Why is Tatars' civ Turks in Ivaylo mission 4?

As titled, why? Now that we have Tatars


whats the differance ? Both have same etnicity.Both are Turkic ppl.Same ppl same language same culture


Agree with OP. This is really weird, especially considering that they train Keshiks and Cavalry Archers, both typical Tatar units. Maybe because they wanted those Tatars to use the Middle Eastern architecture set, though as far as I know you can change the architecture set a certain civ uses with triggers and options.


Yeah, it’s really weird, I made a similar topic a while ago and nobody didn’t seem to care lol


I have another question,one of the tribes in the first genghis khan campaign had turks for the civi.why did it change to mongol and not tatars?

It is weird if you have zero idea that Tatars are actually Turks (Turk is an umbrella term for also Turkic people) and in a game where you do not have Tatars as civ, it will be implemented as Turks. It might be changed now to be Tatars as there is such civ in the game, this was not the case 3 years ago.

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No, Tatars are not Turks, they are Turkic, just like Turks, but it’s not the same.

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They come from the same root so why are you saying they are not the same? Cumans are also turkic are they different to tatars too?

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“Persians are also indo-european are they different to norwegians too?”


I know it’s not easy topic for linguistic point of view, but I think I made myself clear. They are not same, just like Serbians and Poles, or Hungarians and Fins, same root it is, but nothing more.

Cumans are also turkic are they different to tatars too?

In fact, the Cumans and Tatars are even more different than the Turks and Tatars, and they have nothing in common with the Turks except a similar language.
Cumans had fair hair (while other Turkic people only had dark hair) and much more Indo-European features, their culture and beliefs were also quite different from other Turkic people.

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it is the same. They are same people from different region. Stop talking nonesense. I have dozens of Tatar and Turkish friend they speak same they look similiar also both call themselves Turk.When i asked they said we are like brother who lives different region.

This is dumbest comparison post i have seen so far 🤦

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This is exactly true. But people generally don’t know Modern Turks or Seljuk&Ottoman Turks were from Middle Asian Steppes.

Because they just can’t understand the term Turkic is very big umbrella and Turkish etnicity is so huge because of thier nomadic&migrational life style. There are blonde & dark haired Turks everywhere. Just like there are dark haired Germans in the world or Black haired Vikings .But when it comes to asian people, generally people cant understand.

They are just same people living (migrated into) different regions and mixed with people that lives in region they had migrated.So after years passed their culture is still smilar life style is similar & language still smilar.
Turks,Tatars,Cumans,Kipchaks,Turkomans are coming from same people and same roots thats why after 3000 years of they have migrated from asia yet speaking same language.But Mongols are different then Turks.There are thousands of pre-nomadic clans living in Asia & Eurassia at first . Most of them were of Turkic origin but some of them Mongol & Manchurian & Tibetian origin.Mongols were more close to Chinese people in origin.Early Turks have more and more similar feature with Mongols as they had lived in same region as well.Another thing to be known is Huns … Huns were a big nomadic confederation consist of mostly Turks but Mongols & Manchurians also.When Asian Huns (Xiang-Nu) was collapsed many Turkic and Mongolic tribes extracted from that.Some of them migrated anatolia (Seljuks) Some of them migrated to Persia (Turkomans,some Cuman and Kırghız,Azerbajan Turks etc.) some migrated to Europe (Cumans) ,Some migrated to Caspian sea (Hunnic confederation of Attila including Oghuz Turks,Tatars,Mongols) etc etc… Its a very confusing & big history.
In short they are %100 same people

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Let me prove you wrong in a minute. I am Turkish from Turkey and I am blonde. I do not want to get to the fact that Turkic people were nomads for a long time and they exchanged genes with all other nations more often than the agricultural nations.

Also I live in a Scandinavian country nowadays where many Tatars live for centuries. They speak almost the same language as me, they eat same food, they have very similar moral values as my parents in Turkey etc etc. They also think two groups (nations?) are the same people. From another perspective there are probably millions of people living in Turkey who call themselves Tatar which mostly indicates that they migrated to Anatolia from elsewhere, not to signify a different race. So your Persians and Norwegians example is not even close. Fins and Hungarians are also nowhere so close to this. I know enough from both cultures that the relation of Fins and Hungarians have nothing making them as close as Turks and Tatars if you look at their language features, customs or foods. AFAIK, Hungarians are also as close to Turks as they are close to Fins.

Apart from all of this, Ivaylo mission should be played with Tatars as we have Tatars in the game so there is no question about it.

I am Turkish from Turkey and I am blonde.

Today it’s not a big deal, after 1000 years of cultural and ethnics mixing it’s not as uncommon to see bolnde Turk, however there is a reason why in Slavic languages Cumans were called “Polovitians”, and this reason is their hair and skin colour (Polovy - fair/pale/fawn/yellow hair), This makes them stand out from other Turkic peoples that were very well known to the Ruthenians. Besides, unlike the Tatars or Turks, they were pagans for most of their history, and in the 13th century, when they finally fled to Europe, they abandoned paganism in favor of Christianity, which made them even more different from others who have adapted Islam. Cuman language is also not Turkish language, it differed from it as much as Polish from Russian, Croatian from Czech, maybe a little less, but it was not the same language.
Tatars you know may have moral values like your family, but I don’t know what that changes. Europeans also share moral values that are almost the same in every nation, does that make Europeans the same?
As I mentioned above, the differences between Tatars and Turks are just as different between Poles and Serbs, once it was one group of people that over hundreds of years of history was divided into many smaller ones, and these in turn distinguished and created their own national identity. Even historically, Tatars did not consider themselves Turks.

Dude please dont say it anywhere cuz you are being laughed. xD
Find a any Turk,Tatar,Kırghız or Turkoman guy arround you open youtube and find Cuman language then let them listen to … So you will have your notice . Also please do not write about the things that you don’t know for sure 11 this will make people look down at you.Their language are same in the game even. Listen close…Balık-cı (Turks) Baluk-lar-men (Cumans) balık-baluk means fish and cı-cu means job men means (someone who does that)
Anladum (cuman) Anladım (Turkish)----Kulluk eter men (Cumans) vs Kulluk eder-im (Turkish)
Evet (Turks) Evveet (Cuman,Tatar) ---- Alğaç keser-men (Cumans) vs Ağaç keser-im or Ağaç keser ben (Turkish
Av-cı (Turks) Av-lar-men (Cumans) ---- Bir anca eder men (cumans) Bir an önce eder ben.(Turks)
Av-lar-ım (Turks)
Ne icun basumu ağrudırsunuz (Cuman king)— Ne için basımı ağrıdırsınız ? (Turkish)

wow ANOTHER statement with ZERO knowlegde about … THERE ARE MILLIONS OF TATARS living in Turkey calling themselves Turk.Also in Tatarstan yet they consider themselves as a Turk. Also Azarbaijan people call themlselves Turk. Dude you dont know them stop talking about them. Im Hungarian and i have read tons of historical things about my roots and Turks . Most of the Turks and other Turkic people are considered themselves as a brother&sister.Their language are %99.99 same.Roman Empire for its time even called us (Magyars) as a Turk (most probably because of Attila the Hun was of a Turkic origin).
NOTE: Before writing something that you don’t know for sure, keep it on your mind that there are thousands of people know all things and they may read and laugh at you.
Tatar-Turk-Cuman are 1 in etnicty origin. All came(derivated) from Huns.

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Just not true. Many Tatars out there actually consider themselves “russian” but I’ve never heard any of them considering themselves “Turks”. “Turkic” – obviously yes, but not “Turks”/“Turkish” since that’s for the ANATOLIAN ones which the aoe 2 civilization of the same name represents. That’s how this works in English (and also russian) – two separate terms.

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This post is so wrong in so many aspects, I do not even want to start responding. Also you do not sound like you want to learn anything new, so feel free to keep your opinions as they are :slight_smile:

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All came(derivated) from Huns.

Thats exacly what I was looking for. If I see statements like “Turks come from Huns” or “Turks and Mongols are the same” or any other turboturkic babble I just know it’s not even worth my time. However, I will make an exception here.
Problem is that with such a statements usually go hand in hand with information that is usually not true like for example:


I have just checked the demographics of Turkey, the largest group of Tatars are the Crimean Tatars, there are about 100k in Turkey. A little less than “millions”, plus if they consider themselves Tatars, they are probably not Turks, are they?

Also in Tatarstan yet they consider themselves as a Turk

Sorry to inform you, but they have very strong national identity, identify with Tatars or even Russians, not Turks.

i have read tons of historical things about my roots and Turks

Let me doubt 11

Most of the Turks and other Turkic people are considered themselves as a brother&sister

Can you prove this in any way or this is just a statement that you have seen too much time in youtube comments?

Do you know why I doubted in yours “tons of historical things”?

Attila the Hun was of a Turkic origin/All came(derivated) from Huns.

If you really got acquainted with the subject, you would know that the origin of the Huns is a controversial issue, there are many theories about it and the Turkish one is not even the most simple of them, they probably originated from Xiongnu, and as for the Xiongnu themselves, we are not sure who they were.

Tatar-Turk-Cuman are 1 in etnicty origin

Thats probably only one correct thing that you have write here. Yes, they had same origin, just like Slavs or Germans, but that dosen’t mean that they are a same people today. What next, are you gonna say that Russians and Poles are the same just because they have many similiar or even the same words in their langauages? Are you gonna give an arguemnts like “they calling themselves slavic brothers”?

Tatas is considered as a branch of Turk

There are millions of people has Tatar Branch but only %5-10 of them came to Turkey after Russian pressure .The ones that migrated from Russia are Cimeran Tatars. Most of others have allways been in Turkey/Anatolia.

How many Tatar friend do you have ? Im living with one :smiley: My wife xD All her family and our Tatar&Turk friends call themselves brother&sister they speak same language etc.etc.When i first meet her she said she is Turkish from Tatar branch (clan/tribe whatever)

We are sure

Thats exactly means Hyung-nu (Hun-nu – Hun’s) Xiang-nu was a Great Nomadic Confederation that is consist of Turkic and Mongol tribes . But mostly Turkic ones as Mongols have barely %10-15 population that Turkic Nomads have.(See Mongolian population today maybe u can understand what it is) also this is why Genghis Khans army was mostly made of Turkic clans.(Nearly all Arabian historians of that time called Mongol armies as Etrak(Turk or Tatar in arabic).North of China population has allways been dominated by Turks at that time.
I allways wanted to know as a Hungarian if i have any Turkic origin or not.Finally i got some interesting results and we may share some similiar roots. This is why i know many of things about Turks & Mongols.We are not from Europa (Hungarians) its for sure.We are from steppes its for sure.At first i thought that Attila the Hun was todays Hungarians ancestor but all knowledge leads the way that he possible had a Turkic or Turko-Mongolic origin.And todays Hungarians are not direct decentdents of Attila.etc etc. Its enough for me believe whatever u wish.Who cares my dude ? :smiley:

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