Mahazona

do we really need every dutchy of the HRE as playable factions?

I don’t think so. But I won’t mind Saxons as long as they also represent the Anglo-Saxons from British Isle.

@WhiteMagick4

Neither do we need a Vikings split!

I agree. If I have to pick one, I’ll pick Teutons split over Vikings split.

@DynasticPlanet5

extra unpaid labor

What about paid labour? Let’s say each DLC replaces Paladin from a civ with Savar like new unit so that they can pay the animator for their job.

[TheTowerDefender]

@SMUM15236

@TheTowerDefender

units that fulfill the same role with very similar stats, generally shouldn’t have different names or skins

I agree. So far the only unit that is like this is Rocket Cart.

I think Savar is another case. Savar is about as different from Paladin as Cavalier with Hauberk, Farimba or Stirrups.

Just another case of “superificial complexity”. The only thing truly unqiue about the savar is its skin.

[smiki5five]

@AbuzzJam4677680

(5) Weaken new civs heavy cavalry

IMHO this solution seems most elegant and avoids power creep.

[AbuzzJam4677680]

@smiki5five

@AbuzzJam4677680

(4) Counter pikes /camels/ monks better

(5) Weaken new civs heavy cavalry

IMHO this solution seems most elegant and avoids power creep.

I prefer going 4&5 as Camels and Monks also grow stronger.

[smiki5five]

Something like the Bengali bonus but for the Knight line?

[yuksely1992]

Spanish, Magyar, Teuton, Lithuanian, Cuman, and Hun Paladins should either be gone or nerfed, including the Savar.

Apart from that, there’s nothing to nerf. Buffing the knight line is what cavalry civs do. What isn’t okay is the Franks still having generic knights, almost generic cavaliers, and not very special Paladins.

[benithisrael]

@yuksely1992

not very special Paladins.

They get palladins which are researched 40% faster and trained 40% faster. Only the savar and Roman centurian as well as knight line seem to have power crept them. Just uninstall return of Rome DLC and mountain royals DLC.

[casusincorrabil]

Also having basically bloodlines for free is still a very strong bonus for Franks.
AND Franks Knights have extra LOS, don’t forget that. For a unit that is basically blind this is actually a very nice bonus that is often underestimated. Or unjustfully neglected.

[DynasticPlanet5]

@SMUM15236

What about paid labour? Let’s say each DLC replaces Paladin from a civ with Savar like new unit so that they can pay the animator for their job.

And that cost is then pushed onto us the consumer

[yuksely1992]

It’s not even free Bloodlines.

It’s worse than Bloodlines for their scouts and CA. They weren’t supposed to have generic knights either. This civ’s design would be laughed into oblivion if it was a custom civ created today.

[casusincorrabil]

Last time I checked Franks still had 51 % winrate overall on arabia.
What are you even talking about?

[smiki5five]

@benithisrael

Just uninstall return of Rome DLC and mountain royals DLC.

It doesn’t remove these units from online play.