He’s here to present an argument, and he did. If you’re going to dismiss his, and be rude about it, then you’re not contributing anything. Please be kinder in future
Yes, the thing is Paladins are when FU simply one of the best units this game has to offer.
And not everything in this game comes down to cost efficiency. Momentum and pop efficiency is an important factor, like I said earlier a Konnik snowball can be very hard to stop, cause as you proved yourself, Halberdiers dont win the fight even if they outnumber 2v1. (Minor note: 50 -> 60 HP is 20% not 40%)
So the Konnik stays a strong, fun unit. I can agree with u that it does not have a “special purpose” instead of being simply the strongest unit Bulgarians can field.
Its stronger as the Paladin vs a few units, while weaker against most. And if I had the option, I would go most times go Paladin instead of Konnik. But that does not make it a weak unit.
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Sometimes, this is the special purpose of a unit, like the Franks Paladin.
Konnik is bad unit? Stop here…
it works to an extent with knights and cavaliers but Paladin has 7 pierce and 180HP, it’ll take 60 arbs to 1 shot one and once the archers get flanked, the numbers will fall off very fast
Look, I’m well aware that the FU Paladins are a very dangerous opponent against arbalests. Perhaps I should have worded myself more clearly since people are so very quick to latch on to the smallest detail in order to avoid the topic at hand. The knight-line is indeed a counter to archers, again poor wording from my side, but it is not a hard counter but is rather subject to a very fine balance throughout the game where either the archer-line or the knight-line will have the edge depending on terrain, numbers and upgrades.
I said this in order to accentuate how big of a impact it has to remove pierce armor and HP from a unit like the Konnik. As you say Paladin often fares well against Arbs but Cavalier have a far harder time.
I think it’s unfortunate that people would rather nitpick comments of mine than acknowledge that the question is a little more nuanced but I know that Trirem was an advocate of the current changes and his snide remarks shouldn’t surprise me, still it’s disappointing.
To be clear though, I feel like the change of the Konnik was a step in the right direction and though my rhetoric may be slightly prone to exaggerations at times (as one must be when presenting an argument) I’m not attacking anyone nor do I think the Konnik is terrible in and of itself and is indeed preferable over the Cavalier but rather terrible in the sense that an FU Paladin would have been just as good or preferable for the Civilization and that is in my opinion a sad situation for them.
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It is impossible that the enemy/you had gathered 60 arbs that can one shot pala and then was/you were able to outmicro you/him and kill all your/his pala if he/you wasn’t/weren’t behind something that protected him/you in a standard game. It takes around 5 sec for the pala to reach the arbs with its longest range. In 5 sec you/he managed to kill 20 paladins?
If it was 500 pop BF with 200 arbs, it is completely different and should be taken into consideration for balance.
you don’t have to zigzag, just use v when they shoot arrow.
Don’t bother too much with the censor, it just means the comment made someone salty and they flagged it. Fortunately it just adds 1 click to read, and eventually it should come back to normal.
I read the post and you are wrong. And be nice to people who are responding even if they didn’t read this very long text. The reason you are wrong is you’re looking at it in unit vs unit situations. In a reasonable game, people make 2 or even 3 types of units. In those types of games the konnik is very hard to counter. Counter units like skirms, halbs, and camels them selves are countered easily by other gold units. And in this case, the halb and camels cant efficiently kill the unit it is designed to kill. So if enemy goes halbs, mix in some champs or scorps and can easily take that fight. The only reasonable option is archers, but of course only in large mass. So konniks are like cataphracts in a way.
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DAFUK, stop resurrecting threads
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Based and Krepostpilled
Maybe you should not necropost…
why does it even matter? Serriously… what difference does it make?
Bagain Two-handed swordman is worse than generic champion. +5 melee armor make them good at melee fights especially against low melee damage targets like Hussar and Throwing Axeman but champion has 16% more hp and +1 damage which make it more resistance against arrow fire. Against high melee targets, bagain gives very little as well. For instance Bagain Two-handed swordman kil champion in 6 hits and generic champion kill Bagain THS in 7 hits. Japanese, Teuton, Aztec, Burmese, Slav champion beat bagain THS. Bagain bonus must be like +4 / +2 armor. Now, it is useless bonus.
Konnik cost should become 60f 60g as well. It is disrespect that Konnik go toe-to-toe against Paladin even though it is melee proficient unit as well as get huge 33% attack speed bonus from tech. 60f 60g would be okay for its performance.
Teutons are in tie, and remember, the civ gets all milita line upgrades for free and the BS upgrades also cost 50% less food and are researched 80% faster.
Huh do your remember this unit can be massed very easily at Kreposts right, and is strictly two units in one.
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Konnik is even now fine unit but it should get 10 gold discount since high gold cavalries as well as high food cost infantries is never good idea. Therefore, devs decrease Leitis and Keshik’s gold cost heavily. I still can’t accept that this unit can’t overwhelm Paladin even with 33% attack speed bonus.
Militia line upgrades free isn’t huge bonus. Useless bagain must be changed anyway.
Bceause Leitis was extremely OP long time ago? shortly after buff, so they essentially lost 1 PA, and Keshik has much weaker attack but is trained extremely fast, in fact is too easily massed that the food cost was increased, also they have the same PA as paladin.
Maybe because they aren’t supposed to be a paladin killer?, unlike Leitis and Boyar? Furthermore you have to think they need counters because they are really hard to deal at large numbers.
Remember when I made a thread complaining about the necromancy in this forum and some people who actually exist disagreed with my assessment of it being a problem?
Yeah. Still can’t believe it myself.
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i mean, cmon, the discussion forum is a lost cause, there will be 10 new topics pop up regarding various changes to this and that, pages and pages of reasons why, demeaning insults, endless back and forth between people who will never change thier mind, no matter the reasons, etc etc etc all before I can hit even finish this reply.