Contrary to the opinion that the humbaracci is a problem beacuse its just better than other grenadiers, I think its a way better model for what ALL grenade troopers (of legacy civs) should be.
It references what grenadiers were used for as late as the late 16th century opposed to the mid 18 century grenadier - which was basically the Soldado. Given that historical reference the humbaracci gets a good role, where the common gren can be summed up as ‘falconet but less’, despite having the exact same historical function. Drawing from said function, a proposal for a new gren model for legacy civs.
Summary
HP: 200
Resist: 30% siege, 20% melee
Range: 6
Speed: 5
Ranged attack: 15
Melee attack: 25
Siege attack: 50
Attack rate: 2 at range, 1.5 in melee, 3 in siege
AOE: 2 with ranged attack, none for melee/siege
Multipliers: x 0.5 vs heavy cavalry/shock inf at range, x 0.4 vs heavy cavalry/shock in melee, x 2.5 vs artillery and ships at range, x 1.5 vs artillery in melee, x 2 vs forts, x 3.5 vs culverin at range.
Population: 1
Cost: 100 food, 40 gold
Grenadier - Siege trooper. Elite infantry equipped with heavy iron grenades to disable artillery emplacements. Excels against fortifications and in close quarters.
In the end, the grenadier should be a unit that stands up well to melee infantry and artillery, but gets killed by everything with a ranged attack.
Best example I know for the tactical logic is the last siege of Vienna. To sum things up:
- Cannon emplacements of the attackers and defenders started in a stalemate.
- Grenadiers would try to break the stalemate, so attacking artillery can shoot bombard defending line infantry.
- Trenches, tunnels, or other cover were needed to get close - bad tactical setting for muskets so a specialized siege trooper was used.
- Attacker goal is to disable defending cannon, defender goal is to kill attacking grenadiers - end result is dodge ball with obstacles and then CQC when ammo is gone.
So from all that, the proposed stat breakdown can be explained;
- Grens were taken from the tall and strong to optimize throwing range of heavy grenades; hence, the high hp and attack stats.
- Priming and throwing a bomb is faster than loading a musket, but slower than firing an arrow - 2 ranged attacks per second seems reasonable - up for debate tho.
- Melee fighting was part of their main job, but they were never expected to counter dedicated melee units (heavy cav, halbs, dopps) - so high base damage and melee resistance for that part.
- They were expected to lose vs line infantry, so the ranged resist is gone. Few big gun = small problem, many small gun = big problem.
- Grenades were 2.5 to 6 lbs in the 16th century - half the (effective) range of muskets is generous for tossing that.
- Cover and trenches isnt a thing in the game - so the siege resistance is to imply use of cover against artillery.
- Early grenades were less efficient - more powder and iron needed to be effective than later ones; meaning more weight and cost per unit → higher gold cost than musketeers.
- Role was more specialized and complex that of line infantry - higher overall cost.
Summary
HP: 200
Resist: 30% siege, 20% melee
Range: 8
Speed: 5
Ranged attack: 15
Melee attack: 25
Siege attack: 50
Attack rate: 2 at range, 1.5 in melee, 3 in siege
AOE: 1.5 with ranged attack, none for melee/siege
Multipliers: x 0.5 vs cavalry/SI at range, x 0.4 vs cavalry/SI in melee, x 2.5 vs artillery and ships at range, x 1.5 vs artillery in melee, x 2 vs forts, x 3.5 vs culverin at range.
Population: 1
Cost: 125 food, 40 gold
For the Otto variant, this looks like it might come from the last Vienna - Austrian grens use iron grenades which cause worse shrapnel injuries, and otto grens had glass grenades which could be thrown farther. Trade off; 25% more range for 25% less aoe.
Summary
HP: 200
Resist: 25% siege, 25% melee
Range: 6
Speed: 5
Ranged attack: 15
Melee attack: 31
Siege attack: 40
Attack rate: 2 at range, 1.5 in melee, 3 in siege
AOE: 2 with ranged attack, none for melee/siege
Multipliers: x 0.5 vs heavy cavalry/shock inf at range, x 0.4 vs heavy cavalry/shock in melee, x 2 vs artillery and ships at range, x 1.2 vs artillery in melee, x 1.6 vs forts, x x 3.5 vs culverin at range.
Population: 1
Cost: 100 food, 40 gold
For a Russian variant, they have the standard cost/stat trade off, but also the additional quirk better melee ability in exchange for being worse at their primary jobs.
Relevant home city cards
- All things that effect gunpowder infantry also effect grens by default.
- Grenade launder - adds +6 range to range and +3 to ranged attack, but reduces ranged attack rate to 3.0. Does not reduce aoe.
Relevant Arsenal changes
- Incendiary grenades dont boost aoe.
- Infantry sabers - 20% boost to hand damage.
Later, the need for dedicated grenade regiments declined in the 18 (ish) century, so they were absorbed into line infantry as an elite branch of particularity tough line infantrymen that occasionally threw grenades. The natural progression would be to have an age 4 card that converts existing grens into Soldado-esque units, but I’d rather keep the pin in that grenade.
