Age of Empires III: Definitive Edition - The Asian Dynasties 2 and 3 (two DLC's proposed)

Age of Empires III: DE III - Discussion
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Hello everyone in my topic!

I would like to present to you my proposal for two completely new heirs of The Asian Dynasties DLC, which was released in 2007 for the classic version of AoE 3. The purpose of these two DLCs would be to add civs, Minor Civilizations and maps from the Indian Subcontinent, Southeast Asia and the Far East. Additionally, such a DLC would add exclusive Historical Battles from Asia. Of course, completely new DLCs about Asia would be inspired by its predecessor, but they would be more immersive.

Along with the addition of completely new Asian civs, there would also be a rework of the existing Asian civs in the game (Chinese, Indian and Japanese) in order to deepen the immersion of these civs and bring them up to the standards of the new Asian civs.

I invite you to comment and present your thoughts and suggestions because I do not know enough about these civs. Treat this topic as a ground for more serious civs suggestions.

Age of Empires III: Definitive Edition - The Asian Dynasties 2

These DLCs would focus on Southeast Asia and the Far East. It would add the following three brand new civs to the game:

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Cambodians

Elephant-mounted units.

They could have bonuses related to agriculture, considering the rich farming history of Cambodia, or bonuses related to elephant units.

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Siamese

Focus on bonuses related to trade, naval power, or religious influence, reflecting historical aspects of the Siamese Kingdom.

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Vietnamese

Guerilla units and guerilla tactics and bonuses related to forested terrain, as Vietnam has a history of using such tactics in warfare.

Vietnamese could have technology related to guerrilla warfare tactics.

Age of Empires III: Definitive Edition - The Asian Dynasties 3

These DLCs would focus on India. It would add the following three brand new civs to the game:

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Bengalis

This civilization would specialize in Ships, as Bengal produced ships for the Mughal, Ottoman and British navies. - for this reason, Bengalis civ could be a useful ally for naval games (via team bonuses or the shared of naval units). Include units like Bengal tigers and riverine warfare vessels.

The Bengalis were also famous for their powerful Artillery. Bengal was a major exporter of gunpowder and sulfur to Europe until the 19th century. Because of this, they could have a variety of powerful artillery - they definitely wouldn’t need the European Artillery from the Consulate.

Bengalis civ unique buildings would be a replacement for:

  • Dock,
  • Castle

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Burmese

The Burmese civ could be, like the Maltese civ, a defensive civilization - because they managed to stop the invasion of the much stronger Qing several times. Like the Bengalis civ, they could be focused on the sea, but not on such a large scale. Elephant-mounted units. Create technologies related to Buddhism and elephant combat.

Burma is famous for its majestic gold religious architecture. Kyaung, a typical Burmese Buddhist temple, should definitely be a unique building replacing Monasteries for the Burmese civ.

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Dravidians

I know some people don’t like the Dravidians civ as an umbrella for the South Indian nations or as a Hindu Indian civ. I think that to represent the numerous nations of the Indian subcontinent and beyond, there should be Minor Civilizations, which would be based on nations and not religions. This civilization would be mainly based on the Maratha Empire and the Vijayanagara Empire.

This civilization would take over all the things (units, Wonders, HC cards) that would fit them from the Indian civs present in the game (in this place, the current Indian civs would receive new Mughal things). Their unique buildings could be:

  • Spice Grove
  • Gajashaala - unique elephant Stable
  • Temple Car - a mobile temple that heals nearby units and increases their efficiency when unpacked. Vulnerable to attack while in transit.

A special bonus for owners of both of these DLCs - Koreans civ!!!

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Koreans

Introduce Korean Hwacha artillery and more.

Asian Communities - a completely new Minor Civilizations category for Asian maps

Creating brand new minor civilizations for Asian maps in Age of Empires III can add depth and variety to gameplay. These minor civilizations, known as “Asian Communities” in your concept, can provide unique bonuses, units, and technologies that reflect the cultural diversity and historical significance of Asia. Here are some ideas for new Asian minor civilizations:

  1. Tibetan Community:
  • Unique Unit: Tibetan Yak Riders - Mounted infantry units on yaks, known for their resilience. Tibetan Monks - Healers with the ability to convert enemy units and provide area healing.
  • Bonuses: Emphasize high-altitude bonuses and resource gathering in harsh conditions.
  • Technologies: Research Tibetan yak training and mountain warfare tactics for combat and economic benefits.

  1. Sikkimese Community:

    • Unique Unit: Sikkimese Archers - Skilled archers with special abilities in mountainous terrain. Akali Nihangs - Elite melee infantry wielding traditional weapons like chakrams.
  • Bonuses: Emphasize mountain warfare bonuses and unique mountaineer technologies.

  • Technologies: Research Sikkimese mountain fortifications and archery tactics for combat and defensive advantages.

  1. Javanese Community:

    • Unique Unit: Javanese Kris Warriors - Infantry units wielding the traditional Javanese kris, with unique melee abilities.
  • Bonuses: Gain resource bonuses related to rice farming and access to unique melee technologies.

  • Technologies: Develop Javanese martial arts and rice cultivation techniques for combat and economic benefits.
  1. Assamese Community:
  • Unique Unit: Ahom Cavalry - Skilled cavalry archers with high mobility and ranged attacks.

  • Bonuses: Focus on tea cultivation and trade-related bonuses.

  • Technologies: Research Assamese tea farming and cavalry tactics for economic and combat advantages.
  1. Sunda Community:
  • Unique Unit: Sunda ###### Warriors - Fast-moving infantry armed with blow darts and poison attacks.

  • Bonuses: Emphasize forest-based bonuses and unique poison technologies.

  • Technologies: Develop Sunda forest knowledge and poison-making techniques for combat and economic benefits.
  1. Tamil Community:
  • Unique Unit: Chola War Elephants - Heavily armored war elephants with powerful melee attacks.

  • Bonuses: Gain bonuses for elephant units and access to unique elephant technologies.

  • Technologies: Research Tamil elephant training and war strategies for combat advantages.
  1. Bornean Community:
  • Unique Unit: Bornean Pirates - Agile naval units specializing in hit-and-run tactics.

  • Bonuses: Emphasize trade bonuses and naval advantages, reflecting the seafaring nature of Bornean communities.

  • Technologies: Develop pirate technologies for naval combat and resource plundering.
  1. Sri Lankan Community:
  • Unique Unit: Kandyan Swordsmen - Infantry units equipped with traditional swords and armor.

  • Bonuses: Gain advantages in spice trade and agriculture, reflecting Sri Lanka's historical significance as a spice producer.

  • Technologies: Research Kandyan culture and spice trade technologies for economic and unit benefits.
  1. Nepali Community:
  • Unique Unit: Gurkha Warriors - Elite melee and ranged infantry units known for their bravery.

  • Bonuses: Focus on mountaineering and guerrilla warfare, providing advantages in rough terrain.

  • Technologies: Develop Gurkha combat techniques and mountain warfare tactics.
  1. Bhutanese Community:
  • Unique Unit: Bhutanese Archers - Skilled long-range archers with a focus on accuracy.

  • Bonuses: Gain resource bonuses for preserving natural landscapes and protecting wildlife.

  • Technologies: Research Bhutanese fortifications and archery techniques for defensive and offensive advantages.
  1. Balinese Community:
  • Unique Unit: Barong Dancers - Mythical creature summoners that can summon Barong warriors.

  • Bonuses: Emphasize cultural celebrations, providing resource bonuses during festivals and feasts.

  • Technologies: Research Balinese dance and artistry for unit and economic improvements.

Brand new Asian maps

Himalayan Highlands:

Terrain: Mountainous terrain with steep cliffs, deep valleys, and snowy peaks.
Unique Features: Limited resource availability and the presence of the Tibetan Community as a minor civilization, offering unique trade opportunities and access to specialized units skilled in mountain warfare.

Borneo Archipelago:

Terrain: A sprawling archipelago with dense rainforests, rivers, and coastal areas.
Unique Features: Abundant tropical resources and the presence of the Balinese Community as a minor civilization, providing unique naval units and trade advantages.

Sumatra Volcano:

Terrain: A volcanic island with fertile slopes and lava flows.
Unique Features: Volcanic eruptions periodically disrupt the map, and the presence of the Javanese Community as a minor civilization grants access to unique volcano-related technologies and units.

Siberian Taiga:

Terrain: Dense taiga forests, frozen lakes, and tundra.
Unique Features: Players must cope with extremely cold temperatures and harsh winters. The inclusion of the Buryat Community as a minor civilization offers unique winter survival technologies and units.

Bali Paradise:

Terrain: A tropical paradise with sandy beaches, lush jungles, and calm seas.
Unique Features: The map offers an abundance of resources, and the presence of the Sunda Community as a minor civilization introduces Balinese pirate units and trade opportunities.

Kashmir Valley:

Terrain: A picturesque valley surrounded by mountains with flowing rivers.
Unique Features: Rich farmland and scenic beauty, with the inclusion of the Tibetan Community as a minor civilization, granting access to mountain warfare units and technologies.

Historical Battles

  1. Khmer Empire vs. Ayutthaya Kingdom (Cambodia and Siam):
  •     Historical Context: Recreate the historical conflict between the Khmer Empire and the Ayutthaya Kingdom in the late 14th century.

  •     Objectives: As Cambodia, defend against Siamese attacks on Angkor. As Siam, launch an invasion and capture key Khmer cities, including Angkor Thom.
  1. Burmese-Siamese Wars (Burma and Siam):
  •     Historical Context: Simulate various Burmese-Siamese wars of the 16th and 18th centuries.

  •     Objectives: As Burma, defend against Siamese incursions or, as Siam, launch offensives to expand your territory. Key battles include the Battle of Ava and the Burmese invasions of Ayutthaya.
  1. Vietnamese-Ming Conflict (Vietnam and Korea):
  •     Historical Context: Recreate Vietnam's resistance against Ming Dynasty invasions during the 15th century, with Korea's involvement.

  •     Objectives: As Vietnam, fend off Ming forces and maintain your independence. As Korea, assist the Ming or mediate peace negotiations, reflecting historical diplomatic efforts.
  1. Chola Dynasty Expansion (Dravidian):
  •     Historical Context: Represent the Chola Dynasty's expansion into Southeast Asia during the 11th century.

  •     Objectives: As the Dravidian civilization, lead Chola forces in campaigns to establish dominance over Sri Vijaya and other Southeast Asian kingdoms.
  1. Bengal Nawabs vs. East India Company (Bengal):
  •     Historical Context: Recreate the Battle of Plassey in 1757, where the British East India Company defeated Siraj-ud-Daula's Bengal forces.

  •     Objectives: As Bengal, attempt to thwart the British invasion led by Robert Clive. As the British, secure victory by capturing key locations and eliminating resistance.

Bonus for owners of both DLC’s

  1. Wars
  • Historical Context: Recreate the ##### Wars of the mid-19th century when British forces clashed with the Qing Dynasty.

  • Objectives: As the Qing Dynasty, resist British incursions and protect Chinese interests, or play as the British East India Company and secure trade privileges.
  1. Sengoku Period
  • Historical Context: Represent the Sengoku Period (Warring States Period) in Japan during the 16th century, marked by samurai warfare and territorial conflict.

  • Objectives: Choose to play as one of the powerful clans such as the Oda, Takeda, or Uesugi, and aim to unify Japan under your rule.
  1. Battle of Shiroyama
  • Historical Context: The Battle of Shiroyama took place on September 24, 1877, during the Satsuma Rebellion. It was a decisive battle between the Imperial Japanese Army (loyal to the Meiji Emperor) and the rebel samurai forces from Satsuma Province, who sought to restore the power of the Tokugawa shogunate. The battle marked the end of the Satsuma Rebellion and the last stand of the samurai against the modernized Imperial forces.

  • Objectives:**Imperial Japanese Army (Loyalists)**:Capture Saigo Takamori: Locate and defeat Saigo Takamori, who is leading the rebel forces from a fortified position  Secure Shiroyama Hill: Defeat the rebel forces and capture Shiroyama Hill. Protect the Emperor's Authority: Ensure the Meiji Emperor's authority is preserved by defeating the rebel samurai. **Rebel Samurai Forces (Rebels)**:Defend Shiroyama Hill: Hold Shiroyama Hill against Imperial attacks and prevent the loyalists from capturing it.Protect Saigo Takamori: Defend Saigo Takamori's position and keep him alive.Preserve Samurai Honor: As the rebel samurai, fight bravely and protect the legacy of the samurai way of life.
  1. Battle of Panipat (Mughals):
  • Historical Context: Recreate the pivotal Battle of Panipat, such as the First Battle of Panipat (1526) or the Third Battle of Panipat (1761).

  • Objectives: As the Mughals, fend off rival Indian kingdoms (e.g., the Marathas) or, as the opposing forces, attempt to overthrow Mughal dominance.
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Good suggestions.
However, the Cambodians were in an dark age during this entire period. I think it would make more sense to put a different civ in their place. Maybe the Acehnese, Javanese/Bantenese or even the Malays.

Splitting India is kind of like opening a can of worms. It’s hard to choose which civs to pick, but I think the Marathas are a stronger candidate than either the Bengalis or the Dravidians

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Even though the Malays are not from Oceania, I think they would fit into a DLC focusing on Oceania. Malays civ could appear in such a DLC along with Maori civ + optionally also Hawaiians civ.

The Dravidians civ would be based on the Maratha Empire and also on the Vijayanagara Empire (in the early game).

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A Dravidian civ could encompass Mysore and Vijayanagara, among others (although I’m a bit skeptical about these umbrella civs), but not the Marathi, since they are Indo-Europeans.
The Sikhs would also be another good option.

However, since any Indian split could basically mean the current Indian civ should be removed, I see a South-East Asia DLC more likely.
The Burmese, Siamese and Vietnamese are all very good options for the game (although the Burmese are quite unpopular for the community for some reason, the perform very badly in almost all polls). Apart from these 3,I think the best options would be any of the Nusantaran sultanates.

I would put the Polynesian civs in a independent DLC though. Despite the linguistic similarities, the cultures of insular SE Asia are more heavily influenced by India.

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Which is why they could be a great civ to be introduced into this game, just like when African Royals civs were announced and I bet most didn’t think about Hausa and got to learn about them afterwards.

Also AoE2’s Burmese campaign Bayinnaung could be a potential leader for them.

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Yeah, I agree. Actually, playing aoe2 is what sparked my interest in that country in first place.
A SE Asia DLC with the Burmese, Siamese and Vietnamese would be fantastic.
I also think that same reasoning could be applied to Central Asia, which is also relatively unpopular. Most people can’t even tell the diference between those countries. But yeah, I wouls also like to see the Kazakhs and Uzbeks in the game.

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I once created the concept of a Tatars civ that had a unique Age Up mechanic that allowed that civ to transform in many ways (including remaining a nomad, becoming an Uzbek Empire, or becoming a Crimean Khanate).

I thought that the Tartars civ could be one big Central Asian civ representing the Mongolian and Turkic peoples through a completely unique mechanic available only to them.

It is obvious that all these nations have nomadic roots. This civ would have the ability to choose a nation during Age Up (up to the 2nd Age and up to the 4th Age).

During Age Up to Age 2 there would be such possibilities:

  1. Timurid Empire,
  2. Golden Horde,
  3. Moghulistan
  4. Stay a nomad - Most Mongolian units and the ability to unpack and move buildings (buildings retain the Nomadic look).

During Age Up to Age 4 there would be such possibilities:

  1. Crimean Khanate,
  2. Kazakh Khanate,
  3. Emirate of Bukhara
  4. Stay a nomad (available if you choice “Stay a nomad” before)

I think it could be really interesting and give many possibilities to play one civ in many ways.

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Pretty bare bones ### it’s a starting point.

Yeah I kinda agree that Cambodia doesn’t really have what it takes to make a full civ in this period, they weren’t much more relevant than, say, Champa or the Shan States in the early modern period, they were mostly just tributaries to either Siam or Vietnam depending on who was fighting over it at any given moment, the only thing that sets them apart from the other two is that Cambodia is an independent country now.

I’d probably have the Javanese as a civilization in their stead, they are the best middle point between having a generic Indonesia civilization which is a historical absurdity before the 20th century and having an absurdly specific civilization like, I dunno, ############# or Aceh or what have you. In my opinion of course.

I do have rough ideas for each one of these civilizations. I actually considered Burma not so much as a defensive civ (Vietnam is much more fitting for that) but a very aggressive militaristic civ with a somewhat weaker eco. Eh, I’ll get to it when I get to it.

Surprised you wrote absolutely nothing about the Philippines, I understand not having them as a playable civ since they were mostly a series of kingdoms, states, tribes and whatnot that just happen to have a common identity by being colonized by Spain, but still, some maps and sites would make a huge difference.

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Maybe Malays civ would be more good for be a civ than Cambodians?

If the Cambodians were not a full-fledged civ, I think that as a Minor Civilization they could be very interesting - especially from an architectural point of view.

I thought the Philippines could be represented with at least one Minor Civilization.

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Malay could work, they do have an issue of not having one big state you could theme the entire civ around since they were mostly just sultanates that ended up allying with the british (for better or worse). But if italians and germans work as civ even though they suffer from the same problem, then sure why not, a “malays” civ is doable.

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This civ could always be based on the most famous of the Malay Sultanates. Were there any significant differences between them?

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The Malays are probably the best candidate for an umbrella civ. But note that it’s still a bit of a stretch.
While it’s true they have cultural hegemony over insular SE Asia and their language was used by pretty much every major sultanate there, the Acehnese, Bantanaese, Javanes, etc. were still different peoples.

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I’d like to amend this if I may. Borneo is huge - you can fit Germany and Portugal within it and the tribes of Borneo (wrongly lumped together as Dayak) are prominent during the timeframe. So much so, that ‘Bornean Pirates’ really don’t do them justice. All of these following ‘Communities’ can be used on other maps that surround Borneo as well as Borneo-based ones, due to them being very mobile in South East Asia.

I’d suggest:

Ibans (the more maritime tribe, once refered to as Sea-Dayaks)

Bidyuh (a powerful Borneo interior tribe - once referred to as the ‘Land Dayaks’)

  • Bidyuh Warrior - Heavy Ranged Infantry (Musketeer-like), armed with long blowgun-spears! At range, they can poison and in melee they use the spear.

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  • Borich - A female witch-doctor who acts as a Healer.

  • Tech - Ngayau (headhunting). Adds Combat Promotion to Bidyuh Warriors

  • Tech - Swidden Cultivators. Adds a small Coin & Food ‘bounty’ upon harvesting all the Wood from a tree (i.e. tree falls down and you get additional resource).

There’s loads more tribes, however these are some of the most prominent.

If you want a true piracy community, I’d suggest adding a Moro Pirate Stronghold as they were dotted around Philippines, Borneo, Malaysia and were abundant during the whole time-span.

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Really cool weapon :astonished:

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I think the Sultanate of Johor are a fairly good candidate for the Malays. They became a regional power when Malacca was seized by the Portuguese (originally being a part of it) and Aceh declined. It lasted from the 16th to late 19th century (when it became a British Protectorate).

They also had a great relationship with the
Orang Laut who were a expert seafaring ethnic used as Johor’s (and originally Malacca’s) privateers, pirates, raiders and general sea-based protectors.

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Just call the civ Malays man, this ain’t AoE4 where you must have a state for each civ (or a single person, apparently). No need to back yourself into a corner.

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Yeah, fair enough then. I guess the Sultanates were coming and going through a revolving door anyway.

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Moreover, you need to think in terms of marketing. There is certainly a greater probability that more people have heard of Malays (even thanks to AoE 2) than about Johor or Malacca.

The name civ should be as simple as possible to remember and pronounce.

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I feel like Vietnamese would be best served as a Federal civ with ties to French no matter how stupid it seems. Same with Indonesians and ties to Dutch. Arabs as well can serve as the Ottoman Federal counterpart. We can get Malay, Khmer, Moro, Siberian natives (Filipino revolution for Spanish, anyone?)

I think a good number of total Asian civs is eight, since any more and you struggle to get ones that were “significant” enough in the time period without needing to split certain umbrella civs (e.g. Chinese being broken up into Han+Manchu Chinese and Khalkha+Daur Mongols).

We’ve already got three:

  1. Indians
  2. Chinese
  3. Koreans

So who would be the other five, then?
4) Koreans (see my thread for a way they might look, it’s got a few pictures, 40% of the deck, the full unit roster, & the full tech tree). Infantry and naval boom civ, mediocre cavalry, good artillery, and disincentivized from taking trade lines. AFAIK, my outline once finished should represent the only civ without a SINGLE Trading Post or native alliance improving card.
5) Afghans. The “Graveyard of Empires” should be included, and the Pashtuns technically had an empire during the period in the form of the Durrani state. Good idea for a civ that can reuse some visual assets and cards from Indians and Ottomans, but have a unique roster of its own.
6) Tai. The Thai and related groups, I don’t know enough about them to say what the civ should be about.
7) Uzbeks. No we’re not getting Mongols, and I think this would make AoE3 the first RTS to actually have playable Uzbeks as a principle civ/faction/country option. Could also potentially re-use Indian visual assets? Just rename the Caravanserai to a Stable already and give it to Uzbeks and Afghans

8) Persians. The other major omission besides Korea. I’m sure enough stuff people have posted here exists to cobble together a coherent civ outline, I know @HoopThrower has dived into their stuff before.

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They will be more attractive if be another Category of civ than Asian - Central Asian / Steppe / or Nomadic Civilizations.

Same - Islamic Civilizations

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