I don’t know who he is
Guys, I’ve made it, I’m finally the euro gamer.
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Yes, you already told us xD
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If I had to try and pin down the fundamental issue with this civ, it’s that the civ is supposed to be the “normal wacky civ.” That’s what it originally was, the Warchief civ that euro civ players could most easily pick up and learn.
That means it’s a civ that isn’t really meant for anyone. If you like crazy warchief civs you play Aztecs or Lakota, and if you like euro civs you play euro civs.
That’s my assessment, and I don’t think you can fix that with a buff or an eco card. What you need to do is focus in on their unique features and make them more prominent. Stuff like making their siege units available in age 2, providing a unique way to gather wood, and allowing them to incorporate native subcivs into their roster.
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Ah yes Hoopthrower, who argued passionately for anything but european DLCs.
Welcome to the club.
Of all factions Russia seems like one of the most unique factions in the game, having to buy units in groups, relying on lower end unit as oppose to the general design philosophy of other factions going with more high end units.
Factions like Japan and India are far more vanilla than Russia ever was.
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Dumb decisions - not using mantles in the late game.
yes, the forest prowler is only good for hit and run tactics. He loses in a clinch fight. So why do we need him at all? In the late game, you have cannons behind your army. They can’t kite. Iroquois have no movement speed upgrades. In the late game, ANY INFANTRY will move 0.9 faster than a forest prowler. Very bad for the kite.
Besides, I’m not a bot and I can send as many settlers to the farms as I need.
I would like to see him removed from the game. Useless unit.
Lol, all treaty players will ban you if they see such a card on your deck)))
You’ve clearly never played Treaty ahah.
When moving to age 5, the Iroquois can get 10 healers, several of which are just sitting around doing nothing if you somehow got them earlier. I get a reduced benefit from ageing up. which once again proves that the nation is not complete.
Everything is the same, and the cards can be sent because they are different cards with different pictures.
unlike other natives, these ones actually have arti
No need to rework from scratch. Just give the forest prowler normal damage, and either give the tomahawks melee damage or reduce their cost even more, remove a bunch of unnecessary cards and give normal cards for the economy. this is the minimum program
The Incas, Aztecs and Lakota have the most important thing - they have an economy. They even have factory analogues. The Iroquois are different in that their economy is shit.
Why so much wood then? Mantles die very slowly. 
And there is no need for endless hunters. The nation is built around cattle breeding.
It’s as easy as pie. Make tomahawks deal melee damage from a distance. This already changes the battle tactics very much. How it was originally. And fix the economy.
I would also add that the card that speeds up food gathering from livestock by 300% is absolutely useless from the point of view that the limited number of livestock limits the speed of food collection, which does not happen when using farms. Relying on livestock is simply dangerous in protracted battles, you can be left without food.
The Iroquois have a total infantry upgrade of 40% damage and HP, which other civilizations do not have. At the same time, their skirmishers and musketeers are extremely weak. Their entire army is absolutely useless and helpless without a chief and a war ceremony.
Forrest prowlers…weak…
Edit: saying the units are weak without chief and plaza is like saying my truck runs poorly without gas
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Rams, Mantlets, Light Cannons and Canoes have a Wood cost so it allows you to be able to keep making them from having a infinite Wood source from Trees and also if you don’t use Environmentalism to change cost of Tomahawks and Kanya Horseman from Wood to Coin you can also keep making them never ever having to worry about running out of Trees to make them.
North American Trade card would be better in the late game for them with a Infinite Deer shipment.
I’m almost surprised I didn’t make this post.
But yes, the four Native American civs need rehauls from the ground up. Trying to combine three unique “continents” into a single bridge just doesn’t work - Mesoamerica, Tortuamerica, and South America all need to be separate from each other. If really necessary, splitting them into Tortuamerica and Mesoamerica would be fine - Incans would be awkward, but they could mesh as a “Mesoamerican”-styled civ, following the design patterns of the Aztecs.
You know battlefield construction is used by every civ that has it right?
The more you talk the more im convinced you are just talking out of your ass or is just a troll
Why would a card that allows the units that is made out of war huts to build war huts be good?
Allowing you to establish bases without risking the squishy vils that you have pushed over the vil limit with the age 5 age up and therefore if you lose any cant go back up to 109 vils ever? cant be that
allowing you to keep your plaza on spamming units or increasing ur atk so that the moment the war huts are built you can instantly spam units out of them and not just spamming out travios that only have a 10 build limit?? cant be that
Or maybe it is actually used by people playing treaty?
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I believe (although perhaps insufficiently clear) that he was referring to “Team Cheap Outposts” which is a fairly useless card shared with the Portuguese.
Edit: I found the origin (see below), though, I don’t think Huad uses a whole lot of wagons in treaty normally. I suppose in 60min It’s probably better than the XP ceremony at some point, but usually just build with vills and warhut units.
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Let me explain for the supremacy lover.
You spend a whole slot or two on what the settlers can do. In these slots you can put two whole permanent upgrades. It should be clear as day.
The second point is that in Treaty you should build as many walls as possible. You will still use settlers on the front lines. For this card, everyone will spit on you as a noob and ban you as the last loser.
You can not thank for a free lecture.
They lose british longbowmans.
What is the point of a card that increases infantry stats by another 10%? To create more problems? To fill a slot that could be used for something more useful? It turns out that the Iroquois need 1 more shipment to reach the same condition as their opponents. That’s all. This card does not give any advantage. Because of it, their soldiers are 10% weaker than soldiers of other nations at age 2.
Mmmm nop, with an army of 40 sepoys I can deploy a whole forward base in seconds (reason I dont research spies due to bug)
If im next to your town/forward base I can set 2 castles and mass flail elephants.
You are going to take down my last few barracks in fb?? Peace time and I rebuild them
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Almost everything in the game does in a shootout vs longbow. Kite. Always kite. Especially vs masses if longbow. Hell even huss and falcs can die vs carded longbows once a critical mass is reached. Its not a good metric to use because theyre OP in no micro but vs kiting often bad. A tricky unit to use or face.
No, not really. Tomos have decent melee poor range and base hp. But should always have a warchief boost and the big button to have a bigger mass to protect aenna which are beefier than longbows and cheap, kanya which are not a tier but solid and ship 1 extra, and prowlers with the warchief base are more dps what like 2 less health or something small? And the ability to boost these attacks via plaza in an all in is important- good haude players have a plaza and know when to sacrifice economy to crush a fight and win.
So no its not 10% weaker base. Its base and scales very well. Ofc FPs used to be just better base so they have been nerfed alot and not as op as abus (nothing really is) but will preform as good as skirm or better when you use the civ as intended. Loose warchief or failure to use plaza mid game/late is player issue, not haude issue.
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You can say the same for advanced arsenal for euro civs
and even then you are sending a shipment , building the arsenal and paying res for…(+10%HP and +15% atk for gunpowder infantry) which for most civs is 2 main unit, mercs if you are lucky and a few natives
and a few other techs that wont be useful till the lategame
while haud can send 1 card and get another +10% stats 4 of their units and potentially natives as well
Why do euro civs have to send cards and spend res to get what natives civs get in a single send?
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The cassadors will destroy them. face to face. That’s all you need to know about FP.
You are talking about dancing with a tambourine, which I am talking about too. I must send one more card just so that my soldiers with a chief and a plaza become the same as the enemy’s soldiers without a chief, a plaza and one extra card. That is exactly what I said.
The only thing that allows the Iroquois to destroy the enemy is the mantles. That’s all.
Iroquois Plaza does not make any economic improvements.
You didn’t get me. Iroquois take 5% less damage for two cards, while Europeans take 5% more melee and ranged damage and more movement speed for one card and resources. So even at age 5, Iroquois soldiers are still weaker, while their deck is also weaker and their economy is weaker. Only mantles can solve something, but they are easy countered by cavalry.
You just won’t be able to do that, because everything will be covered with 7 layers of walls that soldiers can’t build. In Treaty, walls decide everything.
It depends on the map. On Orinoco you’ll have about 7 layers by your base, but at Tr end everyone is fighting (and building) at the River. Usually there’s a void between the river and your base’s shell, so all he needs to do is break through and suddenly the front line is at your base’s shell. You might not even have LoS of the whole area in the void so you might miss the Sepoys (a small number is all that’s needed) as you micro your culvs etc at the front. Sepoys build things pretty quickly and such a self-replicating blob behind your lines can be devastating. Five Siege Eles from the first castle can break walls pretty quickly. You’re probably building army at home right after they fire, but unless you’re Russia that takes some time and losing 3 layers of wall before enough of your units die off to be converted into pop at home will put your base at risk. Deleting perfectly good units at the main fighting line to rebuild at home would work too, but then you’ve probably made the whole exercise worth it for the other side even if he doesn’t do any real damage.
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