I recently played as Turks vs Gurjaras. I was far ahead in eco but I couldn’t find any way to beat their army in a somewhat cost effective way.
Shrivamsha Rider shield works vs hand cannoners, janissaries and archers.
My hussars and camels dies to super camels.
My champions dies to super cheap hussars.
So everything Turks appears to get hard countered from one type of building; the stables. Afterwards I checked aoe stats and Turks have 30% winrate vs Gurjaras 1v1. Prolly the most uneven match-up in the entire game since aoe2 beta.
It is true that some cavalry civs with bad foot archers have a hard time vs that civ. Spanish, Franks, Tatars, Huns, Turks, Bengalis have the lowest wr vs Gurjaras.
According to Spirit of the Law, going spearman + skirm as Turks is not as bad as people might think, so next time go full trash!
Jk, it’s awful. With any other civ i’d suggest going Onager but Turks don’t even get that. Other than out macroing and maybe getting some early raids in, i don’t see how you’d turn a post imp game with these civs around, because Gurjaras have all the advantage. I guess winning the game as early as possible is the only way.
Btw if you make too many champions watch out for the Chakram thrower, those things are super deadly vs infantry… well, they’re deadly vs everything except onagers.
This was a terrible matchup, and yeah Gurjaras are OP.
I’m thinking the same. Have to force a win feudal/early castle before Turk lack of upgrades kick in, else its lost.
I just checked Bengalis and they even have a worse win rate (like 27%). But I guess that’s also due to people not being used to the civ. I much rather play Bengalis then Turks vs Gurjaras. At least they have halbs, arbs and onagers.
I guess he was joking. Monks are pretty bad both vs Gurjaras (and Berbers) since they both go for stables and easily can make scout-line to snipe monks.
No, he wasn’t. Mix monks with camels sounds a solid combo to stay stand until imp when you quickly can add BBC.
I use almost only Turks in open map and this kind of matchup really anoying me too. Really don’t have he habit of use monks, but I should try them.
Only point of going BBC is to counter something else then stable units. Like siege and archers. Which Gurjaras doesn’t have to do. They have all the tools to win from the Stables. I don’t see what’s beneficial for Turks in trying to take the game to the late game.
Jannis and monks is basically impossible for gurjaras to deal with by only using stable units in castle age. Try to be safe at home and then push forward with that army would be my approach in that matchup. Alternatively you could play camel cav archer but that you won’t be able to pull off from 1 tc only so you only have a narrow time window in late castle age to pull it off (as an imp comp that’s probably too expensive to sustain).
I highly doubt this is correct below a certain elo. The amount of babysitting and micro required is far above that required to counter this.
Nevermind the logistics of this. You have jannis that are very slow to reinforce. And monks that get the hell sniped out of them if they aren’t protected. And it gets worse the longer the game does on for, and monks have rapidly diminishing returns due to the number of units involved.
And to be clear I have done this myself, played the monks and won, and wiped opposing monks. but there’s a reason monks aren’t used much on the ladder below a certain elo.
So I’m betting for this to work, OP needs to lose enough elo, that the workload of managing monks can pay off.
And finally, as mentioned above , enough shivs will just ROFL stomp this. Even if you convert a few
Both countered by gurj fully functional skirm line. While Bengali don’t really have a counter.
It’s easier for the gurj player to snipe Beng siege with shivs (and later BBC, free hussars) than it is for said siege to do its job.
It has nothing to do with familiarity with the civ. It simply lacks tools.
On top of the flawed pigeonholed eco(similar to old cumans) you can almost guarantee they’re going to multi TC boom, so you exploit that. If they don’t multi TC boom, they don’t fully use their an eco bonus. So it’s a catch 22, and bad civ design.
There is no suggestion that can help. People should stop being in denial about Gurjaras. There is no question about Gurjaras being OP or not, its a fact.
Shrivamshas are too good at raiding and at killing any ranged units
Whilst this is all true (Turks have baiscally no answer to the full cav comp of gurjaras).
There is or at least was the option of just beating with all-ins or more eco.
The game was designed around this tactical decisions. Thing is some casters like memb often advertise that in certain maps like arabia this shouldn’t be an option and the map was desiged to only be played a certain way. This ofc takes away this strategical element in a disfavoring matchup like this which could make it more balanced.
Then ofc we have the one issue with gurjaras that they not only have this stable combo (chakrams) but also a neat eco bonus which allows them to make more pressure early and restrict your expansion in the process. This is one of the factors why this kind of combination of strong easy acessable comps and a good early bonus are problematic.
But problematic in general, not only because of a single matchup.
Actually, I think CA is kinda nogo vs gurjaras, cause their comp of shrivamsha + camel makes it basically impossible to use. It actually leads gurjaras to go for their favorite lategame comp and gives a lot of time to gurjaras to build up an eco for it. One of the few civs that have no problems vs CA.
Monks are definitely a good counter to Shrivamshas. They move too fast and they are too cheap to make Shrivamshas worth converting. Besides, they can just mix in Light Cav with no problems.
I think generally, having very one-sided matchups for a few civs is fine. Gurjaras is not the only civ Turks would struggle against. Probably Camels + Janissaries are your best bet. Good thing target firing also ignores Shrivamsha mechanic, so you can still get some hits in with BBC if the other player doesn’t micro them.
nevermind chaks.