AoE2 devs: Please stop trying to experiment and just listen to the community

Age of Empires II: DE II - Discussion
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I’m not even a campaign player but even I am disappointed.

I don’t understand, it’s like whatever is on the forum is antithesis to the devs because it wasn’t their idea.

Forum is split between people who want Europe and people who want non-Europe DLCs. But what is clear from this is that people want civ DLCs. You had a consistently good streak until Dynasties of India.

Then you tried to experiment. Like Return of Rome. Well, nobody asked for Return of Rome. Obviously a lot of people didn’t like it. Mountain Royals was obviously lower in quality: no new architecture, higher price, only 2 civs from the 3 of Dynasties of India.

I mean: Mediterranean: Armenians, Byzantines, Georgians, Italians, Portuguese, Romans, Sicilians, Spanish.
That’s 8 civs for 1 architecture set. Byzantines same architecture set as Spanish, really?

Here is a possible fix:
Eastern European: Bohemians, Bulgarians, Lithuanians, Magyars, Pole, Slavs(Ruthenians).
Mediterranean: Armenians, Byzantines, Georgians, Italians, Portuguese, Romans, Sicilians, Spanish.

  • Bohemians moved to Central European Architecture (HRE).
  • Bulgarians, Armenians, Byzantines, Georgians were under the Byzantine Empire at some point, so their buildings style were influenced by the Byzantines. NEW: Byzantine set.

This will lead to a more reasonable:
Central European: Bohemians, Goths, Huns, Teutons, Vikings.
Eastern European: Lithuanians, Magyars, Pole, Slavs(Ruthenians).
Mediterranean: Italians, Portuguese, Romans, Sicilians, Spanish.
Byzantine: Bulgarians, Armenians, Byzantines, Georgians.

And the most recent DLC: Victors and Vanquished.

I’m more of a custom scenario and real world maps fan than campaigns. Cobra Racing Stadium, Lord of the Rings Custom Map, Soldier Store, Alterlast, Roll the Dice, Sheep Soccer, Paintball, Castle Blood Automatic. (would be cool if these got some official custom maps btw)

But even I who wasn’t interested in a campaign-based DLC was dissapointed. I feel sorry for the guys who like campaigns and… didn’t get a campaign.

You kind of outright lied in the promo of this DLC. I have a feeling your intention was to give us a positive surprise? you expected a much different reaction, much like in Return of Rome? The community already tells you what it wants on the forum, what makes you think that giving it something that it didn’t mention it wants will have positive impact?

It’s like your kid tells you he wants an apple, you want to surprise your kid and give him a banana, and then you’re shocked that your kid doesn’t want the banana because he said he wants apples.

I mean, the forum is full with maps like these:
CivsMap

But I know, this is a representation on the forum when talking about what civs should be next:
barroom_blitz_6038

So maybe to avoid all that fire, the devs decided to go in a new direction. To avoid exactly what happened, dissapointing the fans.

But why not make it a non-reginal DLC to please everyone? Some people will be upset if you make the next DLC in Europe, some people will be upset if you make the new DLC outside of Europe. How about doing something like this:

  • Zapotecs
  • Romanians
  • Nubians
  • Slavs rework

And instead of having geography in common, they could have something else in common, in this case being the underdog, fighting a bigger empire. (Zapotecs → Aztects; Romanians → Turks; Nubians → Caliphate).

I’m no economist, but I think both European & non-European fans will like them.

Most people will not like the whole package, but most people will like part of the package.

It’s true that people really like the regional DLCs, but that’s because everyone imagines their favorite region when thinking about a regional DLC.

I’m no expert, but I guess sales will tell you what the community likes better than what I ever could.

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Besides Tibetans, the Jurchens too. Agree with your other points.

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While I’d love those in the game, I think that can never happen for 1 reason - Chinese market.
To say that the Tibetans and Jurchens were not Chinese is very offensive to China, the game may be even banned in China. It’s not fair, but I completely understand why the devs would want to avoid this.

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Don’t have to say they are different from China, just add them as civs and make a grand Chinese campaign on the Tang to fete the Chinese audience. New Chinese and Central Asian/Tibetan building set will be needed.

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It’s possible that would work. Although that’s still playing with fire. I think it’s more of a lawyer’s job to see what they can and can’t do with China if they still want to be part of the Chinese market.

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Stop trying to push your own agenda of getting my people ingame in every topic possible.DLC is not even out yet to see how good or bad it is.

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Cool story bro

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You’re one of the people who likes it. Congratulations customer No #3.

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This will be the final judgment.

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that’s just not true. a significant portion of the forums (myself included) is sick of new civs. Additionally many pro players/casters have also voiced opinions that we now have too many civs

I’d be very happy with an actual campaign DLC with fair pricing. (something like 15 eur for 5 new campaigns, hell even 15 eur for just 3 new campaigns would be ok, imo) But selling mostly recycled content and only 5 actually new missions as a full “campaign” DLC is a rip-off

So please don’t misrepresent these criticisms. The majority of complaints I’ve seen aren’t “we want more new civs instead of this”, they are saying “this isn’t a campaign DLC” or “this doesn’t contain enough for the price”. What you are doing is dishonest

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Because Forgotten Empires works in a authoritarian way. Only Cysion’s opinion matter. He wanted Sicilians and Burgundians, no one else. He dislikes non-regional DLC-s (like you proposed or The Conquerors) so every DLC will be regional. I think he is the one who doesn’t want Persians to change to Central Asian set.

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Can we ask him? Good to hear it from him.

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I’m not too angry with this DLC, just slightly upset, since I had different expectations - Real Campaigns and unique units - But as a singleplayer gamer, i’m ok with.

What irritates me is the price, especially for content that was already available in the workshop, for FREE.

In any case, I’m happy that the creator of this content has his material officially included in the game.

I will buy it, just to support the game, but with almost nothing new being added, the price is high.
Today price:

AOE2DE = R$ 18.49
V&V= R$ 27.19

In other words, it is a good addition to the game, with some good scenarios, but the price is not in line with what is delivered.

Some people are complaining about false advertising because it was announced that the DLC would focus on campaigns, and, after all, they are scenarios or historical battles. This shouldn’t be the focus of such angryness, I believe it was just another marketing error, using the term campaigns when the correct option would be to use the term singleplayer content.

Finally, in other posts I noticed some people comparing what is being done with this Scenarios with what was done with the Forgotten Empires MOD.

I don’t think there should be comparisons, since back in 2013 when AOE2HD was released with Forgotten expansion, this was a rebirth for the series, with the game being released in HD, and revived in stores, since in my country it didn’t exist on physical or digital media anymore, leaving only alternative ways to play Age of Empires, so this DLC doesn’t even compare to 2013’s Forgotten Empires.

In any case, there is always the possibility that the DLC dont be purchased by those who are not happy with it.

I just reinforce that AOE is a niche game, and just like other RTS are no longer living their best moment, so, IF you can, IF you have some money to spend, buy the DLC to help the game stay alive.

So, lets just relax a little bit and hope next DLC bring what everyone desires.

Sorry for my english.

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They shall carry on like this… I think, a significant part of the players will not further feeding this shop with money.

Microsoft and Forgotten Empires shows ZERO RESPECT for the community and they ignore most asked wishes since over 4 years. That is really very anti customer like.

As long as the architecture sets for much civs are not improved, I will not buy any more content… But I am not sad about it, because I have played through almost all of the campaigns so far. If the developers do not want to give me a further way for this game, then simply not, but they do not get any more money…

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Trying to appease everyone is a very difficult task. (I’ve pretty much given up on this aspect in general.) Especially in a group/company. (I can only imagine…) I feel like they are trying their best but, they can only do so much unfortunately. Not to mention, they have to listen to MS. (assuming. Unless, they have freedom/creative control which I doubt.) I get it. I want more modding support but, in the end, time/manpower is the issue most likely. (or greedy investors… or even just money.) Anyway, just have some faith in them. I am sure they are doing their best they can. (My opinion on this has never changed and probably never will.)

edit: I don’t want to sound mean but honestly, If the community wants this content SO BAD, why not make it yourself? The game is modifiable. If you can’t/don’t want to, then, you have little right to complain yourself. (It takes time/effort.)

edit: This is partially why I don’t want to mod anymore. Making something and it gets purely focused on the negative. No focus on the positive. Its very degrading.

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How significant is significant? Do you have a poll?

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each time there is a poll with the “none” option it gets at least 10% of the vote

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So that’s 90% who either wants more civs or doesn’t care

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at least 10%, I’ve seen anywhere from 10% to 30% .
it still dishonest to claim “everyone wants more” when even just 5% don’t.

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How do you know that? not sarcastic, genuinely asking.

I should have said “most”, but the meaning of the original text still stands, the vast majority of players want new civs. I didn’t mean everyone as literally everyone but as an overwhelming majority.

Yes, the pros hate it, because they have to memorize even more civs. I guess MS needs to think who is their main buyer base. The way I see it, the vast majority of players don’t play ranked. Over 50% of those who do are below 1000 elo (low elo legends) and an average 3% of players finish campaigns. So taking a wild guess I would say the average player plays casual scenario maps.

I do not know any of the inside rumos and such, but I also believe it’s in MS’s best interest to sell their product. So I reasoned they avoided new civs to avoid the dumpster fire that comes after they make a regional DLC and inevitably a large group on the forum doesn’t like the region. But when it comes to non-regional DLCs like The Conqerors and Forgotten, I have hardly seen anyone complain about them.

I wouldn’t say trying to please everyone is a difficult task, just study them, see what they like. The fanbase of AoE2 makes no secret what they like.

What I fear is that modern AoE2 seems to want to get more and more lootboxy. DLCs with 2-3 civs are cool. But now we get icons DLCs and campaign-only DLCs. The tendency seems to be to want to split the DLCs smaller and smaller. Maybe that’s just me, but it feels we’re going in the direction of architecture ### ##############

Yeah, it was kind of cheap. Take a mod and add it in the game but with a price tag on it.

May sound cyncial, but I don’t think it’s our duty to help the game stay alive if we get bad deals. The price was a bit unreasonable IMO so why should I support that? Of course I would like AoE2 to prosper, but there’s a fine line between helping the game and being ripped off.

I’m not a campaign player so I should be indifferent about it. But damn, not only was the promised content not given, we have Lords of the West, Dawn of the Dukes and Dynasties of India with more content and better price.

Hardcore fans will buy it anyway, but it’s the casual market they need to appease. If you like the game strong enough to be on the forum I guess you can be counted as a hardcore fan, but the majority of AoE2 players are just casual players.

Even minor things most player wouldn’t notice, like adding new Scenario & Real World maps gradually dissapeared:
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Looks a bit like budget cuts, but that can also be translated into quality cuts.

They could have easily added something like Europe, Afro-Eurasia; Real world maps in different sizes including Huge and Gigantic and Ludicrous sizes. Or a

Or a Tenochtitlan real world map/scenario map since that design was purely amazing.
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Just naming a few minor things that they used to add up until Dynasties of India. The last DLC everyone universally agreed was good. We used to get more than what we expected. What happened?

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I’m ever so curious about what the censored words were. I’m guessing they were completely innocuous and that the filter is ###

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