Did you read the whole post? I said give them to Spanish and Portuguese.
I suppose, but I quite like them having both.
Too much of a crossover with current Goths, and not as unique.
I don’t really mind what happens, that’s just the first idea I had.
Orthodoxy is bad, so I’m open to anything that can improve it.
Well, ideally it would be cool if Turks got Sipahi or something to replace knights, but I don’t think that’s happening, so I suggested SL to represent that kind of.
It wasn’t that you said that, it was that you worded it in a way that made me think I had implied they lose the techs 
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Longbow has significant advantage over arbalest. They get +1 range and +1 atk. People prefer longbow in a long run. Buffing longbow further seems not a good idea.
It’s not really a buff. It’s to counteract removing the +1 range in Castle Age, which promotes Longbow use earlier in the game.
I think that this is far too many changes at once to be anything close to reasonable
Also if you think reducing the frank castle bonus by 5% is going to stop them from spamming them everywhere…
Well 5% is only 65 stone every two castles extra. It might stop them from dropping one extra castle tops.
Eh, I like to do a ton of changes once every few months or whatever.
I mean, that’s one castle less I guess. I also didn’t look at the outcome, just picked a change I liked . Also any less and it conflicts with or is worse than the Incan bonus. I guess it could be left alone.
not sarcastic, - 200 f instead for 150 f. before I sugguest to only - 150f and gold.
china with me ok not weak but many time I have delay update age with it civil if compare with the other. but not much people think like me so I dont talk about - 150 instead for 200 more. chukonu I dont know need see how mayan nerf until to now just see mayan is 1 best acher civil ):))))
If you play Chinese right at higher levels, you will have a normal uptime, but a two villager lead. With this change, you can now train a villager straight away, meaning less idle time and it is easier for lower level players to use the civ, but you should still get the same lead roughly.
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Lose access to Genitour.I still see players make Genitour in 1v1. They are available in archery range while Camel archer available in castle. This is a significant advantage over camel archer under some circumstances.
A worse version of Cuman civ bonus?
Agree to tune down Bohemian strength in closed maps.
Hussite wagons should keep the armor class to allow mangonel to do massive dmg. As a siege unit, they deserve min range.
Seems a nice change.
Burmese urgently need help against archers. I think you can keep the current UT. But give arambai +6 vs spearmen will help against pikes+xbow a bit.
+3 villagers is the identity of Chinese. Dont remove it. Maybe reduce some starting wood/gold instead.
Agree.
At least limit the production in castle. Btw, is cuman ok to get bracer?
Too extreme if all of them implemented at once.
Imo, the goth champion line can get the final armor upgrade back through UT due to supplies.
Incas is balanced. No big buff is required. But you can change the team bonus to infantry +2 LOS.
Agree with this change to Indians but no to other changes.
A weaker version of Chinese but with lower versatility.
No need unless you want Italians fight meso civs
better or their capability vs gunpowder improved.
Gc is hard to mass. Reducing its TT further for both regular and elite is more necessary due to lack of halbs.
Sicilians should lose conversion resistance at least. Civs with either good monks or HC/siege can counter it. Or else, tower rush sicilians is almost necessary.
This is a complete kill to their eco and identity. They dont have powerful military options even though zerk partially fulfill the role of power units. If zerk is not backed up by good eco, vikings will be too bad.
Notice that 5 vills is a weird spot - 6 vills are just enough to support non stop TC, so chinese will now be popping one vill (+loom) and have to crazily collect food from vills for next ~0.2 villtime, I think this will actually make Chinese a bit more awkward to play (previously once you added the 7th vill it is pretty smooth, and the initial 6 vills can support the TC)
So after actually looking in depth i like some of your changes (mayans)
Others though? Like the immortals aura effect and slav monk healing have zero place in aoe2 imo.
Also dont like the paper monry change. With vineyards the Burgundians villagers are tied to their farms. Each farm is 60 wood. The only thing tieing down woodchoppers is a 100 wood lumbercamp that multiple can use.
Having to create the 6th will cause you to be unable to research loom and since the 6th vill isn’t collecting food your 7th Vill will be slower. I appreciate what you are going for, but this is definitely a nerf which is arguable justified but if you want to make it easier for new players than make them start with 75F.
Trebuchet has low accuracy vs units but high accuracy vs buildings. Is arambai possible to have much higher accuracy specifically against spears? Imo, this together with their UT can helps a lot.
El Dorado is a legend in the middle of the Amazon jungle
It does not make sense at all for a UT
Incas are underrated and in a good spot right now if anything I’d give them cheaper (or faster) eagles but just a bit
But I wonder if the incoming DLCs (if there are) would include more eagles civs that could use these bonus
Thats very underwhelming I would decrease it to 30 Seconds in general considering how garbage they are in sustained fights. If i had to give them an effect, it would give all calvary charge damage equal to half of their attack (At FU Hussar 6.5, Coustillier 7.5, and Paladin +9). Considering the cost and the lack of bloodlines this might be justifiable.
Unique? Goth?
You are already going to remove the bonus that the Goth hunter can carry more.
Why not just give it to Magyars?
You suggest lots of things but do not care the result at all?
That is the worst attitude when people are talking about changing.
Every civilization in the world had its own heavy cavalry troops, and the knight line represents these military establishments, Turks are no exception. The Sipahi you want is represented by Cavalier already.
Not to mention that Sipahi has become the name of a much-loved UT, solidly a part of the game already.
Poles have by far among the highest winrates on arena, and the Folwarks eco is by far the best eco on arena right now, is completely unmatchable, add then you gain from Stone mines tho.
And the UT is too overtuned on arena, 30g cavaliers steal the role that polish winged hussar must have and are too cost effective in a large number of situations. They need a nerf here.
I guess you are blind or what? Britons are currently too OP on TGs because of that extra Range they get, It makes your archers completely useless, so mangonels and Scorpions, they even keep that Supremacy in Imperial to the point they won’t bother going for the UU. They are too OP that even other archer civs haven’t place to even compete (only Mayans can, which are overpowered tho), is frustrating that only both civs are abused while other archer civs aren’t picked.
It’s rare though.
By giving them the building armor class, it’s actually a massive nerf. They will take 5 less damage from the mangonel line, but take massive damage from anything explosive, rams, and a lot of other units. If this change was implemented, I don’t think they will need a minimum range to balance them.
I know, I don’t like the idea of removing it, I’m just trying to find a way that you can balance them, because it isn’t easy.
I’ve limited the production to 20, but I think it could be Ok if it is also limited to castles. I don’t think Cumans should get bracer, because it is kind of their identity, being the cav archer civ without it.
Goths should not get the final armor. Basically one of the few units that works against them is fully upgraded champions, because Goths are all about quantity over quality.
It’s not really that, it’s kind of about fixing the weird thing with Pavisse affecting Condos when they can’t even be trained. Of course, it would also affect the other stuff.
It’s really hard to stop once it gets going though, but I’m fine with the elite train time being reduced.
It makes a lot more sense as an Incan UT that reduces Eagle gold cost than as a Mayan tech that gives Eagles +40 HP.
That sounds like an interesting idea.
Well, that kind of relies on definitely removing the Goth bonus first. I also quite like no rotting food, but I don’t hate hunters carrying more.
I do care, it’s more that my UT suggestions are just ideas, and I’m perfectly fine with them being shot down and replacements suggested.
I am not trying to argue that people should have the same preferences as me, merely that in a mode where ~80% of strats are not viable because of walls (Feudal archers, Drush, Castle Age Knights all in etc.), it’s obvious that there will be 1-2 dominant civs. Bohemians are not at fault for being too strong on Arena, the mode Arena is broken. Bohemians are very average on open maps or hybrid maps.
so because of 1 map, we should nerf Bohemians? Houfnice is not that broken on hybrid maps, or open maps.
What next? We nerf Chemistry from Turks because Fast Imp BBC on Arena is also too strong? Like I said the mode is at fault, Bohemians have a very bad tech tree and can basically only ever make 3 units, Arbalest, Halberdier and Hussite Wagon, every other unit they have is very bad, even their Monks are average when compared to Portuguese with their cheaper Monks or say Lithuanians with their faster Monasteries which are far more useful bonuses than Wood discount.
Halbs are meant to counter cav, if you are unhappy that some civs have broken, unbeatable late game army comps, pls post your balancing suggestions to nerf Camel Archer, Mangudai, Turks Hussar BBC Sipahi Cav Archers comp because those are also very strong and arguably stronger than what Bohemians can do.
Britons are an archer 1 trick civ. They are even less versatile than Mayans who can also do Eagle Warriors. Yes Britons can do Knights but without Bloodlines it never feels nice doing them. It makes sense their archers are not some generic FU archer, at that point why play Britons and not Italians, civs that are incentivized into spamming UU, on top of not working well generally (Mongols, Spanish, Portuguese, Koreans)… that’s just bad design, you should have at least one Barracks/Archery Range/Stable unit that is playable and nice to have in Castle Age.
you start with 9 tiles of Stone always…?
it is a very broken suggestion that goes against the nature of the game of having scarse resources to create scarce units.
no it was removed because Burmese couldn’t handle archers AND they demolished bases with Arambai blob, it was for both reasons, just in the patch notes they didn’t give the 2nd reason but it was common of people complaining about Arambai leveling buildings. Anyway, you can always do Scorpions + Mangonels as Burmese, it’s not ideal but Knights + Scorps + Mangonels can get you through Castle age, or build a Castle asap next to your eco, it’s not like it’s a free loss as Burmese, they still have a very nice Feudal age and a rly strong eco in the form of free Lumber camp upgrades.
if you can’t play them, you don’t get the vills advantage. You make it sound like you are auto-dead when in reality if you can’t capitalize on the Chinese bonus, you are still playing something like Byzantines, no eco bonus but strong tech tree. I am against making the game more noob friendly, you might as well “auto everything” like MbL says, and besides Chinese start is REALLy not that hard, if you can do 21 pop MAA you can do Chinese start probably, you might have to force drop once or twice.
but Goths don’t need to be stronger, their deal is insane late game in return for weak early game. I don’t get why they should have an eco bonus also.
Indians already get 2+3 Scouts in Castle Age.
I don’t think this is true, if he is spamming from 6 Stables, you need to have 6 Barracks also, it sounds a problem of you not having enough production buildings/not setting up eco properly. While Pikeman can struggle somewhat vs Knights, Halberdier murders Cavalier so I don’t see the issue here, even -60% gold Cavaliers don’t beat Pikeman.
the reasoning is that using gold or stone = bad? You are meant to win with spear skirm only? Outpost is a strong building, it makes sense you pay 5 stone. I don’t see the issue Stone is a resource like any other why would you think it’s more valuable or more deserving to be hoarded and preserved?
who cares about team games seriously. Britons are balanced in 1v1 that’s all that matters. In team games you pretty much pick civs to set up for the perfect comp, nerf Britons and Mayans or Italians is next on the list, you TG warlords will find something to cry about always because you don’t realize the problem is that TG are for fun and not a balanced mode.
If then team games balance isn’t relevant then why Khmer had to be nerfed more than two times? or why Indians were also nerfed despite being quite bad in 1v1? Are you Believing the Battle elephant unit was nerfed because of 1v1 or what?
1v1 is important, that’s true, but TGs are also important, otherwise this game was more than dead.
Worst thing is that nobody wants the most abused civs even nerfed, but rather buffing other beyond levels (check some posts asking for Vietnamese/Italians/Portuguese omega buffs and reworks) to match OP power levels of Britons/Franks/Mayans, which also can be applied to 1v1 as well.