Showing age 5 graphs and Legendary units definitely helped us determine you were complaining about Sup…
This is all clearly about Sup too I guess…
Coming back to this though, multiple posts within this thread made it clear we were talking about Treaty. Stop moving the goal posts. In a Sup game as Huad you shouldn’t often find yourself gathering from a farm at all, let alone on a fully upgraded one.
Umm, it’s an option. Most cards are. Native Treaties (shipment of natives from allied posts) is certainly a Rush option (and CT boosting natives is a great addition in a nat rush).
You don’t need all of them. Medicine and Team Medicine aren’t really to use together, it’s for different games. In a 4v4 team Medicine would be way better than Regular medicine.
The shooting houses is a fairly useless card. Every single civ has some. Town Ceremony has some niche uses at least.
You know this. Are you really asking about Heron Allies? It’s an infinite native card in age 4. It’s for treaty because of 0 pop cost.
Don’t you think that these nations are unfinished? That they are at the level of Bethesda releases? After so many years.
You didn’t understand me. I was just saying that even for a team treat, it seems to me that giving the whole team 10% of food is much better than doing a cow boom.
It’s very risky in my opinion if your opponent goes to age 2 rush.You don’t know whether he will wait for the falconet or not, and the travois will already be used up.
Why do I need tomahawk supplies at all? They are easy enough to go into mass. Wouldn’t it be better to take mantle supplies instead?
There are cards in the deck that are physically impossible to use.
It is also absolutely obvious that Iroque houses are more expensive and there are only 14 of them, obviously they must perform some function. And the developers (not me) decided that they should shoot… with 10 damage at a distance of 12. The distance of 12, by the way, is calculated not from the edge of the house, but from its middle. That is, the actual attack distance is 6. The declared function does not work. Has not worked for 10 years.
Exactly! You said it yourself that it’s overpriced garbage. Just not the cavalry, but all units except mantles and light guns.
If it comes down to it, it is much more convenient to kill falconets with a ram than with khayas.
And you ignored my main point. Without the war ceremony, the Iroquois troops are equal in strength to the Russians, only they are produced and cost twice as much. What the hell is age 2 rush, with such expensive crap.
I understand that you are a awesome driver who is able to win a race with one non-working cylinder, but that doesn’t mean it has to be that way.
As a professional treaty player I have better micro than any supremacy player.
I’m just not a shit eater.
It may be bad manners, but I can discuss several topics at the same time without any difficulty.
Yes, exactly. Why hasn’t it been fixed or removed in 10 years? What’s the problem? And no. Only Iroque has houses that shoot.
I completely disagree. If the battle is taking place near the war huts, then you need to boost the troops, not the buildings, and if the battle is under the TC, then all the guys from the plaza need to be hidden in this TC. And there will be no ceremony.
A good idea is to wait until they are all killed before a new supply and spend gold on 3 light guns or spam the same mantles endlessly, only twice as powerful saving money. For me the choice is obvious, and has been tested many times in practice. I would say that there is no choice here at all)))
Juan age up fast, hit tomo big button make 5 ship 4 kanya timed to forward warhut. Ship 5.vills(or) then 6 tomos. Should be pressuing 5min , 5 to 11 tomos at opponent base 530.
Im sure then you wont lose the 4 kanya and this should be easy dubs. If i can hit 1300 doing this with no control groups as a challenge for you ez.
Then come back to me about how the civ functions
Rams are slow. Kanya are fast. Which unit will exploit openings?
Lastly
No let me be clear. They are expensive for haudes meh eco. They are very solid for their cost. Furthermore with extra dudes in kanya shipment and good crates (split macro hard but 1200>1kc, maybe not 1kw tho) and most importantly map control this is not an issue. If its late age5 with equal eco you lost anyways its a map and murder civ not eco
That’s fine, most people can, but if doing that you can’t take points made clearly about treaty and say “well that doesn’t work in supremacy”.
If you look at what I said, I was believe I was fairly clearly saying every civ has useless cards, not shooting houses.
0 pop… I’ll bring up Lanchester’s law again: More Units > less units. It’s non-linear.
What is your treaty elo? I couldn’t spot you in the top 100. I’m just outside the top 100 in treaty atm and my Team Elo for sup is only like 1700s. Less than that in 1v1. I guess if you’re professional though, you could probably beat me easily in a mirror matchup of your choice:)
Just checked. Kanya is much worse at dealing with skirmishers than mantles and tomahawks. 13+12 Kanya cant kill 40 skirmishers party. Useless garbage. All Iroquois units are complete crap except for the mantles. If you don’t understand the nation design and play the Iroquois as the Portuguese, that’s your mistake. All the Iroquois victories without using mantles are an obvious advantage of the Iroquois Player skill, and not a correct game strategy.
I agree with you, maybe I should install banners on messages, but my complaints are about the strength of units and garbage cards. This is true for all game modes. Non-working shooting houses and the fact that without auras and ceremonies the tomahawk is equal in strength to the recruit - this is unjustified laziness of the developers. They came up with all this in a hurry and abandoned it for 10 years. But now they are releasing some crap either with revolutions or with nations. Who needs them? You have 30% of the already presented nations - buggy shit.
So I misunderstood you. But the shooting houses are a unique Iroquois technology, just like the Incan houses that shit food. And it doesn’t work. That’s a critical error. A nation can be revoked for this crap alone.
I completely agree with you, but I already have 237 population in the treaty. And moron mantles shoot only at point-blank range. That is, they will not be able to approach the battlefield, everything is occupied by other troops. I still think that free mantles in the treaty are more important than a large army.
I haven’t played ranked matches for a long time because I don’t have time for them. First I wait 3 hours for someone to connect and agree to play with me, then we play for two hours - so to get a shitty 25 points I have to spend 5 hours of my life. It’s too much for me. My treaty ELO is 1300.
Just asking cause skirmishers with 20 range vs speed 3.85 units…
Lastly
There is a lost art to handling musk falc called micro. Musks chasing cav die to skirms, kanya should always be moving only commit when you make contact with falcs. Dragboxers will often waste dps selecting the entire mass while fp should be doing their thing. Its dicey vs some civs like otto( obligatory abus are bs) but you should with practice handle most ff falc with kh/prowler plus bb or mr as needed. After the falcs go your army is stronger and yeah lay a plaza and go all in.
P.S
What or who was this meant for? As in haude doesnt boom? Yeah few civs boom like ports. But are you rushing correctly? Or are you trying to make haude a civ that its not?
Id be down, between kiddo and being on laptop my skills have atrophied and it sounds like juans been on the grind. Plus i feel like haude is so underutilized and hard to understand id relish thr chance to show someone how to wrap their head around it. Cause i think people see haude as “euroish” but its micro and macro is actually pretty unique. Like you ff with 800 mixed crates, or using explorer more aggressively, big buttons, travois, plaza etc.
All the micro that is here is to make the maximum number of prowlers and shoot both the musket and the falconets.
What’s wrong with using your favorite Prowlers behind Mantlets?)
I mean your army consists of guns + skyrms. Just like portugal. And this is the only working tactic for iroque in your opinion. Strange, right? Why don’t other tactics work. That’s interesting, don’t you think?
does not shoot
this is a barracks
they work like tc
The Iroquois houses are supposed to work as watchtowers, according to the developers. But they don’t. It’s like taking away the commanderies from Malta.
I am always extremely serious when I communicate on the forum)))
It is you who claim that they fight like the Portuguese and only like that.
Here I am the only one screaming that you can’t play this nation without mantles.
Juan my man…what? Are you saying that I believe can only skirm goon? Or skirm goon cannon? That is their prob “strongest” comp but tomo aenna kh all have their roles in matches. I certainly wouldnt say ports and haude play the same
Mantlets were gutted and were originally intended to be the late-stage massed unit of the Hauds. Gutting Mantlets straight nerfed their late-game, since they relied so heavily on the raw stat pop efficiency of the unit.
They still solid just not always needed
Even with (imho not needed) FP nerfs you can jist murder the opponent army in the field or with micro spam LC. But i know treaty its a different story were manlets popular back in the day?
Mantlets had ≈1k health, 60+ attack, and cost 1 pop originally. They were potentially the most cost-effective unit in the game by sheer pop cost.
Not having those is a massive nerf, simply because of how terrifying they were. While I 100% support nerfing them, the fact remains that they haven’t had suitable buffs to work around lacking their main late-game unit.
I disagree when somebody said this civ lacks personality. Every haude unit unit is unique. It has it’s own architecture. Unique hero. Several politician combinations are viable. Different starts (TP+ longhouse, farm+longhouse, dock + longhouse…) One of the coolest and fun to play cannons. Crates BB, free travois… Asking for a rework makes no sense to me, just needs to fix small things.
Another useless card is ‘‘North America Trade’’ (III) since it gives hunters a small coin trickle (like 0.15s?) while giving wood gatherers a ridiculous amount (0.01s) ¿What’s the point of that?
Also they need to fix the travois not building dock, like 30% of the times it doesn’t start building and considering the 70s? it takes to build it’s not a small deal.
I’m thinking “Guns + Skyrms” is meant to be “Goons + Skirms”. To say that Huad’s only option is skirm/goon is silly.
I played a few games with Huad a little while ago. I mostly just rushed in age 2. Something Portugal can (barely) do. Things like 3vills and 5vills give Huad WAY more tempo in age 2 than Ports, and combined with 6 Tomahawks, 7 Archers, 6 Archers, and 4 KH you can hit way harder. Also 5 Tomahawk BB from the TC. Hitting early with 5 Toms, 5 Archers and 4 Housemen can do a lot of damage.
In extended Age 2 play your infantry all get +25/25% which is a big deal. Most civs can’t match that and some civs will have trouble aging against the amount of pressure you can apply.
If you choose not to rush, you can also FF or FI, both of which have uses in certain situations.
I’m not saying Huads are in the best spot overall, most of the native civs have either been over nerfed or mismanaged imo, but Huad certainly has its options and if you’re game plan with them is “play them like Ports” it isn’t going to work well.
That’s all they can really do. People only look at the stats. I have a 100% win rate 1vs1. That’s why no one except India can withstand Iroquois age 2 rush. The problem is that it’s a useless skill in the late game.
I’ll even brag that I won 1vs3 rush.
Seriously. If you only look at the stats they need to be nerfed because I have a 100% win rate. In reality, they can’t do anything except age 2 rush. At all.
It also really pisses me off that Mexico, Portugal, France, Russia, Dutch, Haudenosaunee, Spain, Lakota, Germany, Italy and Malta have the most effective tactic of skirm+goon. No matter who you play, you always play skirm+goon. It’s especially stupid to see this on natives. They are supposed to be different from Europeans, aren’t they?
At age 3, 3 mantles don’t decide anything. You need either cannons or hussars there. 2 cannons with age 1 upgrade at age 3 also work poorly. Everyone else gets normal cannons on their team, which will already be upgraded by age 4.
Without using mantles it is impossible to fight, the troops are too weak. Literally tomahawks lose any fight musk vs musk. That is, the enemy can simply attack with his army, you must mix troops with mantles. That is, regardless of the chosen tactics, you need to upgrade +1 troop to the imperial age for 3500 resources. Also, to upgrade them you need 5 cards on the deck. These walking sandbags occupy the population, crawl very slowly, are expensive, do not counter any types of troops and they walk behind all the soldiers in formation.
To improve the economy you must sacrifice troop upgrades, the cards simply don’t fit on the deck. (I’ve never seen a single Iroquois with all three wood gathering cards in supremacy/treaty, and not a single Iroquois with a full set of troop upgrades in Treaty)
An infinite number of ways to produce villagers. Why? Either supplies, or medicine, or an embassy, or supplying mercenaries with a TC. They themselves don’t know how it should look. A separate complaint about the medicine team card. Another garbage.
Tomahawks throw further than muskets? Wa? Axe deal ranged damage?
20 war huts are not enough for me. I want 30.
Exactly what I’m talking about. A bunch of useless junk, and it doesn’t even fit on the deck.
Another problem. They supposedly interact with the forest in a cool way, but it’s useless. The enemy is also chopping down the forest. The forest is outside the base, meaning the lumberjacks are always in danger. They can get 500% more wood, yes, but at the same speed. It makes no sense. In a team game, your allies will cut down all your forest. In a single-player game, the lumberjacks need to be protected somehow. Again, it just doesn’t work.
And you will lose because your deck is always weaker.
The nation was abandoned in the middle of development. This is a buggy stub.
Axe deal ranged damage? 