The Steppe Lancer is still not very good. Part of this problem is that they’re at their best when stacked in larger numbers(admittedly, still not great), and massing sufficient numbers early on is nigh-impossible. Far more effective to mass archers if you want an immediate power spike, or knights if you’re willing to wait.
But what if you could split the difference?
Steppe Scout
Available from the Feudal Age
Attack:5
Range:1
HP:45
This unit is basically identical to a scout cavalry, but with the crucial advantage that you get a free upgrade and an immediate power spike in castle age. This allows you to do a hybrid of knights and archers, as long as you can keep them alive long enough.
What do you think? Viable enough for some small portion of cases?
Potentially problematic due to free upgrade and extra range. The only potential answer is archers and even archers are going to need 15 shots to kill it before bloodlines.
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I think it would be ok, it cost a lot of food so it Will hurt your castle time. But I would like more if they got a bonus against something or more speed
could also increase tt. from 24s to 40s
currently scout takes 23 shots from an archer,
trains in 30s
80 res vs 110 for SL ( ignoring food mulitplier for simplicity)
1.55 speed vs 1.45
so SL will train and move slower, die easier, and cost a lot more, but does have much better utility than a scout, might even need to increase that tt further, maybe something drastic like 50s (similar to the jump in eagle scout from feudal to castle age) so you wont be able to pull off a “scrush” per se, but throw in an additional SL with the scrush, and you’ll nuke small walls?
I dunno how fond I am of these mechanics like "camel scout"s.
But it could be a unique way to buff Cuman Steppe lancers I guess.
And if it’s unique to Cumans it deserves to be strong, since using feudal military means you’re losing out on a significant part of the Cuman eco bonus.
Yeah this is a terrible idea, the range makes them so much better at killing villagers than scouts or really any other feudal military unit (since archers lack ballistics) and they have no counter. Spearmen will get wrecked with range and not feasible, archers again lacking ballistics can’t deal with Lancers and might even get gobbled up because of insufficient numbers
2 Likes
They don’t have range in feudal
They already have 3 early access in Feudal Age which are supposed to be unlocked in Castle Age. Don’t need a 4th.
2 Likes
I miss the time when there is only one civ that have two UT
Or are you suggesting your own idea?
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stupid question but what about switching the gold / food amount of steppe lancers and giving elite sl +1 PA?
Its very expensive to afford in early feudal age. In late feudal age, you can add such units if you clear up all enemy archers with your skirms. Otherwise its just fragile and would die easily to the mass of archers + few spears and with 5 attack, you probably won’t get much value by investing into them.
Problem with lancers is their cost vs value. Either their cost needs to be restored to 30 gold or food cost should go down to 60 food or their attack and hp should be restored to their initial version.
70 gold is too much for that unit.
even with +1 pierce armor in imp?
I think the currently kinda high food ratio hurts SL in the midgame cause you can’t really add eco behind when you make them. But you want / need to as it is a snowball unit and you need that eco to get to the critical mass.
So yeah I think higher gold but lower food cost should actually benefit the SL usability. Even if it’s only for adding a few of them early castle age for raids.
But the elite upgrade costs a lot of food which means you need a lot of eco to get elite and produce a bunch of them which means its only viable after a full boom. At that point why would you do this unit at all. Tatars and Cumans have stronger unit options to fight ranged units and clear out siege. Mongols only need a meat shield for their Mangudais and some unit to kill a mass of skirmishers. None of these scenarios justify a 70 gold unit.
The food cost and the low p.armor. If only elites have 2 p.armor, 70 gold is just way too much for them at their current stats.
That’s just their exact same utility as today. Even today you can go Steppe lancers if you hit castle age early and you believe you have about a minute lead over your opponent just to raid a bit.