DLC Proposal: "Defenders of the Danube" (2 civs + 1 architecture + 3 campaigns)

But even a DLC setting up the Vikings, Celts and Goths could be done.

For Vikings, It would be nice to recover the ‘Jarl’ and make him the unique unit from the castle, and make the Berseker instead a unique upgrade like the Legionnaires.

For the Celts, in addition to renaming them to Gaels, one could move the ‘Woad Raider’ into the Barrack by making them a sort of ‘Shrivamsha Rider’ but one from the feudal age. And as a castle unit the Gallowglass, who was an elite mercenary.

For the Goths it would mainly be a matter of removing all the gunpowder that makes no sense, and fixing the name ‘Huscarl’, which is Norsemen, not Goth. In the sense that a more appropriate name can be found.

Without me repeating the whole discussion, add the Galeazza as the UU of the Italians as in AoE3.

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You mean saxon…

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The heavy metal band? I like them, they were also in Milan (Italy) not so long ago.

I actually meant to write ‘Norsemen’, but I must have had a brain lapse.

I think the Vikings, Celts and Goths are already long time classics of AoE2. Changing their gameplay style after 20 years is like changing the fundamental core of the game.

I don’t think changing Vikings, Celts and Goths would be met the same way changing the Slavs, Burgundians or Sicilians would.

There are 10 base game civs missing a campaign as far as I can tell:

  • Maygars
  • Slavs
  • Turks
  • Persians
  • Koreans
  • Japanese
  • Chinese
  • Mayans
  • Vikings
  • Celts (are the tutorial campaign, but not sure that counts)

This DLC I propose could fix 2/10, namely the Magyars and the Turks. Since Romanians only need a Dracula rework you have one free campaign slot. It’s also possible for either Magyars or Turks to be replaced with a Slavic campaign, especially since it would be great if Slavs get renamed to Ruthenians since they no longer represent all slavs.

For the rest, the general formula is 2 new civ campaigns + 1 base game civ campaign. So unless there is a campaign pack, say Chinese + Korean + Japanese Campiang Pack. I don’t think we can cover all 10 new civs that quickly.

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Persians have the Ismail campaign since the Mountain Royals.

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You missed the Byzantines

FIGHT ME, BARI ENJOYERS

And the Romans too.
20 characters

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Byz have the Bari campaign for them.

There is no Bari campaign in Ba Sing Se.

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What is the problem with the Bari campaign?

It’s fictional. The developers replaced the El Dorado campaign with Pachacuti, so what’s the excuse for keeping Bari? It didn’t have to be a peak Byzantine campaign like Basil II, Belisarius or Heraclius. But at least it should have been a real one.

If anything, I would rather play unknown campaigns rather than the big ones everybody knows.

As far as Romanians & Serbians are concerned, Stefan Dušan & Vlad the Impaler are good picks because everyone outside Romania & Serbia hasn’t heard of them (Dracula’s campaign needs a rework like El Dorado). Although Stephen the Great is figure worthy of at least 1 reference in a Historical Battle.

But if there was no Bari and I had to make a Byzantine campaign, I would focus on a relatively unknown real character over the big ones. It’s more interesting to hear a new story rather than the same you have heard from 7 other places.

For example, John III Vatatzes of the Empire of Nikea who expanded into Asia and then retook Thrace from the Latin Empire. He almost restored Constantinopole from the Latin Empire in 1235. But his successor took it in 1261.

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Bari is here to stay and not going anywhere.

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Now that’s a real comment! Unlike, you know, the story in Bari.

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real or not, i’m not for cutting content. I’d be all for it if they were to make another Byz campaign that is more rooted in history, but i’d rather they not get rid of Bari.

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Im still waiting for a viking campaign and new civis to get added to the german building set to call europe a day.

Even if you don’t like Bari, other people may like it, I don’t think content should be removed under any circumstance. As you always have the option to just not play it if you don’t like it, where as the people who like it don’t have the option to play it if it’s removed.

I hope you don’t mind, I took Dracula’s rework suggestion and made a topic with it. I changed a few things which I think weren’t good. It’s probably best if we keep this as a separate discussion there.

This is a proposal of a much needed update for Dracula’s campaign when/if there is going to be a DLC in that region. I will focus on:

  • Addressing historical inaccuracies
  • Co-op campaign potential
  • A new final mission about Dracula’s death.

I took inspiration from @Player870583437 comment on the DLC proposal topic and added my own proposal from what I read about him. For historical inaccuracies, I did not went into nitpicky details only the major things that were immersion breaking from what I know about him. Nor do I know enough about him to make nitpicky details. And I don’t care if this sword was X or Y but the major people and events should be correct.

I made a summary at the end.


Mission 1, The Dragon Spreads His Wings

During mission 1, the name of lords/dukes in Wallachia and Moldavia was “Boyar” not “Voivod”. Voivod meant ruler of the country, only Dracula voivod. So the 3 random voivods from mission 1 should be boyars. And rather than being random, they should be actual people who helped Vlad the Impaler. Jakub, Mircea and Istvan are not real people who helped Vlad the Impaler, they are random names. Jakub and Istvan are not even proper Romanian names and Mircea is the name of his dead brother.

Mission 1 should use real people who actually helped Vlad III instead of generic nobleman names. They could be unique hero units like Vlad. They are real historical boyars who helped Vlad the Impaler take his throne:

  • Vintila Florescu
  • Giacu Balaceanu
  • Udriste Manea

For the co-op partner, it could be the boyar Neagoe Ștrehăianul. The strongest boyar who supported Vlad the Impaler, he was the Ban of Craiova, meaning he was in charge of Oltenia, this region, about 1/3rd of Wallachia:

Neagoe Ștrehăianul could start next to Dracula having an army too. If not co-op then he could be simply another unique unit the player has control of.

And for the sake of diversity, Vintila Florescu, Giacu Balaceanu and Udriste Manea could be something like special champion and arbalester with only Vlad the Impaler and Neagoe Ștrehăianul being unique skin paladins.


Mission 2, The Return of the Dragon

In mission 2 intro, the final part says the following:

Bogdan II, Dracula’s cousin and the new Voivod of Moldavia, had heard of his kinsman’s plight and offered his help. If Dracula could cross the Carpathian Mountains into Transylvania and ally with Hungary, then they could launch a three-pronged assault on Vladislav II and the Turks.

The problem was that Bogdan II was not Dracula’s cousin but Dracula’s uncle. Bogdan II’s son who will be important later was Dracula’s cousin. Why was he important? Because Bogdan II’s son was Prince Stephen who helped Dracula militarily in mission 2, became prince of Moldavia between missions 2 and 5, then would help Dracula militarily once again in mission 5. He’s a perfect co-op candidate for these 2 missions.

Military Wiki

Stephen III of Moldavia

Stephen III of Moldavia (also known as Stefan the Great, Romanian language: Ștefan cel Mare , pronounced [ʃteˈfan t͡ʃel ˈmare] or Ștefan cel Mare și Sfânt, “Stefan the Great and Holy”; 1433 – July 2, 1504) was Prince of Moldavia between 1457 and…

If the same voice actor isn’t available anymore, perhaps AI could be used to change: “Bogdan II, Dracula’s cousin and the new Voivod of Moldavia ” to “Bogdan II, Dracula’s uncle and the new Voivod of Moldavia ”. It is the only issue with this intro.

And when the mission starts and Dracula leaves Moldavia, instead of leaving alone, a certain Prince Stephen the heir of the throne of Moldavia should come with him and help him take back Wallachia. Prince Stephen is the co-op partner if the campaign is played in co-op.

Prince Stephen was not yet Stephen III of Moldavia at this point (he would be in mission 5), but he should have a unique skin just like Dracula because he was pretty important.


Mission 3, The Breath of the Dragon

Mission 3 has a really cool intro and describes everything Dracula is about:

The punishment for all offenses was death, for Dracula needed to make an example of criminals. Under his strong rule, trade was reopened and the economy blossomed. Proud of his achievement, Dracula placed a golden cup in the central square of Targoviste. The cup was never once touched throughout his reign."

I was shocked. The fear of the stake was surely enough to prevent crime, but to rule Wallachia while simultaneously evading the plots of the boyars was no small feat.

“Dracula invited all of the boyars to a feast, and asked them how many rulers they had seen perish due to treachery. None had seen fewer than seven reigns, while some had even seen thirty! Furious, Dracula arrested them all and marched them here, to the former ruin of Poenari Castle!”

“For months they labored to rebuild the castle, toiling even after their clothes fell off! Those who survived were slain. Finally, Dracula had eradicated the fickle, conniving Boyars. He replaced them with loyal followers, be they knights or common peasants.”

“Strong again, the Dragon was ready to breathe a flame that would engulf his enemies, the Turks.”

This intro is very good but there is another Dracula story that I believe belongs to be mentioned somewhere. Maybe here maybe in mission 4’s intro. The tale of the merchant and the thief.

Cynthia June Long – 28 Oct 16

A Tale of Dracula’s Justice

Or was it a test? A merchant was travelling in Wallachia and he stopped overnight in the capital, Tirgoviste. He was reluctant to leave his carriage and wares unattended in a foreign city overnight…

A merchant was travelling in Wallachia and he stopped overnight in the capital, Tirgoviste. He was reluctant to leave his carriage and wares unattended in a foreign city overnight, but the Prince of Wallachia, also known as Vlad III whom some call the Impaler and others call Dracula, Son of the Dragon, insisted that he share and trust his own princely hospitality. So the merchant, dreading greatly, left his carriage unattended in the street in front of the palace overnight. The next morning the merchant hurried to his carriage and found his inventory unmolested, but he had been robbed of 160 gold coins. He reported the theft to the Prince.

The princely Son of the Dragon assured the merchant to have no concerns, and vowed that the thief would be found and the gold returned. He ordered his soldiers to search the city, and he threatened to destroy the entire city if this affront to his honor was not remedied.

Overnight the thief was found and the pouch of gold was returned to the merchant’s carriage. The next morning the merchant counted it: once, twice, thrice. Each time he counted 161 coins in his bag. He returned to the palace. “Sire,” he told Dracula, “My money has been found, but there is one coin extra.”

Dracula chuckled, and ordered his guards to bring in the thief. “Go in peace,” he told the merchant, “And you may keep the extra coin for your honesty. For if you had not admitted to the extra coin, I was ready to impale you alongside this thief.”

Source: Russian source from MS 11/1088 in the Kirillov-Belozersky Monastery Collection at the Saltykov-Schredin Public Library in St. Petersburg; translated by Raymond T. McNally and published in McNally & Florescu In Search of Dracula: The History of Dracula and Vampires (1972, revised 1994). Adapted by Cynthia June Long.

The co-op partner could be Commander Galeș. He was a boyarn and one of Dracula’s best generals. During his famous night attack, Dracula attacked from the east while Galeș attacked from the west. He would also leave Galeș in command whenever he needed to split his forces.

But notice the “ș” at the end. Better to use google translate for the pronunciation.

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Mission 4, The Moon Rises

Similar to mission 3, Commander Galeș should be the co-op partner in mission 4.

At the end of mission 4, after Poenari Castle has fallen, Dracula retreated to Hungary as the Hungarians promised him reinforcements. But instead, the Hungarians betrayed and imprisoned Dracula. This is not mentioned in the campaign’s outro but I think it’s important context.


Mission 5, The Night Falls

Again, important context for mission 5’s intro. Years later, his cousin (Prince Stephen from mission 2), now Stephen III of Moldavia, convinced the King of Hungary to release Dracula and once again supported him militarily to take back his throne. Naturally, the co-op partner here should be Stephen III of Moldavia. Otherwise, if the game is not co-op, he’s just another hero the player can control. He had Hungarian troops in his army but he did not lead only a Hungarian army. And he did not conquer for Hungary but for himself.

Another Dracula’s story that is good to know here. Dracula passed the time in Hungarian prison by catching rats, cutting them into pieces, and impaling those on tiny chips of wood. This terrified the jailers.

Missions 5’s outro is wrong:

"Dracula achieved victory at last and the invaders fled before him. Rallying his men, he charged the enemy ranks with an unspeakable vengeance that emboldened his army. A decisive victory was near, but it was at that hour that Dracula’s luck ran out."

“A volley of arrows whistled through the air and struck Dracula in the chest, knocking him from his horse. The Turks easily routed our leaderless forces and our chance to drive them out vanished. The occupation resumed and the survivors despaired.”

The memory of a great man endures forever. As a token of gratitude, I invited our host to join us in a pilgrimage to the monastery at Snagov to pay our respects to Dracula’s grave. Tears running down his face, the elderly man could do naught but nod in reply."

This ending confuses 2 different events. Namely mission 5 (this one) and the new mission 6. Dracula actually succeeds to become ruler of Wallachia once again here. Then his cousin Stephen III gives him 200 of his best bodyguards and leaves for Moldavia. He did not die here.

Dracula ruled Wallachia 3 times. Mission 1 was when he got his 1st reign. Mission 2 is when he got his 2nd and most famous reign. And mission 5 is when he got his 3rd and final reign.


Mission 6, Midnight

An extra final mission about Dracula’s death.

I tried to keep the name thematic as the other missions are very poetically called: The Dragon Spreads His Wings, The Return of the Dragon, The Breath of the Dragon, The Moon Rises and The Night Falls. Midnight is a metaphor for the end of his life as the clock reaches 12 o’clock. His time is up.

After Dracula took his 3rd reign, the Ottomans attacked Serbia where the Hungarians lost three fortresses. Giving him 1 year and a half to prepare once again. But after they won in Serbia, the Ottomans invaded Wallachia once again, marching for Bucharest. The Ottomans crossed the Danube and advanced rapidly toward Bucharest. Dracula rushed to reach Bucharest before the Ottomans, he encounted a small Ottoman detachment, fought it, and won the battle. But after that victory he never reached Bucharest as he was stabbed in the back by a Turkish spies in his guard, secretly paid by the Ottomans. And this is how Dracula died.

This is what a slavic chronicle says about his final moments:

“His end was like this: He was living in Wallachia and the Turks came over his country and started looting (that small skirmish force, not the main Ottoman army). He attacked them and the Turks started to run away. Dracula’s army began to cut them mercilessly and chased them. And Dracula out of joy climbed a hill to see how they cut down the Turks. He thus broke away from the army of those close to him, the Turks disguised themselves as his warriors struck him with a spear. He, seeing that he was being killed by his own people, immediately killed five of his murderers with his sword. But they pierced him with many spears and thus he was killed”.

I’m not a good writer, but here is my attempt for the intro of the final mission, we stopped at the end of mission 4 when his cousin Stephen III gives him 200 of his best bodyguards and leaves for Moldavia.

Mission 6 intro (yes, Dracula founded Bucharest, it was in a good location for trade, close to the Danube especially due to the Dâmbovița river, but far from the border and in the Wallachian plain):

Dambovita river with red.

"Dacula took the throne of Wallachia once more, and with him, our hopes have returned. The Ottomans left him alone for now, fighting in Serbia against the Hungarians, giving Dracula time to prepare. Time he desperately needed. But one year later, after their victory in Serbia, the Ottomans once again invaded Wallachia.

They rushed for Bucharest, a small city founded by our lord in an important trade location. Our lord quickly assembled his army and marched for Bucharest to reach it before the Turks. While their army was slow due to its size, the Ottomans send a smaller force to capture it quickly.

  • The actual mission would be fighting the Ottoman advanced forces. The battle does not take place in Bucharest, but on the way to Bucharest, where they met on the battlefield and Dracula won.

Mission 6 outro:

Here is my proposal for the final outro of Vlad the Impaler’s campaign:

Dracula was once again victorious, but what his victory was short lived, for what armies could not achieve, a dagger in the would do. In the final moments of the battle, filled with joy, our lord climbed a hill by himself to see how we cut down the Turks.

It was at that moment that he stabbed in the back by a group of Ottoman assassin posing as a Wallachian guards, and so, the war, and our hopes, were lost once again. And this time, there would be no return of the Dragon, for the Dragon was slain.

The co-op partner could be the same loyal boyar from mission 1: Neagoe Ștrehăianul.


In summary:

Missions & co-op partner:

  1. The Dragon Spreads His Wings → Neagoe Ștrehăianul
  2. The Return of the Dragon → Stephen III of Moldavia (name changed to Prince Stephen)
  3. The Breath of the Dragon → Commander Galeș
  4. The Moon Rises → Commander Galeș
  5. The Night Falls → Stephen III of Moldavia
  6. Midnight → Neagoe Ștrehăianul

Mission 1: Use boyars Vintila Florescu, Giacu Balaceanu, Udriste Manea instead of random Jakub, Mircea and Istvan. With Neagoe Ștrehăianul as a unique skin paladin starting in Vlad’s camp.

Mission 2: Replace Dracula’s cousin with Dracula’s uncle in the intro. With Prince Stephen as a unique skin paladin and co-op partner or simply another playable hero if not co-op.

Mission 3: Add the Dracula story of the merchant and the thief. Either here on in mission 4’s intro. Commander Galeș should be the co-op partner, he should be a hero like La Hire but I don’t think he was important enough for an unique skin. Only Dracula, Stephen III and Neagoe Ștrehăianul should have unique skins in my opinion. But I’m not against it.

Mission 4: Mention in the outro that after Poenari Castle has fallen, Dracula retreated to Hungary as the Hungarians promised him reinforcements. But instead, the Hungarians betrayed and imprisoned Dracula. Is important context especially for mission 5.

Mission 5: Mention in the intro that Dracula passed the time in Hungarian prison by torturing rats, and that at his cousin’s insistence, Dracula was released from prison and they marched for Wallachia together to put Dracula once again on the throne. Mention in the outro that after he became ruler of Wallachia once again, Stephen gave him 200 of his best troops and left for Moldavia.

Mission 6: Mention in the intro that Dracula ruled once again but after 1 year the Ottomans have returned, they rushed for Bucharest, a small city that Dracula built due to its location perfect for trading. A small Ottoman force split from the main one trying to reach Bucharest as fast as possible and Dracula intercepted them. The mission itself would be fighting the small Ottoman force, maybe trying to catch them before they reach Bucharest. And mention in the outro that in the final moments of the battle, filled with joy, he climbed a hill by himself to see how the Wallachians cut down the Turks, there Ottoman assassin posing as a Wallachian guards killed him.

I think these are minor changes save for the extra mission, as the other 5 missions are relatively untouched, fixes all historical inaccuracies that I know of and adds one more co-op campaign. And yes, if Vlachs/Romanians are added in every mission you should play as the Vlachs/Romanians, both player 1 and the co-op partner.

I also like how you have support from Neagoe Ștrehăianul in missions 1 & 6, Stephen III of Moldavia in 2 & 5 and Commander Galeș in 3 & 4. It “rhymes”.

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I never said Bari should be removed, only that I don’t like it because it’s a fictional story. And if there is anyone who has enough epic stories to make without going fictional it’s the Byzantine Empire. But again, Bari should not be removed.

I don’t mind. In fact I like what you did with it. It’s a lot better to make a 6th mission about the actual death of Dracula rather than add a filler mission between 2 and 3.

What I like most about it is that it’s underwhelming. Dracula was invaded during his 3rd reign, he won a small skirmish battle against the Turks then he was assassinated by a Turkish spy posing as a Wallachian guard. Not the ending one would expect from Dracula, but that one makes it better. One would expect Dracula to go down in flames, instead he was assassinated after winning a small battle, at the beginning of the war no less. A bit of a Game of Thrones ending, but then again, his whole life was Game of Thrones.

I like that you kept the co-op suggestion and Stephen the Great as co-op partner for missions 2 and 5.

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If a Mehmed the conqueror campaign is to be added for Turks:

  1. Varna Crusade (1444)
  2. Against Vlad the Impaler (1462)
  3. Against Skanderbeg (1468)
  4. Against Stephen the Great of Moldavia (1476)
  5. Otranto Campaign (1480)

We would see the invasion of Wallachia from both perspectives.

Mehmed’s map could be huge since many of the campaigns mentioned here meant subduing a whole country. With Mehmed, you could make a campaign of 5 missions with either of these events. But the coolest thing would be to have a broad overview of his reign.

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Yes, I hope so… I think that in the long run the civs that don’t have them should have a second UU…

Yes, that would be the idea…

Isn’t there another narrator closer to the campaign period?..it’s strange to have like 3 centuries of difference between a narrator and the campaign…usually the narrator is contemporary with the campaign…

Yes, in theory only the Romans…since the other civs have at least one playable scenario (from VaV I already rule out that they will include campaigns for Japanese and Vikings)…the rest I see it probable in their respective regional DLCs…

Yes, I thought that for the DE they were going to change Bari for Belisarius…we need a campaign in the 6th century (527-565) and for the Mayans one of Pakal the Great in the 7th century (645-683)…

Yes, I like the idea… with Fetih it’s one less scenario that we save, so we can set the whole reign of Mehmed the Conqueror and part of that of his father Murad…

I’d rather have it the other way around, have the Jarl as the unique like the Legionnaires. Berseker is such an iconic unit from the Vikings that I think moving them from Castle would turn the civ 180*.

Yeah, we pretty much have: Romanians, Serbs, Croats, Bosniaks, Albanians and Venetians left in the region. So 6.
So basically 2 3-civs DLCs.

For the Bassarab & Bogdan campaign. I asked ChatGPT (so fact-check me on this if wrong), Alexander the Good, who ruled Moldavia from 1400 to 1432, was related to both Bogdan I and Bassarab. So perhaps he could be the narrator instead. The events of Bassarab & Bogdan take place in 1350s and Alexander the Good became ruler of Moldavia in 1400. I think both Bassarab and Bogdan would be his grandparents or something.

He also looks like Dumbledore: (cannot upload picture, here it is):

When you defend Moldavia at 9 AM and award 10 points to Gryffindor at 2 PM.

A Belisarius campaign would have been epic.

For Mehmed I’d love if the missions were as big as the country, and you’ll have to subdue the whole country.