Why We Hate Japan as a Civ

How long will u still complain about Japan after ALL THE NERFS that were done to that civ… Japan is completely and utterly dead and barely playable at this point. And seing someone saying they are S-tier makes them look like they lost a bunch of games to Japan and came to the forums to complain. I lose to Ottomans all the time - what should i do - create a thread on how ottomans are OP and they should be redesigned? This mentallity of “if u cant beat it” its OP really went too far. African civs - objectively OP. Japan - a dead civ with slow rush that can be rushed and decimated on the 10 min mark - thats how bad Japan is rn - and u peeps want more nerfs?? Jesus Christ, some people.

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I’m advocating for an adjustment to civ design. I’m not talking about anything being Over Powered.

Samurai are not used a lot in supremacy because of their unit type, in its unit type it is S tier.

Flaming arrows are good against other cannons and infantry, they are cheaper, train faster, move faster and go into firing stance quickly. 5 flaming arrows can counter 5 falconets and still kill infantry. You need to train culverins, flaming arrows can take on culverins cost effectively or can run away before much damage is done. (This is mostly fine since they have no culverins)(not OP but S tier)

Japan has enough eco cards and perks to have an eco as good as a European civ or better and their eco is easy to get going and protect. (Mills and plantations only collect about 70% of the in-game UI amount because of walking time, rice paddies are 100% efficient no walking time. You can test this, there is a video on youtube)(the point is their eco and boom is great)

I have nothing against Yumi it’s just a suggestion. Ashi is too important for the civ to make D tier. Sams are not used enough. Yabusame are not used as much and make up for not having culverins and are worse than goons at anti cav but still effective.

All their units are S tier and in the context of the civ as a whole (eco ,perks ,ease of use and one of the best in every strategy). I just think they should have a weaknesses and maybe it can be their skirm unit similar to the British who have a longbow which can be used early game by itself or late game as support.

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I am curious Japan gets non-stop complaint since DE released and I am very surprised they are dead due to the last patch little nerf.

But I agree compared to African, Japan is nothing.

In a poll last December someone asked “what civ would you remove from the game?”. In first place was Japan with a third of the votes even more hated than Sweden. Where there is smoke there is fire. I think it is not because they are OP but because they can do everything, do it easily and have no weaknesses.

Japan is one of the most played civs, they win in tournaments and in noob games.

Otto do a Jan rush which is one of their better strats, they can also do other things like villie boom or water boom but they are just ok at those. You misunderstand, I can play Japs and I can beat Japs, I would like if they were not the most hated civ and if they had a weakness because of all the strats they can do well and with ease.

We just having polite discussions. Thank you for your input.

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Yeah - they are OK with that, having 20 jans and 5-10 abyss around 8-9min in my base is completely fine, but jApAn oP, stronk EkO. ( how about Dutch and their Eco, how about Brits and their eco - let me guess - they are OK right? …Yes they are ok meanwhile Japan can be countered with 5 pikes)

What tournaments are u watching mate? Are we playing the same game? Last i checked Brits were the top civ winning.

Last december sweden were fresh and everybody were laming with them - thats why i stopped playing the game for one year. And saying that Japan can do everything is absolute garbage - have u seen the african units and what those civs can do? That is " can do everything" . U cant rush with Japan like u would do in the classic. And 5 pikes can roam around killing shrines - and with that housing the player and murdering his eco- while u mind your own bussiness. So no mate - Japan is trash these days - and that Yabusame nerf just hit the last nail in the coffin.

Most of these complaints about Japan being OP come from treaty players, i can bet my 2 cherry orchars on that - yes after 40 minutes Japan can get decent - i repeat decent - not OP. Classic Japan - OP - DE Japan - Trash.

PS: And even in classic, Japan was not as strong as prepatch Sweden. Shredder Caroleans plus 2 cannons in colonial age - give me a break. I apologize brother but this is as civil as i can be after all this constant complaining about Japan being the God of Aoe3.

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What is this, a poll from 21 of july 2021 - postpatch? It says Sweden if my eyes dont decieve me.

And it does not include the africans because they came out on the 2nd of August.

Explanation - people had enough of playing with Sweden and when they got on the other side being trashed by Sweden in 8 mins - suddenly they changed their opinion. Same thing goes with the african civs - after people reverted to their mains and got tower rushed, cannonneered, javelined and what not by the african civs - they also started voicing their opinions that - yes, these civs are broken af and we need a balance patch.

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flqming arrows don’t even one-shot the majority of veteran heavy infantry, I don’t understand the facination with nerfing flaming arrows. They barely do their job at all and are so low hp you can just right click with the majority of musk units or any dragoon type unit

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I’m not talking about anything being OP you misunderstand.

Japan can do a good rush with Torii Gates, a Daimyo, unit shipment can be sent twice, consulate troops. Ashi move fast so you can get across the map quick. you can easily kill 5 pikes with your first batch of Ashi and than the enemy makes 5 skirm/musk next you can run away (extra speed) and with your next 5 Ashi you can beat 5 skirm and 5 pike.

You can also just walk past the enemy skirms/musk and go kill vills since they can’t catch you. If the enemy makes musk you can start a Yumi mass that you can use all game, other civs only have xbow in age 2 and then don’t want to use them later.

If you mess up the rush then go Age 3 and hit that 7 vills twice. You can’t raid Japan well since they don’t get hunts. The enemy will usually not march straight into your base because they have to burn down shrines. In that time you have line of sight and time to prepare. if a shrine was build with 75w (4 animals) then it will pay for itself in 2 mins.

Japan has good age 2. if you play against and Otto you can look at their cards and see what is coming and prepare.

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I’m not talking about nerfing flaming arrows I just said they are S tier. They are not so easy to kill with infantry since they are fast, have more range than a falconet and pack fast. They are also cheap so you can make more of them and if some die it’s fine cause they are cheap.

Newer civs should be adjusted indeed and require more attention right now but that doesn’t mean all the other civs are fine. Japan has been balanced (1v1 sup) but the underlying issues have not be resolved when it comes to the civ design. Japan is probably the civ that has been complained about the longest. I have stated my reasons above and have mentioned earlier how Sweden and the African civs have some good design choices even though they may not be balanced.

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@BazzZ94 Yes yes…try and do that. It works around 800-900 elo and below. I replied to your post not about the civ design but about the “yumi nerf” u were asking for. The civ design on the other hand is superb - when i got my hands on this game all other civs looked the same(warchiefs civs are great also). Im decent with every civ but i stuck with Japan only because they are a bit harder to master and u need to multitask. Japan catched my eye with its civ design. Everybody complains about shrines while dutch can have the whole coin in the world…smh. Reconsider your thoughts about Japan mate. Japan and China to me are the most interesting civs to play with because of their design.

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@Lyvione I disagree with what you say but I appreciate your input.

About the banks…
Banks cost 700 resources and take 5mins to pay for themselves while a shrine with 4 animals that cost 75w only takes 2mins to pay for itself. Among other things. This is off topic though.

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A shrine costs 75 wood and 2 minutes to pay off, that means 37.5 resources per minute.

A bank costs 700 (pretty sure it is less with cards but whatever) and pays itself in 5 minutes, that’s 140 per minute. Banks win.

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I main japan and after reading your posts i must say that you have no idea how japan works mate.

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tbh does anyone in this forum ever actually understand how any civ works?

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Bruh, you literally only have to build all 75 wood shrines as soon as possible. Then you got factories in age 2 to do literally watever you want.

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I was playing lakota the other day against Japan. Poor dude never managed to get 5 shrines.

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Must be a low ELO, with standart Japan build you can get 10 shrines before 6 min, even more if you find wood treasures.

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Im pretty sure that playing this game for about 10+ years - i have the bare minimum knowledge of how Japan works oh u wise and full of knowledge guy.
@Moonshadow7475 this happens - answer to @hamletlopez . If u play against a 500 elo player u can get those shrines gooood. But people like moonshadow happen.

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Doubtful. it takes around 4:50-5:50 for japan to get to age 2 depending on starting resources and treasures. 10 shrines before 6 minutes is 750 wood + 200 wood (for consulate). It is literally impossible unless someone gets very lucky.

And even if you invest into that, you’re dead against an early rush, you will have no military.
Specifically, the lakota early axe rider rush is very strong against Japan.

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