what if we merge my idea with yours?
increase attack speed.
increase movement speed.
reduce elite cost.
Elite gets +1 range.
that way castle age is unchanged and EA can tank for Crossbows.
and in Imperial Age they can tank for HC?
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That might be an overbuff, and Indians are supposed to focus on their boom in Castle Age.
By increasing teh Range, you already nullify the need for more Movement Speed.
We must also remember that they do bonus damage vs Buildings, so any Attack Speed increase should have that in mind.
I think we should buff in one way first, and then add more buffs and tweaks later on if needed, and for that, I do honestly believe that the +1 Range would be the biggest buff you could give them, without making them OP.
As for Elite cost, it is already very cheap, when compared to many other UUs.
When I tried 5 range EAs, they stood ahead of HCs all the time
Whatâs skirms supposed to do here?
I donât think this unit can be OP at all considering ballista elephant arenât who beat everything non siege once massed up, the cost and castle production will always stop that.
My suggestions:
- +4 attack bonus vs archers (incl.skirms)
- -2 cav archer armor changed to +2 cav archer armor (now they only take +4 from skirms)
- Attack rate increased to 2.3
- 5 range
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well yeah they have shatanagi. iâm refering to castle age.
what bout keeping normal elephant archers 4 range, so they can still tank for xbows, but elite ones 5 range?
and of course the cost reduction of the elite upgrade?
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Keep the enemy Skirms from targetting the Cav Archers while they raid.
I mean is there a point to use both crossbows and EAs in CA?
Yeah I didnât take account of EA use in castle age since theyâre expensive but I guess that can work
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a few EA to tank and the crossbows to be the real damage dealer.
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I would argue that no, but because Indians get FU Cav Archers, so I would just transition to them.
If you disregard Cav Archers, then yes, there is a point to training Crossbows, as not only do you train them faster, but they cost no Food, so all that Food can go to EAs, while the Wood goes for Crossbows, and you end up splitting the Gold, which is not that difficult in the Castle Age, specially if you get Sultans.
Japanese Ashigaru: Am I a joke to you?
Ashigaru actually got Pikes and Matchlocks (Teppo) from the Ports.
Before that, they fought mostly with Yari and Yumi, since they were not allowed to use Swords, as far as I know.
Itâs what they initially planned the tech to do when they did the mod version of Age of Forgotten, and it was crazy OP so they had to change the tech.
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Check my Indian mod which is a good proposal for the default Indians.
https://www.ageofempires.com/mods/details/15418/
Hand Cannoneers gets +2 range and also 100% accuracy (not like Portuguese ballistics)
Also, Indians get proper civ bonuses
- Armored War Elephant or Varu
- Gunpowder bonus (based on Mughals and Rajput vassals under Mughals who created massive cannons and long ranged but accurate hand guns)
- hand gun armor bonus (banduquiche- Mughal hand gun that uses a mantlet similar to pavise but larger )
- camel armor bonus - existing but enhanced to be in line with knight-line pierce armor
- Elephant bonus - native
- unit conversion resistance based on native religion
- monk healing bonus (origin of herbal medicines like siddha, ayurvedha)
- castle bonus (based on several powerful castles of North India and some in South which are massive, located on very high elevation and very difficult to siege even with cannon fire)
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Can we agree that having duplicate UUs will take the unique feel of the civs?
Why not Armored Elephant Archers?
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EA is already armoured, specially in Pierce Armour.
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Why not Armored Elephant Archers?
Why not Elephant Skirmishers, Ram Elephants, Elephant Camels, Elephant Trade Carts, Elephant Ships, Elephant Kings, Elephant Petards, Elephant Spearman or Flaming Elephants
Elephant Kings might be a GREAT SITUATIONAL UNIT!! i mean who wouldnt want multiple 400HP Kings in REGICIDE!!!
Much more common than the âsituationsâ where EA are âusefulâ (at wasting gold).
P.S. Elephant Camels : Since the Indians since antiquity were obviously so great at training Camels to be useful compared to Elephants, ofcourse it is an Elephant on top of a Camel
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LoL Iâm ROTFL 
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Might as well go for Elephant Nuclear Reactors
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Would recommend you to give Persians the Savaran as their UU (also need to rebalance them accordingly) if you are moving their War Elephant to Indians. Because unique units should be unique.
Elephant Petard / Elite Elephant Petard better known as âNuclear Elephantsâ
Cost 250F 40G
Attack: 150
Blast Radius : 4/5 (Problem?)
HP: 450/650, Speed 1.3/1.4 (Real Elephants are fast, Problem?)
A/PA : 2/4 , 3/5
Armor Classes: â â â â u,â â â
Attack Bonuses : Takes down a Castle in one shot (+5000 vs buildings, its 20x the gunpowder of a petard, Problem?)
EDIT: If we have Turtle Ships as the Korean UU in the game , why cant we have the Elephant Ships as UU for Indians?
It could be used in situations that are much more common than the âsituationsâ where EA are âusefulâ
And Elephants wreck Turtles IRL they literally stomp on them
Lets go back to the main topic. I see two problems with imperial camels.
- Their team bonus giving camel attack bonus vs building doesnât work with most other civs. At the latest patch, out of 35 civs, only 10 other civs have camel in their tech tree. Take out byzantine, Ethiopian, and mongols which lacks blood line or final armor upgrade or both, the bonus doesnât work for them anymore as their camels wonât last as long under defensive arrows. So, this bonus can realistically benefits only 7 out of 35 civs (only 20%). Team bonus should be something that can benefit majority of the civs.
- Many other players are complaining Elephants archers are very situational and are not as useful in reality and that indian should have battle elephants for historical accuracy.
For these reasons, I would like to propose the following change.
- Give battle elephants to indian, remove camel +1P armor bonus and make fishing bonus as team bonus. This way, instead of camels raiding the towns, Indian get elephants which are designed to resist archer fire and take down buildings. They can still have imperial camels but they are now reduced to just cavalry counter and no longer OP as heavy cavalry, raiders + building attack. On top of that, they get a team bonus that works for all civ on maps that has shore fish.
- To differentiate from other Rise of Raja civs, make elephant units attack 33% faster for Indian. In this way, elephants archers will get a buff simultaneously.
- To balance their elephant advantage, remove Hussars from tech tree. They already have 3 eco bonus, 1. fishing bonus, 2. villagers discount, 3. gold production +10% and 2 other trash units in herbaldiers and skirmishers. This way, not only they will be losing a late game trash unit, their faster attacking elephants will become more susceptible to monks overall. Not only that, they will no longer be able to use their potent hussar + cavalry archer combo and thus will encourage more towards elephant + elephant archer + handcannoner combo instead.
If further balance is needed, we can always change the price of unique techs and price of elephant archer.