I agree he should have added raged support. But preemtively. The moment viper shown his HCs it was too late, this was the moment that shifted the game direction.
I actually would even have prefered to see skirms over arbs.
He went Skirmisher though but Arbalest is better than Skirmisher against HC. Vinch had enough gold to go Kamayuk and Arbalest both. Vinch lost 3 games in a row due to basic mistakes.
But Lith got insane skirms and also BBC, thatās why I wouldnāt go full Gold there. I think itās too high risk. If Vinch had skirms at that moment it would have been enough and thatās all it needed.
But ok, I think also Arbs can work, itās just more all-in. (And Iām more the āon the safe sideā of player).
BTW still, kamayuk is important there. Itās just that kamayuk alone is a bit too one-dimensional against a civ with HC.
Regarding the 5th game it actually looks like Vinch is in full control. Letās hope he doesnāt throw it this time 
Vinch has huge advantage in this game as well. I am wondering will he manage to throw this game as before. It seems he won this game.
Vinch killed my AOE2 love with his over sloppy game play.
Elephants coming to vinch
Viper Champion
Nice tournament to end the year
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Viper proving he is still top tier.
I think he is number 1. Vinch on the other hand, should play with less mistake. He could win more match even win tournament if he didnāt throw 3 game in row.
After KOTD 4
What lefts to game balance is:
Chinese, Franks, Mayans and even Aztecs are still too strong on arabia and the first three need more nerfs, about aztecs the thing is unclear though.
Losing Blast Furnace and Thumb Ring never ever matter for Lithuanians and Vikings as they could end games before Imperial Age.
Sicilians are much much stronger in Arabia than some people could think, and the 100% fast building castles, first crusade 35 serjeants, and 6/8 armor cavaliers taking 50% less bonus damage and extra conversion resistance is objectively broken.
Tatars and Vietnamese are really fine on arabia, better than the stats want to show.
I also remind the game of Viper vs Liereyy final in Aoe2 champion tournament (hosted by Hera) last year. Viper win as Lithuanians HC against Celts (That was before the HC buff).
HC are actually great against Meso civs or some infantry civs.
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Well, in this tournament Sicilians had 45% win rate overall (29 games played), also you keep talking about knights having conversion resistance, but this is not true, unless you research First Crusade, which is never the case during most of Castle Age. So no, sorry, but it doesnāt seem objectively broken to me.
Stats from
Not sure if this account last games, but in the last direct elimination part Sicilians had 3 wins 3 losses, so they seem quite balanced, not overly strong, not weak.
Actually, I wonder how many games in this tournament featured fully upgraded Hauberk Cavaliers + First Crusade, do you have the number?
I donāt have the stats for that. But according to the stats I have only 40% of the time players actually reached imp and the average time in imp (when reached) was less than 9.5 minutes.
The average game had 3:44 minutes of Imp.
So not nearly enough time to fully utilize FU Hauberk Cavaliers.
I bet Sicilian knights were only carried by bonus damage resistance alone, not by Hauberk or First Crusade.
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Sicilians also have a very strong economy and that castle bonus. Both already decided games in their favor.
But they donāt seem to be oppressively strong, nothing indicates that.
Not the ban rate, not the pick rate, not the win rate. Theyāre viable and have different tools for different strategies at least for all castle age.
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Well I also didnāt expect them to dominate. But it seems they are a solid pick.
The thing I criticize in their design is that they are so insanely hard to counter when they are ahead.
The games is already snowbally enough even without that bonus damage reduction.
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This is true, but bear in mind all they have economically until castle age is 100 extra stone. So to be ahead they must be played very well on an open map, which is something that clearly The Viper can do, but the rest of usā¦not so sure.
However, I stated my concerns and proposals for the civ in other threads so I end this here. Have a good day.
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A bit late but my thoughts:
- Winchester played from his mind, really good performance
- Indians were much stronger than I thought, doI miss anything? Honestly the biggest surpriseā
- Tatars had (relatively) poor performance afair
- Vietnamese was pretty good as I argued
- Chinese Aztecs Franks Mayans still seemed pretty strong
- Byzantines actually felt like an upgraded Sicilians
- Last game of final showed how strong laming can be
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I feel like Vinchesterās Incas game was a throw not only with the castles, but also follow-up strategy.
Might he have had better success to tech into Siege Rams with Kamayuks (and maybe Archer support vs eventual HCs, as SR and Kamayuks would already eat up a lot of your food?), since Hand Cannons and Skirms simply tickle them?
It felt like Vinchester was just giving up on the trebs and castles while being in a really strong position, and even though Memb said it was the 5 monks lost to BBC, Iād say itās also the choices made strategically.
Overall though, I think Vinchester has proven that Incas arenāt really that bad of a civ though. Happy to see Kamayuks regardless!