Given that Prussia challenged the Austrian Habsburgs, who ruled the HRE (the Germans in the game), I don’t think having them as a rev option is unreasonable at all.
If we really want to make a comparison, if British India were a rev for the British, it’d be more like Canada, both British dominions.
Actually I think one of the problems with Indians is ethnic groups represented by only a single unit, as I said before. I think Urumis, Jat Lancers, Sepoys and Gurkhas all suffer from this, which is exacerbated by them all speaking Hindi.
France challenged the Habsburgs more than Prussia ever did. And it was France that caused the end of the HRE. So it shouldn’t be unreasonable to make France a revolution of Germany too right?
Prussia split from HRE, not France.
BTW, Austria also split from HRE and was one of the largest and most powerful members of German Confederation, so it’s reasonable to make Austria as a revolution option to Germans.
The Germans/HRE are already Austria to some extent. Making Austria indeed a rev would definitely make the Austrian elements in the civ much clearer and allow for more of them to be introduced. Perhaps the roster can even be changed to:
Germans ─┬─> Gran Colombia
├─> Prussia ──┐
├─────────┼─> German Confederation
├─> Austria ──┤
└─────────┴─> Hungary
You’ve got that backwards. France actually did split from the HRE (Burgundy and Savoy). Prussia was not originally in the HRE, and when it did gain territories within, those territories kept their position within the empire until the French forced it’s dissolution.
They did not. Technically they ended it, but they did not break away from it.
Neither Prussia nor Austria are revolutionary states in any way shape or form. They were antithetical to the very concept of revolution.
I can sympathize with wanting a Germany that branches into more varied forms, but doing that via revolution is absolute nonsense.
Meiji is an alternate age up that isn’t a revolution. Why couldn’t they do something like that for Prussia and Austria instead? The deck swap is entirely unnecessary as it’s just the German Confederation minus a few cards so it adds nothing. They could have used this approach for Warsaw too because that also has nothing to do with a revolution.
A rev reflecting that Prussia broke free from the HRE’s control is already much more fitting than a lot of the existing rev options. There were never any formal colonies of German states and Italian states in the Americas, let alone any rebellions coming from them.
That’s a valid approach either. It’s just that, given the historical context, it’s already pretty hard to find suitable options for German revs in the first place. So, in my view, having Prussia and Austria as options isn’t really a problem.
Prusia por mucho tiempo no fue más que un pequeño estado a las ordenes del sacro imperio, no seria hasta la union con Brandemburgo en que se convertiria en el reino de prusia por alla en 1700 con Federico I
Tengo una idea de como podria jugarse alemania… pero seria demasiado “complicado” en busqueda de un mejor termino.
En edad I simplemente podria llamarse “Alemania” y tengas opción de avanzar a la edad II escogiendo ser: El sacro imperio, los prusianos o los Austriacos. A si sucesivamente y que en la creación de barajas haya cartas que solo funcionen con un avance de edad especifico. Por ejemplo Acero de Solingen solo funcionaria con el sacro imperio y en el caso de las reformas de Scharnhorst solo funcionaria con los Prusianos, pero con un efecto distinto al actual.
Al escoger el Sacro imperio Desbloqueas a los “Doppelsoldners” en edad II. (Avanzas con una carreta de iglesia)
Al escoger a los Prusianos Desbloqueas a los “Freikorps” en edad II (A su vez desbloquea a los Landwerhs) (Avanzas con una Carreta Militar)
Al escoger a los Austriacos Desbloqueas a los “Grenzers” en edad II (También desbloquea a los Landwerhs) (Avanzas con una carreta de frontera que permite construir puestos comerciales o destacamentos)
algo asi, me imagino a unos alemanes que puedan especializarse más si quieres ir con prusia, austria o el sacro imperio, sin necesidad de partirla.
La civ no es “Alemania”, la civ es alemanes, así, con minúscula.
This never happened. Firstly, Prussia never broke away from the HRE, and secondly, the HRE never really had control of anything in the first place.
Sure, but that is not the only thing revolutions represent. Minorities breaking free of imperial rule are also a good chunk of the revolutions (Hungary, Romania, Cossacks, etc). Also there actually were rebellions conducted by Italian revolutionaries in the Americas.
It really isn’t. For Prussia I’d say Livonia, Czechia, Argentina, and German Confederation are all good options. For Austria there’s Colombia, Hungary, Romania, Serbia, Ukraine, Belgium, Czechia, and German Confederation. Ten potential options is more than enough for one civ.
Prussia went from being diplomatically aligned with Austria, to becoming political rivals, and eventually fighting and defeating Austria. Generally, looking at the long-term historical development, Prussia was indeed gradually moving away from the German political order centered around Austria, the heart of HRE.
Of course, because of Napoleon, the dissolution of the HRE happened actually before the Austro-Prussian War. However, the dissolution of the HRE meant that both Prussia and Austria gained genuine sovereign independence from the HRE, both in name and in practice. So it would still make sense for a civ representing the HRE to have options that can specifically develop into either of them. Imagine a small German-speaking territory within the HRE deciding to come under Prussian rule. That would also be pretty reasonable.
And obviously, the devs designed it this way intentionally. Not like they’re simply unaware of the history.
In my view, given the political rivalries and struggles within the German-speaking world, Prussia (and Austria in potential) are clearly a better fit than Colombia and Argentina as rev options. Colombia at least has some basis in a German noble family’s (failed) attempt to establish a colony in Venezuela. Argentina, by comparison, was basically just a destination for a bunch of German-speaking immigrants afaik.
Please tell me when Germans in Argentina ever rebelled against a German-speaking state, whether politically or militarily.
At most, it could serve as a reference only for revolting to Brazil, and even that isn’t rigorous at all. It wasn’t originally a territory under Italian control, nor were they rebelling against Italy. They were actually fighting against Brazil, rather than fighting to join or ally with Brazil. It’d make way more sense as a rev for Brazilians if they would become a new civ.
It’s just a little better than revolting to the US. Italians were simply large-scale immigrants to the US, much like Germans immigrating to Argentina.
Yeah but from prussia into german confederation of the march revolt is absolute nonsense.
Oh hell no to Furrer in the timeline unless you want a massive debuff to your agricultural and church based options in imperial age, there are far more valid options, especially early options. There’s also always the option to just make it the Tagsatzung.
Helvetic Revolution makes sense though.
Could be an interesting roster and a cattle based economy. You could go with early aggression, like age 2 halbs and handgonne (cannonier) / crossbow which then become Landwehr (yes same as the prussian ones, could be a royal guard upgrade aswell or be replaced with a zouave “infantry” only tag 1 pop version called Füsilier). You’d only get dragoons because cavalry was far too expensive for swiss armies. Musks are only available via “Pension-system” or after sending the Ordonnanz card.
A “pension” system, in which you sacrifice pop space for lending out mercs, which grants you a ressource trickle or a trickle of experienced former Mercs returning from their service. You’d not have a tavern but rather a “Patricians house” with a build limit of up to 3. Each of those grants 10 housing for pops. You can then make a Contract with either France, Pope, Spain, Sicilly, Savoy etc. 1 Per Patricians house. You could add in a card that allows for two contracts but slowing down the trickle / training time by 33%. Also it only trains bandits and swiss pikemen. Yes you don’t have access to other mercs regardless of map.
Depending upon option you get either a trickle of wood, coin, food, or Swiss Guards/ Swiss infantry. Guards a RG Soldado in stats that get’s slowly trained like a dojo. Swiss infantry is a RG for US Regulars as a baseline. Guards you only get from the Patrician houses, Swiss infantry could be an Age 3 unlock after sending said ordonnanz card. You don’t get Hussars or grenadiers.
In age 4 you get 1 Factory to show the at first slow industrialisation, however it is like the Prussian rifle factory with special upgrades, this time making ranged infantry cheaper / train faster even guards and unlock a factory cart in Age 5 aswell as the option to train culverins 2 instead of one heavy cannon.
Cattle based economy, basically you start like italy with 3 settlers, 200 food, 100 wood, 2 cows unfattened, and a cart to build the cattle building, with cards that make cattle train automattically per building for the cattle, auto gathering.
I wouldn’t say I’m particularly familiar with German history. But from what I’ve looked up, since the German people and the revolutionaries were fighting against the various German states under the tricolor flag, it doesn’t seem unreasonable that the March Revolution pushes the Germans, Prussia, and potentially Austria toward becoming a nation under the tricolor flag in the game, even though technically they were already part of the Confederation during the March Revolution.
Yes, but if you want to do a march revolution revolt. Then make a March revolution revolt, this is just the Prussian deck with some new cards added. One of the cards is even themed around anti-revolutionary decrees and predate that March revolution by 30 years.
Furthermore its presented as natural progression, instead of an revolt. If youre playing the Prussian revolt at some point you’ll always want to click that button to improve your eco and military. It’s not an alternate option anymore like a regular revolt. Its more like the Napoleonic French with their improved deck over the French revolution, but that’s an improved stage by card not an actual revolt just using the mechanic.
The March revolution couldve been a great alternative with a greater focus on villagers, revolutionaries and those wagons. Prussia couldve been the military option with weaker eco but acces to Imperial troops lmore like the now removed Colombians.
Carlsbad Decees shouldve been in the prussian deck instead of the Confederate deck and prevent further revolting, forcing an actual choice. The confederate deck also should be unique like an actual revolt and have a different focus as opposed to the Prussian deck.
This. Also Prussia and Austria both massivly surpressed the Marchrevolution. Infact Imperial Prussia should just become imperial germany with a card like Napoleonic France, whilest the german confederation should’ve been an alternative option entirely. Maybee share some cards but not all, but then again that is the issue with the current german civ beeing just badly designed.
It makes therefore no sense to become Prussia and then suddendly become the german confederation. That’s like if spain could revolt to the basque country and then revolt into the second republic.
So it looks like the problem is with the card names, as well as the name of the rev option itself. If we rename the rev itself to German Empire and change the cards, things might work a lot better.
well that and take away March revolutionaries, Baricade wagons, etc.
