Favor generation possibilities

[EricTheRed283]

Farming: When gathering from farms, you generate a small trickle of favor, and you can build up to 3 farms while in Age I.

Hunters: Gain favor from hunting animals, and you can build a hunters camp that slowly spawns huntable animals.

Trade: Caravans generate favor from successful trade, and you can build a market and make up to 5 caravans while in Age II.

Temples: Temples generate a small trickle of favor, and the trickle rate increases with each relic garrisoned inside.

Religion: Gain favor from training religious units and from converting enemies.

Conquest: Gain favor whenever you kill a unit, destroy a ship, or destroy a building.

Sacrifice: Gain favor whenever your human units die in battle and ships are lost in battle.

Warrior culture: Gain some favor from training human military units and ships.

Expansion: You gain some favor from the construction of buildings with the exception of walls.

Survival: You have a small trickle rate just for being alive, and the trickle rate increases the higher the age you are in.

Myths and legends: You gain some favor from training Heroes and Myth units and when those units kill enemies.

What do you think? Any other ideas?

[BaphometSLM]

I have a few ideas:

Offerings: Same mechanic as the lombards in AOE3 but the ressources you deposit generate favor instead.

Sacrifice: Either human units or livestock (if we’re allowed to train livestock in Retold).

God assimilation: By assimilating foreign gods (for a Roman civ).

Pok-a-tok: Assign units to the mayan ball game to gain favor.

[Woprok]

Few that are on terrible spectrum, but could work

Gathering: gathering resources generates favor

Wood Huggers: generates favor for each tree in influence/radius of buildings

Science: generates favor from each researched technology/upgrade, probably combined with some infinite research option

[Skadidesu]

I like this topic.
Thinking up good ways to generate favour is hard.
Even the original Norse already have 2 ways of generating favour because their Hersir passively generate favour.

@EricTheRed283

Farming: When gathering from farms, you generate a small trickle of favor, and you can build up to 3 farms while in Age I.

Egyptians can already build infinite farms in the first Age so that wouldn’t be that big of a thing.
That one is kinda boring though since it’s essentially just passive income.
Maybe a second kind of farm that produces less food but does produce favour?

@EricTheRed283

Hunters: Gain favor from hunting animals, and you can build a hunters camp that slowly spawns huntable animals.

Not a bad idea but it would effectively be another building that passively trickles favour.

@EricTheRed283

Trade: Caravans generate favor from successful trade, and you can build a market and make up to 5 caravans while in Age II.

Nü Wa can already build Markets in Classical Age so nothing completely new.
It could just be a Classical or even Archaic Age building for that civilisation.
Caravans don’t produce little gold in comparison to villagers so they are not really a good investment in early game so I don’t think it would be a balance issue.

@EricTheRed283

Temples: Temples generate a small trickle of favor, and the trickle rate increases with each relic garrisoned inside.

Kinda boring if it mainly comes down to Temples giving a passive trickle.
Relics should honestly generate favour for every civ.

@EricTheRed283

Conquest: Gain favor whenever you kill a unit, destroy a ship, or destroy a building.

Kinda too similar to Norse I think. If it’s just destroying buildings it would be to hard to get favour in the early game.

@EricTheRed283

Sacrifice: Gain favor whenever your human units die in battle and ships are lost in battle.

That is kinda strange. Getting resources for doing bad.

@EricTheRed283

Warrior culture: Gain some favor from training human military units and ships.

Sounds kinda boring.

@EricTheRed283

Expansion: You gain some favor from the construction of buildings with the exception of walls.

Also boring and hard to balance.
It’s like Atlanteans but worse.

@EricTheRed283

Survival: You have a small trickle rate just for being alive, and the trickle rate increases the higher the age you are in.

That is just completely passive, it can’t really get more boring.

@EricTheRed283

Myths and legends: You gain some favor from training Heroes and Myth units and when those units kill enemies.

Myth units cost Favour so they should not generate Favour.
Norse heroes already generate favour.

@EricTheRed283

What do you think? Any other ideas?

It’s hard to come up with good ideas. You have a lot of good ideas but most need some more details to be figured out.

@BaphometSLM

Offerings: Same mechanic as the lombards in AOE3 but the ressources you deposit generate favor instead.

This is like way cooler then the Chinese Gardens.

@BaphometSLM

Sacrifice: Either human units or livestock (if we’re allowed to train livestock in Retold).

Livestock is kinda boring because it would just mean being indirectly able to buy favour, but it could be expended to be interesting.

Human sacrifice is a cool idea because you have to make trade offs in the early game. Giving up a villager and therefor some economy to get some favour.
But in the late game it would come down to just buying favour again.

@BaphometSLM

Pok-a-tok: Assign units to the mayan ball game to gain favor.

Wouldn’t that be a reskin of the Greek method?
Or would it be other units then villagers?

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Gathering: gathering resources generates favor
[/quote]

Any resource?
Would be boring. Or you mean a specific one?

############### post:3, topic:256826"]
Wood Huggers: generates favor for each tree in influence/radius of buildings
[/quote]

Like the Rus in AoE4 with gold?
Sounds like it would work well. Nice synergy with Gaia alley.

Could be interesting for other resources like Mines or Animals too.
(Like Japanese in AoE3 for example)

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Science: generates favor from each researched technology/upgrade, probably combined with some infinite research option
[/quote]

Just when researching? That sounds pretty passive early on and then just converting resources in late game.
Will the infinite research do other things then just giving favour?

[EricTheRed283]

@Skadidesu

Egyptians can already build infinite farms in the first Age so that wouldn’t be that big of a thing.
That one is kinda boring though since it’s essentially just passive income.
Maybe a second kind of farm that produces less food but does produce favour?

Allow limited farming in Age I so you can get some favor generation but not be able transition heavily into farming during age up process. You could have a toggle button on farms to effect food and favor rates like how Ethiopians in AoE III can effect their coin and influence rates from a Mountain Monastery.

@Skadidesu

Not a bad idea but it would effectively be another building that passively trickles favour.

A possible new civ can be based around hunting with no farms (like Mongols in AoE IV) and this gives them a way to keep getting food while also being rewarded with favor from hunting.

@Skadidesu

Nü Wa can already build Markets in Classical Age so nothing completely new.
It could just be a Classical or even Archaic Age building for that civilisation.
Caravans don’t produce little gold in comparison to villagers so they are not really a good investment in early game so I don’t think it would be a balance issue.

Yes I know she can. Taking things from the franchise and using it here with possible new civ as a way to get favor is a common thing here. Trade as a way to get some favor is based on AoE IV where some civs can get more then just gold from trade. The limiting amount of Caravans it to keep someone from going heavy in trade before it is normal for most civs which would be very important when getting both gold and favor from trade.

@Skadidesu

Kinda boring if it mainly comes down to Temples giving a passive trickle.
Relics should honestly generate favour for every civ.

In AoE III you get XP from a Mosque so the favor idea for Temples is based on that and the relics giving more favor is to reward you more for relic collection. Perhaps all civs should benefit from relics giving some favor but having a civ definitely benefiting from it I love.

@Skadidesu

Kinda too similar to Norse I think. If it’s just destroying buildings it would be to hard to get favour in the early game.

Yes it is similar to Norse and its totally based on AoE III gaining XP when you kill and destroy stuff.

@Skadidesu

That is kinda strange. Getting resources for doing bad.

Die fighting for the good of your civilization to get favor from the gods for your people isn’t really that strange its similar to Norse warriors going to Valhalla when they die in honorable battle.

@Skadidesu

Sounds kinda boring.

Not many fun ways to gain favor outside of combat and this is based on getting XP from making units and ships in AoE III

@Skadidesu

Also boring and hard to balance.
It’s like Atlanteans but worse.

It’s like in AoE III where you get XP from constructing buildings except walls.

@Skadidesu

That is just completely passive, it can’t really get more boring.

Another thing from AoE III involving XP where you get XP from doing nothing only here you get favor and it can be increase based on what Age your in.

@Skadidesu

Myth units cost Favour so they should not generate Favour.
Norse heroes already generate favour.

Having myth units and heroes generate favor from killing units is a way to further encourage myth unit and hero usage over regular units for a possible new civ.

[BaphometSLM]

@Skadidesu

@BaphometSLM

Sacrifice: Either human units or livestock (if we’re allowed to train livestock in Retold).

Livestock is kinda boring because it would just mean being indirectly able to buy favour, but it could be expended to be interesting.

Actually, I think it would be nice since you would have to choose between killing it for food or for favor. But yes, this could be expanded upon.

@Skadidesu

Human sacrifice is a cool idea because you have to make trade offs in the early game. Giving up a villager and therefor some economy to get some favour.
But in the late game it would come down to just buying favour again.

It depends on how it is implemented. If you were able to capture enemies, just like in the ROTG mod, this would be more interesting.

@Skadidesu

@BaphometSLM

Pok-a-tok: Assign units to the mayan ball game to gain favor.

Wouldn’t that be a reskin of the Greek method?
Or would it be other units then villagers?

As I’ve suggested on the Aztec vs Mayan thread, I think any “humanoid” unit should be able to play, whether it is a human soldier, villager, hero or myth unit. Of course some units would generate favor faster than others.

[Skadidesu]

@EricTheRed283

You could have a toggle button on farms to effect food and favor rates like how Ethiopians in AoE III can effect their coin and influence rates from a Mountain Monastery.

That would make it more interesting.
It would probably have to be a global toggle since changing every farm seems kinda micro intensive.
But maybe that would be better to give you more control.

@EricTheRed283

A possible new civ can be based around hunting with no farms (like Mongols in AoE IV) and this gives them a way to keep getting food while also being rewarded with favor from hunting.

If it this hunt will be their main food source then it would be basically become a fixed ratio of favour compared to food they would have in the late game.
Unless there is a setting to choose how much favour it makes.
But then it would be just like the farming one.

@EricTheRed283

In AoE III you get XP from a Mosque so the favor idea for Temples is based on that

@EricTheRed283

its totally based on AoE III gaining XP when you kill and destroy stuff.

@EricTheRed283

It’s like in AoE III where you get XP from constructing buildings except walls.

@EricTheRed283

Another thing from AoE III involving XP where you get XP from doing nothing only here you get favor and it can be increase based on what Age your in.

The thing in AoE3 is that a of things generate XP and most of those methods are available to most civilisations.
You kinda get XP for almost everything you do.

@EricTheRed283

Die fighting for the good of your civilization to get favor from the gods for your people isn’t really that strange its similar to Norse warriors going to Valhalla when they die in honorable battle.

That was more commenting on the gameplay then the mythology behind it.
Getting rewarded for being bad is kinda strange on the other hand if your enemy has this feature do you try to not kill their units?
Would lead to strange gameplay.

@EricTheRed283

Having myth units and heroes generate favor from killing units is a way to further encourage myth unit and hero usage over regular units for a possible new civ.

I see it as mostly a balance issue.
Units that cost a certain resource should not be the main source of that resource or else you have too strong of a feedback loop.

@BaphometSLM

Actually, I think it would be nice since you would have to choose between killing it for food or for favor. But yes, this could be expanded upon.

That would make sense. Maybe give them a small passive trickle when fattening.
You can either send them to a Temple for sacrifice or let villagers kill them for food.

This system would make sense for a lot of Indo European cultures since they are almost all based around animal sacrifice. Just the Indians made a 180° turn on sacrificing cattle.

@BaphometSLM

It depends on how it is implemented. If you were able to capture enemies, just like in the ROTG mod, this would be more interesting.

Yeah I read a little into it.
This method if favour generation suits the Aztecs very well and not really any other civilisation.

It’s one of those special cases where one religion/culture just gives the perfect template.

With AoE3(DE) they already have a decent template for Aztec units too.

@BaphometSLM

As I’ve suggested on the Aztec vs Mayan thread, I think any “humanoid” unit should be able to play, whether it is a human soldier, villager, hero or myth unit. Of course some units would generate favor faster than others.

That could be kind of to “easy” and it also still seems kinda to similar to the Greeks.
Some researchers think that this game involved human sacrifice so maybe it could be a thing where there is a chance that a unit is sacrificed in the ritual making you consider if you want to send your good units there or not.
This would be distinct enough from both the Aztec and Greek methods of collecting favour.

[Riba]

Tribute Mine: Build a building on top of gold mines slowly consuming gold mine, preventing mining it, but generating favor

Offering altar: Trade resources for favour at altar. Everytime you offer something, exchange rate degrades, overtime it improves

Holy Artifacts: Each relic garrisoned inside TC generates trickle of favor, but won’t grant their bonus

Slaughter of The Lambs: Garrison herdables and sacrifice them to the gods. You can buy more herdables at decreasing cost over time.

Human population: Simple, generate tiny bit of favor for each population space occupied by military units that are not heroes or myth units.

Pay attention to next one as it is unique, fun, complex and interesting
Favorite son: Start with hero (pantheon mechanic, works as scout 1st age) that gets stronger with different bonuses to stats and ability with each minor god you pick. It generates favor by fighting and gathers trophy from enemies to Trophy Wall. If it dies, it can be retrained from town center (with training time of 2 vils and increasing cost for age youre in)

Trophy Wall: Trophy Wall includes 4 slots: Economy Units, Human Units, Myth Units, Heroes, granting permanent bonus for that game, which you have to loot. When you kill enemy unit of that type (with the main hero damaging it in last 5 seconds), you earn 1 choice of different bonus for that slot buffing units of that type up to maximum of 5 choices per game. As there will be ~15 or so total of the bonuses for each slot and you will only gain access to 5 choice each game, each game your trophy wall will be different. Otherwise stronger bonuses generate small trickle of favour and weaker bonuses large trickle of favour. The first bonus for that type you loot, will be automatically equipped, subsequent ones can be equipped freely with cooldown after first swap.

Examples of trophies (Keep in mind that egyptians generate 28.4 favor per minute with all 5 monuments and no empowering)
Human Military slot:

1. +10% Infantry Hitpoints,+4 favor per minute
2. +5% speed to human units, +8 favor per minute

Myth unit slot:

1. -20% Myth Special Attack Recharge, +8 Favor per minute
2. -10% Myth unit favor cost

Hero Slot:

1. +25% damage to human units by heroes, +8 favor per minute
2. +50% favor generated from fighting by heroes, +4 favor per minute

Economy slot:

1. +10% Trade caravan speed, +4 favor per minute
2. +5% gather rate to all resources, +4 favor per minute
3. +10% Wood Gather rate, +6 favor per minutee
   etc. Note that you can only equip one per slot, but you can swap it during game after waiting some minutes

[BaphometSLM]

@Skadidesu

That would make sense. Maybe give them a small passive trickle when fattening.
You can either send them to a Temple for sacrifice or let villagers kill them for food.

This system would make sense for a lot of Indo European cultures since they are almost all based around animal sacrifice. Just the Indians made a 180° turn on sacrificing cattle.

Yes exactly, this way of generating favor would fit for a wide range of potential civs.

@Skadidesu

That could be kind of to “easy” and it also still seems kinda to similar to the Greeks.
Some researchers think that this game involved human sacrifice so maybe it could be a thing where there is a chance that a unit is sacrificed in the ritual making you consider if you want to send your good units there or not.
This would be distinct enough from both the Aztec and Greek methods of collecting favour.

Too easy I don’t know, but yes the ball game was related to sacrifice in mayan culture. Even the gods of the underworld themselves have played pok-a-tok in the Popol vuh. I think each units playing should generate a favor trickle, but I’m not a fan of the idea of it being only based on chance.