China is messing up ELO

My win rate versus China is zero or close to zero, I don’t think I have won more than maybe 1 or two games in the last six months versus China. Since so many players at the lower levels use China, (it seems to be the most common civ pick presumably because they are so easy to win with) and my win rate is zero versus them, it causes my ELO to be lower than it should be, in other words the non-china players I match with I often have too easy of a time winning versus. I play a variety of civs, usually those considered to be in the lower ends of the tier list (ethiopia, malta, Lakota, Haud, Inca, Aztec, dutch, French are the most common). It seems like China always has way too many troops, the last game I played versus them I kancha boomed and had 2 tcs and he still gathered more resources and utterly destroyed me, while he was on 1 tc and not even doing much TBH. It just seems insanely OP and ridiculous to me. Artillery is useless against them due to cheap hand mortars and they always have good anti-cav around nowdays. China used to be vulnerable to cav but not so much anymore it seems. While I definitely don’t want to play against China at all and it is the opposite of enjoyment to me, I don’t like the way it is messing up my ELO.


Maybe you need to improve yourself? Currently Sweden Hakka is the real one messing up. Portuguese is also very strong in 1v1 and especially in team game with Brazil revolt. British is strong as always. The reason why there are a lot of China players because there are a lot of players from China and they love to play their own civ, nothing wrong with that. China banner army system is difficult to manage it is definitely not the easy to play civ at lower level, can’t just boom and spam musketeers like some euro civs. It is actually one of the most difficult civ to play well, very micro intensive.


Go play the OP civs yourself to realize its weakness and stop whining. :joy:

BTW I might play Egypt or Aztec (if there will be) when AoM retold released just because I think their gods and myths are cool.

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Says the guy whining about whining on a discussion board whose only purpose is to ‘whine’.

That is truly incredible and rare that someone would consider playing a civ just because it is cool and has cool units. I suppose the rest of comments will just be ‘git good noob’ without any recommendations on how. The point is, obviously, that either there is some strategy that everyone else knows that I don’t, or China is simply OP at lower levels, those are the only two possibilities. And since it is the most common civ to see in ranked, I am guessing it isn’t just me. In fact I just went to two twitch channels and both are China mirrors. Geez…

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China is not op. End the topic here.


I agree, China is too strong ATM. (several pro players agree with my opinion, like Kynesie or Revnak to name a few)
I think China’s main problem is that it has too high a capacity to spam units, and since the last updates, it only received buffs for its economy, which allows it to spam more units. I think we need to revert some past changes, maybe increase the village cost back to 190w or 200w.
Another nerf would be to do something with the Russian blockhouse, it is impossible or very difficult to rush a Chinese when he uses the Tea Export shipment and does a TP + Blockhouse. If the Chinese can’t be rushed, he can easily go up to 3 and even Industrial, turning into a real snowball.


I have no opinion about the wood cost of village if the dev team can bring the old New army card and Old Han reform card back. 400 food cost for the New army card is ridiculous and it indeed force me to change the my build order dramatically. But I never complaint or whine. :slightly_smiling_face:

Because as a normal player, I understand game balance is a very rigorous subject that requires long-term observation and repeatedly tests. I would rather believe that the balance team know what they are doing since it’s them receiving the firsthand collected data. To be honest I feel China being constantly nerfed in later patches, after they lowered the wood cost of village. Please ckeck the patches notes yourself.

It is really not surprising China is one of the most popular factions because there are lots of players speaking Chinese. I main this faction simply for this reason too. So you are saying we are all low skill and are messing up elo? For what? Huh? Geeeeez :angry:

Again, if you really just want to win and think some civs OP, go ahead and play them. Nobody stops you. There are also many people sharing powerful age 3 all-in strategies of other civs in other non-English forums. The world is larger than you imagine. :neutral_face:

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British is op for years. Oh but nobody mentions them. They have the best eco and strong army and very easy to play. The westerner players can’t bear with Asian civs being decent. Crying for Japan nerf forever now yes Japan got nerfed. Next then you guys start to cry about China.

I guess if one day China gets nerfed you guys will cry “oh india is op please nerf”

Before Asian civs European gamers cried about African civs op, inca is op, Lakota is op…etc. yes they all received nerfs. now let’s nerf all non European civs. Let’s just play European civs in aoe3. Forever. They are vanilla, they are the superior European. Nice. They buffed Germans Ottoman Sweden Spain Port and even British got the longbow siege and rocket buff. European gamers still want Malta and Italy buffs…so the whole idea of the aoe3 forum is to buff European civs and nerf non European to the ground


If I made a top 3 civilizations that people complain about the most, it would be the following
1- Japan
2- British
3- Lakota

He complains a lot about Brits, but that’s not the topic of the post, the topic of the post is about China as a civilization, so I strongly recommend that you keep the discussion on that.

If you want to talk about the British, I leave this thread.

I heard a good proposal to balance more China, and it is to reduce what is received from the Summer Palace by 100 food, to delay the FF a bit.


Make zero sense. European civs get 500 f for age up, or 400 wood, or 200 coin plus tower. Better value than China 400 food already. You just want nerf for the sake of nerf no regards to balancing. Why not just don’t give any food to China and give 1k food to European age up?

And ottoman or Spain FF is already faster than China

It is slightly slower yes, but much more powerful. The shipments in fortress age from China are much strongers than the shipments from Spain and the Ottomans, in addition, when you go up in age you have enough buildings and economy to quickly support the emergence of a decent army and maintain a constant push, something that Spain, Ottomans and other civs that do ff it is impossible for them to do.
The idea of the nerf, also, is to encourage other kinds of strategies, the main China know that the naked ff is so good that no other strategy or variant of the ff is worth doing.

By the way, with all due respect, if you keep posting these kinds of messages I’ll just stop arguing with you.


I’m very happy if you stop arguing. I don’t enjoy arguing with you either. But what I posted is fact. European civs gets better age up value than China 400 food age up. You just can’t argue anymore.

China just has some easy match ups where it will win especially on some maps, other balanced match ups and few bad match ups among these bad match ups are lakota (most likely even if it’s not game over yet) Aztec, Japan (near par but Japan has the advantage), yes Sweden (you have a small window to win if you don’t take advantage of it you will be overwhelmed and you will lose), even Ottoman if played well, the rest are feasible match ups (I don’t know against African civilizations).

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Weaknesses of China, difficult mass skirm, little flexibility in builds, if you make a mistake in placing buildings in base and you receive a rush and 1 or 2 villages are destroyed, the situation is critical especially if you will lose 2. Obvious rush not intended all in you have to think to waste China’s time making it put the settlers inside the TC and forcing it to send minutemen and if possible force an expedition in 2 ages, destroy his TP and if you can more villages possible then you too go in 3 in a reasonable time and then improvise.

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Well, the Haudenosaunee only get 100 f, 100 w and 100g per age up (they also get the travois, but if we talk about buildings, China gets a military unit factory)

Lately, I feel like this Match Up has been completely reversed, with the latest nerfs, Lakotas have no hope of beating China. The club + cetan rush is useless against the blockhouse, the semi ff and raid are not very useful either because China is far superior in eco (they need to send 5 or at least 4 vills) and without tashunkes in fortress age, the Lakotas cannot they have a lot of advantage atm vs china.

I was thinking about it but I wasn’t sure yet, on tad it was too difficult for China to win this match up, it forced you to stay in 2 and they went with cetan and axe raider and some clubs, China with chu ko nu and pike with some steppe knight it could not match the quality of the lakota.

Exactly that’s what I said the game balance already favours Europeans. Non European civs are treated differently

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Military factory? Lol. You talking about wonder, a shared feature for all Asian civs, and China is the one with no other eco bonuses. Japan still has shrines, india has vills from shipment, all European civs have their own unique bonus, China has nothing, just a 20 wood cheaper house and start with a sheep…that’s it.


On the higher level china is considered to be very strong and I do agree, and I basically play nothing but china.

The combination of the meta shifting to more boomy and later play, the larger selection groups and changes that allow china to more effortlessly survive that age 2 timing window (the blockhouse) has made china just much more consistent then before.

The thing I would change first is to slow down that defensive production capabilities, there has been ideas floating around about increasing the cost of the blockhouse and the war academy.

Changing the cost of the village would remove a lot of china’s early build option, which I am pretty sure would just result in nothing but russian consulate starts

The other which I still think is a mistake on some level, is the increased selection cap to 95. That has just made the deathball something that can effortlessly microed and given how fast china can mass up a real problem.